A couple K181 questions.

[LengerichKA88 1,881]

Haven’t been doing too much, been down sick and busy with the holidays. The other day I fired up Hank just because he’d been sitting and I like the smell of exhaust. After running for a bit I noticed my negative cable was loose, so I shut it down and went to tighten the nut, that’s when I noticed the oil that had percolated out of the top. (See pictures). Is this indicative of a problem already present that I just haven’t noticed, or a foreshadowing of one about to happen? 

Also, in another thread that I’d come across, someone had mentioned that it sounded like the OP was running their engine higher than they should. Where should I be putting the throttle to put around the yard, when pushing snow, etc?  I’ve always left it at about 1/3rd, simply because I didn’t think it needed to sound like I was qualifying at the brick yard when I’m just going around the yard in 1. Rarely do I put it past 1/2.  Am I unintentionally causing undue stress the the engine? Is this what could be causing the oil to come out of the bolts? Any and all guidance is appreciated! 

[stevasaurus 22,230]

Kind of looks like your head gasket is leaking.  If that is all it is, it is an easy fix.  Check out this thread...  Gaskets are available on E-Bay. 

 

 

Your engine uses the splash method to lubricate it self.  You should be running it at 3/4 speed to get the oil splashing the way it is supposed to.  You may not have to run at 3/4 all the time, but you should run it a little when you got her out. 

[LengerichKA88 1,881]

I almost tagged you @stevasaurus along with a few others, but I figured if you saw it you’d say something lol. 

 

Granted, before I got into , I didn’t know much about how these things are supposed to be run, except how to put in the gas, engage the blades, and make it go... this little thing sounds like a Funny Car compared to the ones I’ve used before, and I’ve kept it low, honestly, because runnng it “high” (loud and hard) makes me nervous that I AM going to screw something up. I’ve always erred on the side of caution. I’ll do some reading and see about tackling the head gasket, fingers crossed that it’s a simple fix. 

 

So long as I run it “high” for a bit when I’ve got it going, I’m good to keep it low most of the time, correct? 

 

Heres what I usually do: get it running, let it sit for a minute or two, then I’ll rev it up a few times, then I’ll go about my business. I usually rev it a few times before putting it away as well. 

 

[clueless 2,898]

Looks like a bad head gasket. These old flatheads need to be run at 3/4 to full throttle, more oil getting to where it need to be and more air to keep it cooler. you engine is running hotter at half throttle than at full throttle not good. 

 

[SPINJIM 1,978]

  Blown head gasket.   Easy fix.   Be prepared to clean out some carbon buildup while you have the head off, and put 15 to 20 ft.lbs. torque on the head bolts when you reassemble.   Good luck.

    Jim

[clueless 2,898]

16 minutes ago, stevasaurus said:

Kind of looks like your head gasket is leaking.  If that is all it is, it is an easy fix.  Check out this thread...  Gaskets are available on E-Bay. 

 

 

Your engine uses the splash method to lubricate it self.  You should be running it at 3/4 speed to get the oil splashing the way it is supposed to.  You may not have to run at 3/4 all the time, but you should run it a little when you got her out. 

Anybody ever hear from Chuck (Save Old Iron) ? He just disappeared.

[stevasaurus 22,230]

I would not rev it up a few times when shutting it off...leaves extra gas sitting in places you do not want it to.  If you have been running it at 3/4, you just need to idle it down and shut it off.   

[LengerichKA88 1,881]

1 minute ago, clueless said:

Looks like a bad head gasket. These old flatheads need to be run at 3/4 to full throttle, more oil getting to where it need to be and more air to keep it cooler. you engine is running hotter at half throttle than at full throttle not good. 

 

Good to go, I’ll start running it higher. 

Like I said above, only reason I didn’t is because I was nervous about runnng it too hard for going so slow/just putzing around and didn’t want to wear it down/ break it having it opened up when not needed. 

That habit will be adjusted in the future. 

3 minutes ago, SPINJIM said:

  Blown head gasket.   Easy fix.   Be prepared to clean out some carbon buildup while you have the head off, and put 15 to 20 ft.lbs. torque on the head bolts when you reassemble.   Good luck.

    Jim

Thanks Jim! I’ll be doing some homework to make sure I do it right the first time 👍🏻

[LengerichKA88 1,881]

3 minutes ago, stevasaurus said:

I would not rev it up a few times when shutting it off...leaves extra gas sitting in places you do not want it to.  If you have been running it at 3/4, you just need to idle it down and shut it off.   

Didn’t think of that.... honestly the only reason I do it when I park it is because the little boy in me likes the way it sounds 🤷🏻‍♂️😂

I won’t be doing that anymore either. This is why I came to the fount of knowledge 

Edited December 30, 2018 by KyleLengerich

[stevasaurus 22,230]

Kyle...be sure to take a look in the reference section / engines.  More threads in there to help.

 

https://www.wheelhorseforum.com/forum/145-engines/

[KC9KAS 4,741]

Also...on hydro tractors, you need to run the throttle almost Wide Open Throttle all the time so the hydro fan cools the hydro like it should.

[LengerichKA88 1,881]

Thanks Steve, I’ll be adding some of these to my homework list I’m sure. 

 

2 minutes ago, KC9KAS said:

Also...on hydro tractors, you need to run the throttle almost Wide Open Throttle all the time so the hydro fan cools the hydro like it should.

This ones sitting on a 3speed, BUT! That’s good to know for my Charger 10, because the few times I’ve had it moving I’ve treated it the same way, now I not only know not to do that, but why. Thanks!

