Clutch Safety Switch Problem

[RJ Hamner 999]

This problem has been driving me a little nuts (well maybe a LOT nuts)

The idler arm is coming too far forward and overriding the the safety switch and when it does this it wont allow the arm to return.

I have tried varying the length of the rod from the pedal to the arm on the shaft (tried every position from all out to all in)

I even checked the set up on the other 416-8 (rolling parts locker) and set it up exactly like it but it still overrides the switch.

Picture !:  Switch without clutch pedal depressed

Picture 2:  Switch after clutch pedal has been depressed (note arm cannot return as it is blocked by the switch)

Picture 3:  Clutch rod where it is attached to the arm.

 

What am I doing wrong????

Any help will be GREATLY appreciated

[JoeM 7,660]

Belt to long? Maybe add on to the tang?

But I am a hydro guy!

Edited July 24, 2020 by TractorJunkie

[gwest_ca-(File Mod) 10,508]

You are almost out of threads on the clutch pedal rod so you are getting the maximum amount of travel when applied. Back the rod out of the trunion which will lower the pedal and reduce the distance the linkage can travel.

 

Garry

[wallfish 15,937]

Seems like the travel distance of the idler arm is too far.

Adjusting the brake band rod will catch and stop the travel of the pedal and idler arm when it gets tight on the drum. It can be a fine line between grabbing the brake and allowing the belt to clutch slip.

Adjust the brake band rod nut so it stops the idler arm from going over that switch. Then adjust the pedal rod for the position of the pedal.

Edited July 24, 2020 by wallfish

[953 nut 51,814]

1 hour ago, wallfish said:

Adjusting the brake band rod will catch and stop the travel of the pedal and idler arm when it gets tight on the drum. It can be a fine line between grabbing the brake and allowing the belt to clutch slip.

John, this is a 416-8 so the clutch and brake are independant.

13 hours ago, RJ Hamner said:

I have tried varying the length of the rod from the pedal to the arm on the shaft (tried every position from all out to all in)

I sort-of agree with what Garry said. If you move the trunion down to the lower hole the travel of the clutch arm will be reduced. Take a close look at your photo and you will see that it had been in the lower hole.

 

[RJ Hamner 999]

2 hours ago, gwest_ca said:

You are almost out of threads on the clutch pedal rod so you are getting the maximum amount of travel when applied. Back the rod out of the trunion which will lower the pedal and reduce the distance the linkage can travel.

 

Garry

Like I said in the post.    I have tried all lengths of the rod....long short and all positions in between. I even tried the lower hole but with the shock strut pushing back on the arm and the smaller arc of travel I had trouble even moving the pedal. That being said I may try that again and try moving the pedal with something other than my arm

Edited July 24, 2020 by RJ Hamner
Need to add more info

[RJ Hamner 999]

I tried the lower hole this morning. With the rod at all positions (full length, short as it goes and all positions in between with the same results. The arm still overrides the switch.  
I know it all worked correctly before and now that I have removed all the dirt, grease and plain old crud it doesn’t. Kind of boggles the mind.

The safety switch on my C160H is a rounded switch that is activated by the pedal itself. If I knew the pedals were identical I think I would remove the stock switch and install the type on the C160

[rmaynard 14,916]

If that is a flat idler, it looks like the belt is on the wrong side of it.

[RJ Hamner 999]

11 minutes ago, rmaynard said:

If that is a flat idler, it looks like the belt is on the wrong side of it.

It’s a grooved idler. 
wonder if there is a way to put a clamp or stop on the piston rod to limit the forward travel of the idler??

 I know that sounds like a “Mickey Mouse” fix but other than going to the type switch on the C160 I am open to suggestions 

[gwest_ca-(File Mod) 10,508]

Wonder if the spirol pin that secures the lever to the rod is sheared and allowing the rod to turn in the lever a bit? Depending how it broke I can see that happening.

Hold both sides at the same time and see if you  can twist it both ways.

