Lift bar and spindle grease fitting

[thehorse 221]

Just wondering if anyone else has had a similar issue. My lift arm in my 314-8 is aligned  perfectly with the middle spindle and grease fitting on the 48” deck. The fitting gets sheared/smashed and the lift arm is actually notched. 🤔

[pfrederi 17,128]

Very common issue.  I take the fitting out and put  a small pug in the hole. PIA have to pull the deck out put zerk in to grease.  Pre tachmatic decks had a much better system.  WH took a step backwards here.

[thehorse 221]

Ok....

PIA is an understatement. 
at least they didn’t just go with a sealed unit. It just amazes me how the lift bar gets notched out!

[Jeff-C175 7,195]

As many may remember I rebuilt my 48" deck at the start of this mowing season.

 

I went to give the spindles a shot of grease this morning before I mowed and discovered that the center zerk was GONE!  WTH?

 

Visual exam revealed exactly the same as the OP symptoms, the lift bar had hit the zerk and I presume it loosened and waggled around in the hole for a while because the threads are all buggered up now.

 

I can't get another zerk threaded, let alone a plug, so it will need to be retapped, but the problem is that the hole is now too big to tap.  This sucks, brand new spindle all messed up.

 

My big question is how did this happen?  The old spindles did not have this problem!  They're the same height!  Why do the new spindles have this issue?  There must be some way to adjust something so the lift bar doesn't hit the zerk!

 

I don't know how I'm going to fix this, open to any and all suggestions!

 

I really don't want to have to deal with removing a plug and installing a zerk every time I need to grease the spindles.  I'd much rather figure out why after 40 years this is happening!

Edited August 1, 2021 by Jeff-C175

[c-series don 7,772]

I have several decks this has happened to, I’m glad I’m not alone. I have one of those needle pin attachment things for my grease guns and was going to try to shoot grease directly into the center spindle. Only one of very few designs that didn’t work out so good. In the attachment process I believe that the center grease zerk  can be knocked off. 

[Jeff-C175 7,195]

2 hours ago, c-series don said:

In the attachment process I believe that the center grease zerk  can be knocked off. 

 

Sure it's possible when attaching the deck but this issue occurred after the deck was mounted.  The lift arm has a notch worn into it where it was rubbing on the zerk.

 

I just don't understand why it was FINE before the new spindles were installed!

 

Tomorrow I'm going to loosen the bolts on the lift frame brackets and see if there's enough play to move the frame over enough that it clears the zerk.

 

I still don't have a plan on how I'm going to repair the threads in the sindle shaft though.

[Lee1977 6,211]

Just go with sealed bearings in the center spindle and install a fine thread 1/4" set screw. Some of the later model have a hole in the lift bar pin for a clip pin to hold it away from the grease fitting. 

I don't know for sure if it works as I have never used the clip pin with my newer horses. can't get to it to grease with the deck on so it doesn't get grease until the deck comes off. Back when I bought

my first Wheel Horse I could remove the deck in about 5 minuets, 44 years later I struggle to get it off in 30 minuets. Then getting it back on takes longer.

[Jeff-C175 7,195]

22 minutes ago, Lee1977 said:

Just go with sealed bearings in the center spindle and install a fine thread 1/4" set screw. Some of the later model have a hole in the lift bar pin for a clip pin to hold it away from the grease fitting. 

I don't know for sure if it works as I have never used the clip pin with my newer horses. can't get to it to grease with the deck on so it doesn't get grease until the deck comes off. Back when I bought

my first Wheel Horse I could remove the deck in about 5 minuets, 44 years later I struggle to get it off in 30 minuets. Then getting it back on takes longer.

 

Thanks Lee,  I'm not keen on rebuilding a brand new spindle with new bearings, so that's out for me.

 

I'm going to take a close look to see if I can figure out a way to install a clip or pin to hold the lift arm away, thanks for that tip, but there's a lot of movement under there when mowing so I'm not sure if that will work or not.  If someone has photos of that I would like to see them.  Maybe a newer deck manual would show that?

 

I'll see if I can get some pics of the damaged spindle today.  It's not simply going to be a quick re-tapping job,  the threads are gone and the hole is enlarged.  I'm thinking I may have to go up a size on the zerk fitting threads, drill out and re-tap.

 

Your experience with the remove / install time reminds me a little bit about my old heating boiler which I replaced several years ago after 40 years of service.  It was a major PITA to clean that boiler even when new, but I swear that each year that clean out door got smaller and closer to the floor!  (The new one is a piece of cake to clean and the main reason I chose it)

[Lee1977 6,211]

Here is your picture. Went down to see if I could get one. It pulls it over tight to the deck don't see how it could bet back to the grease fitting. 

Might need a larger diameter pin, that all had to see it it works. My larger pins are all for hitch pins and I don't thing they would go through the hole.

 

[rick 215]

A washer is how I fixed mine, it works!  Might use two washers, I have to push the arm away a little to push the fitting on...

 

[Jeff-C175 7,195]

4 hours ago, Lee1977 said:

through the hole

 

Thanks Lee, very excellent picture!

 

Was the hole already in the rod?  I'll have to look and see if mine has a hole already.  If not, It's going to be a royal pita drilling that under the tractor, but not impossible.

