Vanguard swap?

[Wayne0 1,574]

My Workhorse 1800 seems to have given up the ghost.This is my worker, and it works hard. Hard starting, back fires out the exhaust when trying to start, when it starts. Not into a rebuild. (I do know it ran out of oil once)

Thinking of a Vanguard swap. How easy? or not. I know someone here has done it.

Edited May 29 by Wayne0

[squonk 47,419]

@kpinnc

[kpinnc 18,753]

1 hour ago, Wayne0 said:

Thinking of a Vanguard swap. How easy? or not. I know someone here has done it.

 

Several of us have done this swap. And Vanguard 12.5 to 23 hp horizontal shaft engines are all very similar. 

 

Electrical- since your WorkHorse had magneto ignition the wiring is easy. Vanguards are magneto ignition so no changes there. 

 

Mechanical- check the PTO shaft on your engine. It should be 1 inch diameter and about 3 inches long. Again, exactly the same as a Vanguard. Also the PTO brackets bolt right up on a Vanguard. 

 

Engine mounting- This is primarily the part you'll need to do some work. I had to fabricate a mount plate to raise the engine about 1 inch higher and the bolt pattern is not the same. In short you will need to fab up an adapter but it is a simple job. The complexity is really up to you and what you can make up. 

 

Flip through the threads below and there are pics of some of mine. Hopefully others will chime in as well. 

 

523-H build

 

Another Fronkenstein

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Wayne0 1,574]

@kpinnc

Thanks for that info!

Now I have to find one and I don't know the the text is red!

Edited May 29 by Wayne0

[ebinmaine 79,714]

14 hours ago, kpinnc said:

Engine mounting- This is primarily the part you'll need to do some work. I had to fabricate a mount plate to raise the engine about 1 inch higher and the bolt pattern is not the same. In short you will need to fab up an adapter but it is a simple job. The complexity is really up to you and what you can make up. 

 

The mount needs to be a solid top plate per the Briggs manual. Just a stack of washers or a set of 4 spacers won't support the aluminum block well enough.  

 

 

[kpinnc 18,753]

4 hours ago, ebinmaine said:

The mount needs to be a solid top plate per the Briggs manual. Just a stack of washers or a set of 4 spacers won't support the aluminum block well enough.  

 

This is true. Thanks for the reminder! 

[Wayne0 1,574]

I think I may have jumped the gun on this. Once it starts it runs fine. It might be a simple fuel problem. I'll clean the carb and see what happens.

[ebinmaine 79,714]

1 minute ago, Wayne0 said:

I think I may have jumped the gun on this. Once it starts it runs fine. It might be a simple fuel problem. I'll clean the carb and see what happens.

 

Clean the fuel pump too.  Those are a known issue.  

[Wayne0 1,574]

4 hours ago, ebinmaine said:

 

Clean the fuel pump too.  Those are a known issue.  

I have a Carbole to put on it.

[peter lena 9,948]

@ WayneO , harbour freight has them in stock , been using  carbole  low pressure  2 - 3,5 PSI  pumps for years , no issues at all .  have many hours on n them , makes for a good swap ,  been using valvoline vr1  10-30  oil  , after this winter , cold start  spin up was ridiculously  fast  smooth / easy , regularly  experiment  with  ideas , love a repetitive problem  ? dissect it  make it better / eliminate it . good project , pete 

[sqrlgtr 3,284]

25 minutes ago, peter lena said:

valvoline vr1 

Ive been running this in my VW buggy and really like it. I think it's hard to beat in a soild lifter motor. I would run it in my Kohlers to, but the Rotella 30wt is just easier for me to find. The Valvoline has a little more zinc in it than the Rotella.

[peter lena 9,948]

@sqrlgtr  thanks for the reply , been adding rislone zinc to my engines for years , on rotella , bottle spec , 4 oz for 2 qts , the varnish  cutting  effect of zinc , really  helps clean up and break down deposits , none of my engines smoke  or use oil . get mine at walmart , my engines really feel  free and easy running , like trying  things , always make it  function easier . engines , are very happy  at their work , pete  

[Bill D 2,990]

9 hours ago, Wayne0 said:

I think I may have jumped the gun on this. Once it starts it runs fine. It might be a simple fuel problem. I'll clean the carb and see what happens.

The fuel pump is built into the carb on those engines, if it's original.   Some variations from Craftsman tractors used a carb without an integrated fuel pump.  Electric external fuel pumps won't work. 

 

Rebuild the carb and fuel pump.  New fuel line and filter and see what happens.

 

Backfiring could be caused by bad plugs or a coil that's failing. 

Edited June 1 by Bill D

[kpinnc 18,753]

29 minutes ago, Bill D said:

Backfiring could be caused by bad plugs or a coil that's failing. 

 

Or a many years old muffler with alot of carbon buildup in it. 

 

5 hours ago, Wayne0 said:

I have a Carbole to put on it.

 

I have 4 tractors with these on them. They all work well!

 

As a matter of fact, Vanguards can get twitchy with a pulse pump. Using an electric on them is much better. Just food for thought if you go that route. 

[Wayne0 1,574]

12 hours ago, Bill D said:

The fuel pump is built into the carb on those engines, if it's original.   Some variations from Craftsman tractors used a carb without an integrated fuel pump.  Electric external fuel pumps won't work. 

 

Rebuild the carb and fuel pump.  New fuel line and filter and see what happens.

 

Backfiring could be caused by bad plugs or a coil that's failing. 

I rebuilt the pump about 15 years ago, so I'm sure it could use it again. If I can't use the electric pump on the Briggs, I'll put it on the 520H.

Edited June 1 by Wayne0

[Bill D 2,990]

1 hour ago, Wayne0 said:

I rebuilt the pump about 15 years ago, so I'm sure it could use it again. If I can't use the electric pump on the Briggs, I'll put it on the 520H.

Was it damp out the day it was backfiring?  I've seen leaking plug wires cause issues.  The way they are routed on the Briggs makes this even more likely to cause problems if they are old.

[Wayne0 1,574]

8 hours ago, Bill D said:

Was it damp out the day it was backfiring?  I've seen leaking plug wires cause issues.  The way they are routed on the Briggs makes this even more likely to cause problems if they are old.

Thanks, it wasn't damp but I'll check those too.