 

Garry

[RJ Hamner 999]

19 minutes ago, gwest_ca said:

Wonder if the spirol pin that secures the lever to the rod is sheared and allowing the rod to turn in the lever a bit? Depending how it broke I can see that happening.

Hold both sides at the same time and see if you  can twist it both ways.

 

Garry

 

20 minutes ago, gwest_ca said:

Wonder if the spirol pin that secures the lever to the rod is sheared and allowing the rod to turn in the lever a bit? Depending how it broke I can see that happening.

Hold both sides at the same time and see if you  can twist it both ways.

 

Garry

Gary

Brand new pin but tried it anyway. It’s solid

 

Bob.   Dang double taps

[wallfish 15,937]

8 hours ago, 953 nut said:

John, this is a 416-8 so the clutch and brake are independant.

Yeah, thought of that after I left this morning, DOAH.

[Bill D 1,609]

You are missing the little tab that bolts to the frame.  This tab jams the belt between it and the clutch idler to stop the belt so you can shift without grinding gears.  I think I see it in the picture.  It looks to be mounted upside down or in the wrong spot.  Without it your clutch pedal will travel to far.  Bill

[Bill D 1,609]

Yep, it's the tab in the upper right corner of the picture.  It's mounted upside down.  The belt is supposed to ride over top of it.  The two ends are bent slightly downward.  Bill

[RJ Hamner 999]

2 hours ago, Bill D said:

Yep, it's the tab in the upper right corner of the picture.  It's mounted upside down.  The belt is supposed to ride over top of it.  The two ends are bent slightly downward.  Bill

Great eyes. Removed the offending part and mounted it in the correct position and..........It works like it is supposed to!!!

OUTSTANDING!

Now, repeat after me...”Bob is a dummy”

Thank You

Now that problem is taken care of......the switch quit working. If it ain’t one thing it’s another

Thanks again 

Bob

[Bill D 1,609]

Glad I could help.  I have had at least right 300/400 series 8 speeds over the last 10 years.  The switch is NLA from Toro, but is available on Amazon as a fridge door switch.  Be sure to get the normally open one.  Bill

Edited July 25, 2020 by Bill D

[RJ Hamner 999]

One from Amazon is on its way

[dalez 136]

10 hours ago, RJ Hamner said:

One from Amazon is on its way

Could you post a link to it. The only ones I saw that were normally open had a different shape to the housing.

 

Thanks

[RJ Hamner 999]

In the Amazon search block just type “Supco ES18805 Fan Switch”. I guess the new or revised part number is 7014651 because when the page opens the other number shows up.   They are $10.81 ea.

[Bill D 1,609]

Sounds like the right one.  There is a thread on here about using that switch to replace the NLA clutch switch.  Let us know how it works out.  Bill

[RJ Hamner 999]

51 minutes ago, Bill D said:

Sounds like the right one.  There is a thread on here about using that switch to replace the NLA clutch switch.  Let us know how it works out.  Bill

It is supposed to show sometime this week (the “expected delivery times” has been a little off lately)

As soon as it get here and I get it installed I’ll let you know

[johnnymag3 2,445]

This is my 4th week waiting for a coil....Its a 2 day delivery.....DONT HOLD YOUR BREATH

[RJ Hamner 999]

Well the switch is here and got it installed.

On the first try I got nothing.

Removed the switch and put it on the meter......it worked

Re-installed switch....nothing. 

Iam starting to get annoyed.

Went out and pulled the switch off my donor tractor. 

While doing this I noticed that the switch had been bypassed.

Now I'm wondering if this switch is bad???? 

Tested good.....What the heck

Then I notice that the original switch energizes at approx. the halfway point on closing.

Tried the new switch from Amazon and noticed it only energizes when fully closed.

The "fly in the ointment" is the flange on the arm will NOT fully close the switch.

I guess the only plus to this saga is......If the fan switch on the fridge ever goes bad, I'll have a spare

 

[rmaynard 14,916]

What year is this 416-8?

 

[RJ Hamner 999]

1 hour ago, rmaynard said:

What year is this 416-8?

 

Bob

Its a 1995

Edited July 29, 2020 by RJ Hamner
correction