squonk 39,238 #26 Posted February 11 (edited) That crank is begging to get double checked at a machine shop for out of round. What are you checking the clearance with anyway? Edited February 11 by squonk 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WHX?? 47,101 #27 Posted February 11 (edited) P 20 minutes ago, squonk said: What are you checking the clearance with anyway? @Pullstart 's eyeball micrometer lol. A vernier calipers ... I know Sqounky but it gets me in the neighborhood and Dan and I got a buddy that does QA at a machine shop and has a set of measuring sticks that is to die for. The mains slid off the crank way to easy for my liking so those will checked too. Edited February 11 by WHX?? 4 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Achto 26,758 #28 Posted February 11 10 minutes ago, WHX?? said: Dan and I got a buddy that does QA at a machine shop and has a set of measuring sticks that is to die for. Just don't understand why he gets so upset when I use those fancy C-clamp thingy's to hold parts together when I'm weldin'. 1 5 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WHX?? 47,101 #29 Posted February 11 (edited) He'd had them here Dan I woulda used them to clamp n weld my nuts on my studlies... you know how much he likes my nuts... Edited February 11 by WHX?? 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WHX?? 47,101 #30 Posted February 11 Inside joke fellas ... couple a weeks ago our buddy found my stash... Dan says Jim Joel has got your nuts in his mouth... I'm still laughing! 5 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
squonk 39,238 #31 Posted February 11 When it comes to crank clearance, calipers get you in the neighborhood like driving to the Bronx and ending up in Jersey 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rmaynard 14,970 #32 Posted February 11 16 hours ago, WHX?? said: Geez you didn't say that when you was suckin down our apple cobbler... That was some smooth stuff 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sailman 1,143 #33 Posted February 11 Not to hijack this thread...but it is very helpful to me as I make the first attempt at the internals of my k-161. How do you use the plastigage? I will plan to take the engine to a machine shop to check bore and crankshaft tolerances once I see whats inside. 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sailman 1,143 #34 Posted February 11 13 hours ago, WHX?? said: What I would suggest is pop the head off first. If I recollect right you suspect a broken rod? If that is indeed the case the piston can then come out the top end. Yes start a thread and follow disassembling in the manual to the letter. Take plenty of pics. One more question. How would I pull the piston out from the top? Not sure how to get a hold of it. Super small toilet plunger? Wouldn't I need to use something from the bottom to push it out? Thanks! 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rick3478 380 #35 Posted February 11 I'm surprised no one mentioned ridge reamer, do y'all not do that? In this case it looks like the motor may have been recently rebuilt incorrectly, so maybe it's not an issue, but I'd check the *entire* bore and everything else with a suspicious eye. If the previous "mechanic" put a rod in backwards, there's no telling what else may be fouled up. In the case of the rod, that looks like the beginning of galling and I'd just replace it, but what does the crank look like? If it has any aluminum fused onto the journal, that will need to be removed, then measure and polish. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WHX?? 47,101 #36 Posted February 12 10 hours ago, Sailman said: Not to hijack this thread...but it is very helpful to me as I make the first attempt at the internals of my k-161. How do you use the plastigage? I will plan to take the engine to a machine shop to check bore and crankshaft tolerances once I see whats inside. Hijack away Saildude. It's all about rebuilding engines. I'll let @ri702bill fill you in on the specifics of plastigage but it's a easy task to grasp. You may not even have to worry about it your rod is cooked. The machine shop will check the dims of the crank journal to see what replacement rod is required and fit (grind) the crank to the new rod if required. The only way to remove the piston/rod is to tap it out the top end using a wood dowel. 2 hours ago, Rick3478 said: no one mentioned ridge reamer, do y'all not do that? Good point Rick. Many times ther is a carbon build up at the very top of the bore. Where the rings don't reach. There is a tool called a ridge reamer that removes it as it can cause the rings to bind ther in pushing the piston out. I don't have that tool I just use emery cloth to remove it if needed. 2 hours ago, Rick3478 said: . If the previous "mechanic" put a rod in backwards, there's no telling what else may be fouled up. This is why this particular motor got knocked down to parade rest. Quite obvious someone has been in this motor before. Now I know why. PO threw a rod by some welding on the block. Looks like he wanted it to happen again. Pic at halftime. 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WHX?? 47,101 #37 Posted February 12 10 hours ago, Sailman said: Not to hijack this thread...but it is very helpful to me as I make the first attempt at the internals of my k-161. How do you use the plastigage? I will plan to take the engine to a machine shop to check bore and crankshaft tolerances once I see whats inside. Hijack away Saildude. It's all about rebuilding engines. I'll let @ri702bill fill you in on the specifics of plastigage but it's a easy task to grasp. You may not even have to worry about it your rod is cooked. The machine shop will check the dims of the crank journal to see what replacement rod is required and fit (grind) the crank to the new rod if required. The only way to remove the piston/rod is to tap it out the top end using a wood dowel. 