Yet another governor question- K161

[Greentored 3,220]

Yeah yeah, I know this subject has been beat to death, resurrected, answered and beat again, but this is a bit unique....I think?

On these smaller K series, the flyweights act against/overcome the torsion spring for proper function, correct? On my little 701, there is no way the governor will provide enough pressure to overcome that spring and control things. 

The 'flag' is intact on the governor shaft, and when running the throttle by hand, the arm DOES provide force when revved up, but nowhere near what would be necessary to move that spring. Everything is adjusted correctly by the book. If the spring were a solid link, thats basically the function I have.

Am I missing something here? Do the governor gears ever stick, or perhaps throw only one of the two flyweights, therefore being functional but at 50% of the required force? Gosh I hope I don't have to open this little booger up, she is a little 'puffy' but runs SO nice!

Thanks in advance!

[rmaynard 16,293]

2 hours ago, Greentored said:

Gosh I hope I don't have to open this little booger up, she is a little 'puffy' but runs SO nice!

 

So if your tractor is running "nice", I assume the governor is working correctly? What am I missing?

 

 

[stevasaurus 23,277]

If you think you have to take it apart, the governor is the last thing to come out...just sayin'.  Those weights just fall in and out.  Check out these pictures from a K-181.  I think it is the same as your K-161.

 

 

 

 

[Greentored 3,220]

5 hours ago, rmaynard said:

 

So if your tractor is running "nice", I assume the governor is working correctly? What am I missing?

 

 

It runs nice. It would run a lot better if the governor functioned correctly. Really hope I dont have to go into it- guaranteed pandoras box when I get in there......

[stevasaurus 23,277]

How about a picture of the setup and spring??

 

[wallfish 18,087]

18 minutes ago, stevasaurus said:

How about a picture of the setup and spring??

 

Exactly

I'm guessing something ain't set up right with the spring

[Greentored 3,220]

Really appreciate the help fellas, here ya go:

[oldredrider 2,553]

It appears in the 1st pic, your disc is broken at the bottom. Nothing there to hold the governor arm spring in position.

[rmaynard 16,293]

This is what the disc should look like. The arrow points to what appears to be missing on yours

 

 

Edited December 24, 2020 by rmaynard

[oilwell1415 563]

^^^What he said.

[Greentored 3,220]

Terrible pic angle. Its there and spring is located correctly in tabs.

[stevasaurus 23,277]

One thing I notice...your throttle cable is in a hole in the ring itself.  Do you have the angled tab like in Maynard's picture??  Looks like this.  And shouldn't the spring be attached under that screw.

 

[rmaynard 16,293]

So, assuming that you have everything connected correctly, there is a way to view inside without doing a deep dive. In the picture below courtesty of @stevasaurus the arrow points to the back side of a Welch plug. The next image is the front side of that plug.

 

 

 

You can pry that out and view the governor gear and fly weights.

 

 

It's a tight view through that hole and around the governor shaft, but you will be able to see if anything is missing.

[stevasaurus 23,277]

Excellent Bob...thanks  and Merry Christmas Mate.  

[wallfish 18,087]

10 hours ago, rmaynard said:

The arrow points to what appears to be missing on yours

Weird, I thought the same exact thing and obviously others did as well. I stared at that pic for a while trying to figure out what was going on. Once acknowledged it was there with a different pic, now go back to the first pic and you can easily see it

[rmaynard 16,293]

13 hours ago, wallfish said:

Weird, I thought the same exact thing and obviously others did as well. I stared at that pic for a while trying to figure out what was going on. Once acknowledged it was there with a different pic, now go back to the first pic and you can easily see it

Looking at the picture on the tiny screen of my phone is a lot different than looking at a 24" monitor on my desk. 

[oldredrider 2,553]

One other thing to check; the pinch bolt on the governor arm may not be holding it tight enough to the cross shaft. Maybe filing the slot opening will provide a more secure fit...

[richmondred01 2,307]

Those 161-181 disc governors are a pain to adjust.

Not to beat a dead horse here but your disc obviously needs to be replaced. I suggest you start with that.

I have several of them. PM me if I can help you out. 
all the best. 

[Greentored 3,220]

Appreciate all this, guys.  The cable tab on the disc is missing, so I hooked it directly into the disc. This should still function, but would be much more sensitive to throttle control, correct?

@stevasaurus in your pic, the looped side of the spring is secured with that screw, maybe I have mine upside down? My loop is in the lower slot.

Governor arm is tight on the shaft. 

@richmondred01 do these discs 'wear out', or are you saying I should replace due to the tab missing?

Should there be any friction between these parts when snugged down? There is very little on this.....

[richmondred01 2,307]

Not wear out as much as yours is broken.

they need to be free, hooking them directly up to the disk will most likely cause it to bind. 
wheel horse has a better design with the tab opposed to the cadet version. 
And no the shaft shouldn’t be tight.. 

 

Edited December 28, 2020 by richmondred01

[Greentored 3,220]

I have a couple 181s on the bench, will snag a disc off one and start there, then proceed to the welch plug to inspect further if theres still an issue. Will update with results.

THANKS!

[Gregor 4,847]

I have the exact same motor, with the exact same problem. This motor came from a rototiller, that didn't have a throttle cable on it. Like you say, you would have to pull your guts out to overcome that spring. I hooked mine up exactly like my book says on page 6.28,  throttle cable connected directly to the disc. In the end, I removed the spring, and installed a small screw in the slot, on the disc, where the spring goes. Throttle works much better. Not perfect, but better. I have never had this motor under load, or even wide open, but it does not run away with itself. If you figure out a better way, I'd like to know about it. BTW. I never ever had the governor assembly out of this motor.

 

"And no the shaft shouldn’t be tight.."

 

I think he may be talking about the throttle bracket, not the governor shaft.

Edited December 29, 2020 by Gregor

[richmondred01 2,307]

7 hours ago, Greentored said:

I have a couple 181s on the bench, will snag a disc off one and start there, then proceed to the welch plug to inspect further if theres still an issue. Will update with results.

THANKS!

You can remove the governor, if and only if required, without removing the plug. 

[Greentored 3,220]

Been awhile but finally got back on the 701. Started over from square one and the first thing I noticed was the governor arm movement way much more than it used to be. I set everything at this new found position and we have perfect function! 
However, once running, it ‘goes back’ to a position which will not allow me to pull the throttle fully open (as in, rev it up). If I shut it off and work the throttle by hand, the governor arm stops about half throttle, then will suddenly move fully as it supposed to. See the video. I am using a firm amount of pressure, you can see it stops short, then if I roll it over, it goes back to ‘normal.’  
Sticky from sitting for ages? Really hope I’m not gonna get the answer I’m fearing....

[Greentored 3,220]