[clueless 2,898]

45 minutes ago, KyleLengerich said:

Good to go, I’ll start running it higher. 

Like I said above, only reason I didn’t is because I was nervous about runnng it too hard for going so slow/just putzing around and didn’t want to wear it down/ break it having it opened up when not needed. 

That habit will be adjusted in the future. 

Thanks Jim! I’ll be doing some homework to make sure I do it right the first time 👍🏻

An engines life blood is oil, it needs to stay cool, in a water cooled engine the water keeps the engine cool which keep the oil cooled. Our air cooled engine need air to keep the engine cool, the more cool air blowing around the engine the cooler the oil, the faster the engine turns the more air is blown over it. I know this is probably basic stuff but it's worth bring up now and then, besides it's been raining for four days and I'm board. An old WH mechanic ( before they were called Technicians) told me years ago the worst thing you can do to an air cooled engine is run it a low RPM, he told me to run my first wheel horse, it had a K181, at at least 3/4 throttle, and at full throttle if I was using any type of attachment. Been doing that ever since. Now where did I put my coffee .

[LengerichKA88 1,881]

1 minute ago, clueless said:

 I know this is probably basic stuff but it's worth bring up now and then

Sometimes we get too caught up in intricacies/details and overlook/forget the basics. 

2 minutes ago, clueless said:

besides it's been raining for four days and I'm board

 

oak, poplar, pine...? 😂

 

ill start running it open... but until I do some reading and have a game plan, I’m gunna park it. Don’t want to cause any other issues and/or make more work for myself. 

[stevasaurus 22,230]

You want to fix that gasket.  You are losing compression and the gap will get bigger if you run it.  Go on E-Bay order the gasket for a K-181...either Stens of Kohler.  The Stens is cheaper but fine to use.   Get a piece of glass and some wet dry paper.  It only takes about an afternoon and you are taking it around the block and re-torqueing the bolts. 

[953 nut 51,721]

I noticed the tins from the top of the head and cylinder are missing. I presume that was done to take the pictures. It is important to have them in place for cooling.

5 minutes ago, stevasaurus said:

re-torqueing the bolts.

This is very important, once the engine has been brought up to operating temperature the head bolts need to be hot torqued, same sequence and same torque setting.

[moe1965 718]

Torque sequence for 181 head gasket

[LengerichKA88 1,881]

14 hours ago, stevasaurus said:

You want to fix that gasket.  You are losing compression and the gap will get bigger if you run it.  Go on E-Bay order the gasket for a K-181...either Stens of Kohler.  The Stens is cheaper but fine to use.   Get a piece of glass and some wet dry paper.  It only takes about an afternoon and you are taking it around the block and re-torqueing the bolts. 

Going to get one ordered today. 

Hes benched until then, should be here Friday 

 

14 hours ago, 953 nut said:

I noticed the tins from the top of the head and cylinder are missing. I presume that was done to take the pictures. It is important to have them in place for cooling.

This is very important, once the engine has been brought up to operating temperature the head bolts need to be hot torqued, same sequence and same torque setting.

The way it’s pictured is the way we got it. Aside from the flywheel cover there aren’t any other tins. 

Could that have helped excelerate the problem? Any idea where to find quality replacements? 

Edited December 31, 2018 by KyleLengerich

[rjg854 10,742]

place a wanted ad, A-Z tractor, E-bay, I'm sure you can find tins relatively easy

[clueless 2,898]

If you've been ruining it with out those tin especially at low RPM, you've probably cooked your oil. When the oil gets really hot it get thin, probably why it's blowing out of  the head and up through the head bolts. You going to need to get those tin covers and replace the head gasket, and definitely check the head to see if it's warped. Put fresh oil in once you get it back together, run it a little at at least 3/4 throttle, then retorque  the head bolts and change the oil again 

[LengerichKA88 1,881]

Just like everything else around here: it’s my fault 😂

 

ive got feelers out for a set of engine tins, and the new gasket should be in the mail by COB today. It’s not going anywhere until everything’s done. 

 

When I originally posted, I figured it was a blown head gasket, but wanted to make sure I was right... I’m glad I did because I didn’t realize I was missing the tins, or that they served a purpose beyond asthetics.  Or that I was slowly killing the engine by running it the way I was. 

I wonder if I’ve been sitting on it wrong too? 😂

 

Everything that pops up with these things is new territory for me, which is why I tend to ask such basic and redundant questions, but the nice thing about RS is I don’t get basic answers from you guys, and I appreciate that. 

[stevasaurus 22,230]

I see you have kept a clear path to the refrigerator.  Very smart. 

[LengerichKA88 1,881]

4 minutes ago, stevasaurus said:

I see you have kept a clear path to the refrigerator.  Very smart. 

You can’t see it, but that's because our little grocery getter  (Chevy HHR) is parked there. That’s our “get the car seat out” buffer zone 

 

Getting 2 families worth of stuff in a 1 family home gets a little cramped at times 😂. 

[clueless 2,898]

Kyle, not your fault, just lack of information. The stuff I've told you I learned from others, that's what so great about this site, nobody's judging, just trying to help. I'm always asking questions and always learning something. Hang in there my brother, you'll get it working right, if not there is always next year,   oh wait that's tomorrow .   

[The Tuul Crib 7,332]

19 minutes ago, clueless said:

Kyle, not your fault, just lack of information. The stuff I've told you I learned from others, that's what so great about this site, nobody's judging, just trying to help. I'm always asking questions and always learning something. Hang in there my brother, you'll get it working right, if not there is always next year,   oh wait that's tomorrow .   

you got that right!!