2 hours ago, Rick3478 said: no one mentioned ridge reamer, do y'all not do that? Good point Rick. Many times ther is a carbon build up at the very top of the bore. Where the rings don't reach. There is a tool called a ridge reamer that removes it as it can cause the rings to bind ther in pushing the piston out. I don't have that tool I just use emery cloth to remove it if needed. 2 hours ago, Rick3478 said: . If the previous "mechanic" put a rod in backwards, there's no telling what else may be fouled up. This is why this particular motor got knocked down to parade rest. Quite obvious someone has been in this motor before. Now I know why. PO threw a rod by some welding on the block. Looks like he wanted it to happen again. Pic at halftime. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ri702bill 7,487 #38 Posted February 12 Is this a "Groundhog Day" thing??? Plastigage is a product used to check tight fit mechanical clearances WITHOUT using any other measuring device. It tells a more truthful story than the response from a teenager as to how the quarter panel on Mom's car got damaged!! Now, onto serious. It comes in two different styles - Green to check clearances from .0005 to .002, and Red for .002 to .004. (I may have the colors backwards...) Desired Rod Cap clearance is under .002, so we use the green. It comes in a paper sleeve, and looks like dental floss. The rod and cap must be CLEAN and NO oil. Cut a strip as wide as the cap, place it inline with the journal under the center of where the cap would go. Assemble the rod and cap, torque the rod bolts to spec - being careful NOT to rotate the crank or rod. Unbolt and remove the cap - the squished material SHOULD be left on the crank, not the cap. What you want is a consistant strip flattened across either one. The sleeve had a graduated width "Gage" printed on it. Narrowest gage is .0005, next .0010, and so on Each has the corresponding number. check the squished portion against the gage, find the one that most resembles it. That is your number. Best case - the squished material is consistant in width across the journal and gives a reading on the lower end of acceptable clearance........ Remove the used Plastigage and either continue building, or start ordering parts. 1 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WHX?? 47,101 #39 Posted February 12 (edited) What no running out to the shop to get pics Bill? You may be off @Racinbobs Christmas card list. Good tutorial tho. I will at halftime. Edited February 12 by WHX?? 5 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WHX?? 47,101 #40 Posted February 12 @Sparky... clean up aisle 2 Mike... quadruple post... 4 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sparky-(Admin) 19,716 #41 Posted February 12 18 minutes ago, WHX?? said: @Sparky... clean up aisle 2 Mike... quadruple post... You’re all set 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JCM 8,688 #42 Posted February 12 (edited) Okay @WHX?? , it's half time. In Maine anyway. Edited February 12 by JCM 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WHX?? 47,101 #43 Posted February 12 (edited) 10 minutes ago, Sparky said: You’re all set Thank you Sparky... I got all Swiftied and hammered on the submit key too much... So this is what Bill was talking about Sailman...any auto parts will have them. The green ones pretty much fit our applications. Once you get them flattened out you use the gauge on the last pic holding it against the flattened out piece to get the clearance. I do it in three or four spots with the crank in different positions. Like Bill said do not let the crank rotate. Edited February 12 by WHX?? Ad 2 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WHX?? 47,101 #45 Posted February 12 Thank you Squonky... BTW my QA man came up with the same dims as me using a vernier... 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WHX?? 47,101 #46 Posted February 12 15 minutes ago, JCM said: Okay @WHX?? , it's half time. Are you telling me my cocktail needs refreshing Plunge? 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WHX?? 47,101 #47 Posted February 12 (edited) So I didn't realize this 'till I started cleaning the block. Only thing that have coulda done this is a blown rod. When a rod goes Sailman it will do two things but possibly more. 1 Bust the cam up. 2 Ventilate the block. Most often on the side of the cam but all bets are off ther. Looks for the skid marks ... no not like the ones in Sqounkies skivvies... on the inside of the block. This is all assuming you do have a rod issue. Pull it apart and let's have a look see. Get that phone cam a clicking. Nice thing about today's tech is you can easily delete the ones where your thumbs are in the way. Don't do with greasy hands tho ... Second pic cam side ... lousy pic but you can see the crack just below the hole. Whoever welded it back up did a fairly decent job. Edited February 12 by WHX?? Pics 1 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WHX?? 47,101 #48 Posted February 12 (edited) BTW Dan I did find STD re-ring kits ... no Sqounky not the STD you have...quit hanging out in Jersey or the Bronx ...for a really good price on Fleabay. Not much going on out there for 10 20 30 over kits out there tho. All aftermarket of course.. You may be right on over stuff for small blocks becoming scarce. Edited February 12 by WHX?? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
953 nut 52,361 #49 Posted February 12 12 hours ago, Sailman said: One more question. How would I pull the piston out from the top? Not sure how to get a hold of it. Super small toilet plunger? Wouldn't I need to use something from the bottom to push it out? Thanks! @prondzy did a great thread on engine rebuilding a few years back, look it over. 1 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WHX?? 47,101 #50 Posted February 12 Thank you again Richard. I failed to find that thread. What it doesn't mention in that thread is I suck at math what with having ony nine toes and four fingers... don't listen to me. Only hope that this all helps you Sailman into your first foray of engine work. 1 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