 

Where did you place the washers Rick?

@rick

[Lee1977 6,211]

5 hours ago, Jeff-C175 said:

 

Thanks Lee, very excellent picture!

 

Was the hole already in the rod?  I'll have to look and see if mine has a hole already.  If not, It's going to be a royal pita drilling that under the tractor, but not impossible.

 

Where did you place the washers Rick?

@rick

That one is on my 1989 520  Not the original lift bar as it was broken. That bar came off my 312 of unknow year. 

 

 

 

[Jeff-C175 7,195]

On 8/1/2021 at 11:05 AM, Jeff-C175 said:

pics of the damaged spindle

 

 

Note how the top 1/4" of threads are GONE and wallowed out too large to tap, but that the threads continue down much farther.

 

I was hoping to be able to find a 1/4" thread zerk with a longer part of the threaded end but not sticking up farther on top but so far no luck with that.  If I could find a regular little zerk with 1/2" of threads I could just chase the hole with a tap and be back in business. 

 

From what I've determined, the 1/4" zerks are 1/4-28 STRAIGHT thread, is that correct?

 

I believe that the larger 1/8" threads are NPT, is that also correct?  I really don't want to drill out and retap to the larger size but if I gotta, I gotta.

 

[Jeff-C175 7,195]

On 4/18/2021 at 11:12 AM, thehorse said:

amazes me how the lift bar gets notched out!

 

Looking closely at your pic, it appears that is a 'man made' notch!  That was one of my ideas for a cure.  I might still do it if it looks like it would help.

 

On 8/3/2021 at 11:36 AM, Jeff-C175 said:

the top 1/4" of threads are GONE and wallowed out too large to tap

 

I ran a tap down, and was able to thread in a new zerk.  It's not grabbing many threads but feels enough to hold it.  I'm going to add some Loctite and it should be good.

 

Going to refit the deck and see if the washer and clip will keep the arm away from the zerk.

 

[mrc 724]

i do what lee1977 has pictured with a BIG flat washer and clip . you may have to drill the lift bar as not all wh's had the hole for the clip. easy to do.  you may also have to add 2or 3 washer/shims to stop the side to side play. once you do this it is still a close fit but, the center zerk should survive. works for me. 

regards mike in mass.

[Jeff-C175 7,195]

2 hours ago, mrc said:

easy to do

 

Depends on how young/old you are!  Wasn't too bad though, hangs down low enough to be able to get access to it.   It's a bit of an awkward position is the only problem really, but I've been in worse positions than that!  

 

I just did that on mine and posted in this other thread about what else I did.

 

Here's what I posted there ...

 

Quote

I did a number of things,

 

First, I had to chase the threads with a tap and there were just enough left that I was able to install a new fitting.  I used some blue Loctite to be safe.

 

I then loosened the four brackets that hold the lift frame to the deck and being there was some play was able to move it over about a quarter inch.

 

Next, and most helpful was drilling through the half inch rod on the lift arm and installing a washer and hitch pin to prevent the lift arm from getting close to the grease zerk during operation.

 

Finally, I ground about a quarter inch off the bottom leading edge of the lift arm.

 

After reinstalling the deck and checking up/down at all cutting heights it appears that there is now sufficient clearance to prevent a recurrence.  I'm still pretty nervous about it though.

 

One caution though!  Be VEWY VEWY CAREFUL when sliding the deck under the machine!  If the lift arm is all the way down it would be very easy to accidentally break a zerk off!  I suggest raising the lift before sliding the deck under, then when it's under and centered, lower the arm and continue the rest of the hookups.

 

There's a weirdness to this that I haven't figured out...  I've had this deck for over 30 years and not once has this been a problem until I rebuilt the deck this Spring.  I don't know what is different!

 

Edited August 9, 2021 by Jeff-C175

[squonk 38,844]

I've never had this issue. I even have a 90 deg. grease fitting in the spindle which sticks up higher than the regular zerk.

[Jeff-C175 7,195]

43 minutes ago, squonk said:

I've never had this issue

 

I believe you are in the vast majority.  As I said before, mine was fine until I rebuilt it this year!  I don't see ANYthing that has changed during the rebuild.  The spindles are exactly the same height.  The lift arm isn't terribly worn at the bushings, but even if it were, the change came about when I rebuilt the deck... so I HAD to have done something differently... but I don't know what.  The only thing I can think of is that little bit of 'play' in assembling the lift frame.  I was able to move those brackets about a quarter inch or so and that actually let the lift arm clear the top of the spindle but I went ahead and drilled and pinned the rod anyway, as extra peace of mind.

 

[rick 215]

I put the washers on after the lift pin goes through through hole in the lift bar on the deck. 

It pulls the lift arm through  farther and keeps it off the zerk.

[Jeff-C175 7,195]

5 minutes ago, rick said:

I put the washers on after the lift pin goes through through hole in the lift bar on the deck. 

It pulls the lift arm through  farther and keeps it off the zerk.

 

Thanks Rick.  I did of course put a big washer between the pin and the lift bar.  I drilled the hole close enough to the bar so that I only needed one washer to keep it away from the zerk.

 

Haven't mowed with it yet though!  I pushed and pulled the deck in all directions and cutting heights, I don't think it's going to hit anymore, but I'm still nervous about it!