C-161 Does Not Move

[dicklees@prodigy.net 2]

My old faithful work horse has gone lame.  It is a C-161 single (Kohler) and Hydro transmission.  I put the rear axle on jack stands and removed the tires.

The speed control lever does not travel the full length that it used to, and there is little or no wheel movement if pushed hard enough.  The brake drum stops when the brake is depressed, but the wheels can still spin.  The mower deck raises and lowers as expected.  I'm not exactly mechanically inclined, but am not afraid to get my hands dirty.  Oil level and clarity look good.  Any help would be greatly appreciated.  Thanks in advance for your help.

[pfrederi 17,128]

Welcome!!   Sudden onset or slow deterioration??  Is tow vlave tightly closed?  Can you push it with tow valve closed?

 

You can download the manual here it has a good set of diagnostics to help ID your issue..

 

 

[Ed Kennell 35,610]

Is the input drive pulley and the input shaft actually turning?

Edited August 9, 2020 by Ed Kennell

[c-series don 7,772]

Ed, I don’t think the hydraulic lift would work if the input pulley and shaft were not turning. I’m thinking maybe the tow valve? Like pfrederi said “was this sudden or slow onset?” 

[ebinmaine 62,961]

[oliver2-44 8,835]

[Ed Kennell 35,610]

2 hours ago, c-series don said:

Ed, I don’t think the hydraulic lift would work if the input pulley and shaft were not turning. I’m thinking maybe the tow valve? Like pfrederi said “was this sudden or slow onset?” 

Good point..thanks Don.

[953 nut 51,516]

There is a plastic cam that connects the motion control to the transmission, it has probably gone bad. Part # 5996.  

Edited August 9, 2020 by 953 nut

[dicklees@prodigy.net 2]

First, thanks for the warm welcome.

   pfrederi: The transition was sudden, one week everything was great and the next week it didn't want to move.

                 Tow valve appears to be closed.  Pushing moves the tractor a few feet before it stops.

                 Thanks for the link.  I'll be working that toniight.

Ed Kennell: Not sure what these are.  The brake drum assembly is turning and is stopped by the brake pedal.

953 nut:  I can see the plastic cam going up and down.  It moves the belt guide, which seems to be unable to move as much as I would expect it to.

               Is there an easy way to check the cam?

 

Thank you to all of you who took the time to lend me a hand,  Dick

[Pullstart 59,551]

  I can’t offer much more help than what has been given... but how long has it been since a filter change?  Is it the correct filter?  A non-hydraulic filter is not a good thing for these... most folks use a NAPA 1410 filter with happy results.

[Lee1977 6,211]

I don't have a old hydro, but if the plastic cam plate is the problem, the only fix is order a new one. I had problem with a Eaton hydor and had to replace the control parts to fix it.

[squonk 38,844]

Does the hydro whine like it's struggling to move or is there no change in sound?

[dicklees@prodigy.net 2]

A little more information.  It seems that the plastic cam is involved in the problem.  Since I can't get it off of the linkage I'm not sure if there are other issues or not.  With the cam loose, I was able to use a short rod and roatate the shaft enough to get the wheels to move forward and reverse.  There still seems to be a hard stop of the linkage at the neutral detent position.  (May still be the unattached cam.)

 

        Thanks, Dick

 

P.S. What am I missing to get that plastic part out?

[953 nut 51,516]

@daveoman1966 is the go to guy on this site for Sundstrand hydros, he may have photos of the parts that need to be loosened to replace the cam. 

[dicklees@prodigy.net 2]

daveoman1966:  Help!  How do I get the plastic cam plate off of the linkage for the C-161 hydro, single cylinder model?

[dicklees@prodigy.net 2]

This is starting to feel like an episode of the old "Tool Man".  I still can't get that darn plastic cam plate off, but I noticed flat spots on the cam follower.  Is that normal?  If not, how does one get that part out.  I'm convinced the problem is the interaction of these 2 parts, just don't know how to fix it.

 

Thanks again,  Dick

[Ed Kennell 35,610]

@daveoman1966     Dave, do you have a picture of the Sundstrand plastic cam and details on how to remove it?     Thanks

[dicklees@prodigy.net 2]

Finally, I have something to report regarding this issue.  First, I could not remove the plastic cam.  The metal cam follower had a definite flat spot on it.  While the cam was disconnected from the cam follower, (While this is not the best situation I put it all back together again.)  I can move the "arm" left and right and get the wheels to move properly.  It now appears to be related to the motion control friction adjustment.  So... loosened the lock nut and went to tighten the friction collar,  That doesn't happen.  How does one get the friction collar to move?

 

      Thanks once again,

                Dick

[gt14rider 693]

Day late and a dollar short. First check part # 95, the tab on end sometime cracks and could cause a issue,its on left side,# 95 runs through motion control.

Iosen nut , then threaded collar,unbolt and tap #95 though ,remove washers and spring, tap cone#98  careful to catch woodruff key,  pull #95 out.  Clean well, reassemble, dry no oil or lube of any kind.  Woodruff key is a little pia going back in but doable. Cam held in by two screws and two guides.