New WH guy!

[Mr Magoo 226]

Still plugging away at the first C-120. My time to work on them has been limited by my health issues, the fact that they are 50 miles away, and available daylight hours. Weather has also gotten to be a factor. We had so much rain that the road into the property became impassable without a 4X4. A load of stone delivered a few days ago has hopefully fixed that. 

 

So far I have replaced all of the fuel lines, filter, tank bushing, and shut-off valve. I drained, flushed out, new filter, and re-filled with fresh 10w30 the auto transmission. I also did get a new dipstick for the transmission. So far that was the most expensive part. Drained and replaced the engine oil. I will do it again after running it hot. 

 

I’m hoping to get down there in a few hours. Today I will check the breaker points and they hopefully fire it up for the first time in more than a decade!

[Mr Magoo 226]

Well, no luck getting it going today. I got everything back together and tried to fire it up, but got nothing. I did jumper bypass the ignition system and got the motor to turn over. I did not bring the darn multimeter with me today (always manage to forget at least one tool) so I pulled the ignition switch and cleaned the terminals up. Still no joy. Brought it home with me and tested it with the continuity tester via this fantastic tutorial I found here on Red Square https://www.wheelhorseforum.com/topic/25940-ignition-switch/ post #9 BTW. The switch tested out perfect.

 

So it's back to the drawing board. Maybe the starter solenoid is bad or it could be some chewed up wiring from the vermin that had been living behind the dash for the last 10 years. This C-120 has battery ignition so I do want to find out what the correct solenoid is. Norman has 3 different ones listed on his site for sale, but I don't know which is the correct one. I'm pretty sure the original part # was 8658 and the new number is 108544.

 

 

[Mr Magoo 226]

10 minutes ago, ebinmaine said:

If the solenoid is bad you can get one local by telling the parts store ya need one for a 75 F150 with 3 terminals.

All the ones I see for sale have 4 terminals. I can't remember what the solenoid on the tractor has, 3 or 4.

[Mr Magoo 226]

10 minutes ago, ebinmaine said:

A c120 should have 3.

I'll verify on the Cinnamon Horse C160 in the morning.

I may have a part number on an old box too...

 

Thank you @ebinmaine!

[Mr Magoo 226]

11 hours ago, Mr Magoo said:

Thank you @ebinmaine!

Looks like it makes no difference 3 post or 4. 4th post just for ground. With the 4 it looks like you need to run a ground wire to the frame. Just need to know what size the big posts are 1/4” or 5/16”. 

 

As for the ‘75 Ford solenoid, would the mounting bracket line up with the original holes?

[MikMacMike 494]

1 hour ago, ebinmaine said:

I'm lucky in my area that I have two good old-fashioned actual parts stores with people that know the difference between an air filter n a tail light bulb.

 

Since many of us don't have that advantage anymore and we are at the mercy of the nice person behind the counter with no auto knowledge or experience I always recommend bringing the old part with you.

 

If you do that, you will know right away if those holes are going to line up okay.

 

 

Which brings me back to a question I forgot to ask yesterday. Have you bench tested the solenoid?

And actually for that matter... have you removed the solenoid and cleaned the base to make sure that it's well grounded?

 

Also, one of the things I now do on my own tractors is be sure that the ground cable from the battery is running directly to the engine. That way when these engines get old and start seeping a bit the oil has less of a chance of getting between the engine and frame and causing a lack of ground.

 

Isnt that the truth....I try to add multiple grounds for that pulpose alone...but right to the engine you cant beat!!

[Mr Magoo 226]

Testing the solenoid is the first thing I will do when I get back to it. I will definitely check all of the grounding points. 

[Mr Magoo 226]

I had a few minutes today and was able to bench test the solenoid. I tested it for resistance and voltage and it worked perfectly. I am pretty sure it is a replacement unless WH was using solenoids sourced from Mexico.

 

I reinstalled the solenoid, cleaned all the contact points and still nothing when I turn the key. So now where am I at? Somehow I am not getting power from the ignition switch to the solenoid it appears. So safety switches causing a problem? I found at least 3 of these, one on the brake pedal, one on the seat, and one on the PTO. 

 

I did take some more pictures of all 3 WH's because everyone loves pictures! Someone has been doing a lot of brazing to the top of that muffler!

 

 

[Mr Magoo 226]

I also got some pictures of the #2 C-120. It is in much rougher condition than the first that I am messing with now. I think it has been sitting much longer unused. All of the soft components like rubber and wiring are much more deteriorated and there is more corrosion on other parts than the #1 machine. 

 

[Mr Magoo 226]

I was able to finally dig out the 856 and get some pictures. 

 

 

[Mr Magoo 226]

55 minutes ago, ebinmaine said:

Very nice!

Thanks for the pictures!!

 

FWIW... Your "rough" C120 is in FAR better condition than my Cinnamon Horse was when we shredded that for restoration.

 

So.... Safety switches. Yes. 

Now it's time to run a jumper past them (for test purposes ONLY) to find the fault or issue.

 

You can do a continuity/operation test on each one individually to ensure its own operation and possibly find a bad terminal, connection etc...

 

 

Thanks Eric. I could really use some help from all of you experienced folks who have been doing this for a while. I need to come up with some sort of value for each as they sit so I can have some sort of an idea where to start with the owner to try and buy one or more of them. I am still pretty much a novice with all things WH. I want to be extremely fair with the owner and myself too. I think he may let go of the second C-120, but not sure about the 856. The 856 may hold some sentimental value for the family. 

 

I have done a lot of searching on the net trying to find similar ones for sale. It find that in a non-running condition that maybe $150.00 seems to be a common price and that running,  "turn key", cutting grass in good condition can be anywhere from $500.00-$600.00. I really am not sure about the value of the 856. The problem I have is that I'm already over $100.00 deep into the first one so I'm going to have to pull back monetarily until I figure the values out. By the time tires and a new battery go into it, it will not be far from the max value. That is all based on hoping that the deck is in good shape. If the spindles, blades, pulleys, or belts need replacing we are definitely maxing out or surpassing top dollar for the condition that they are in I think or am I way off base?

 

I hope several of you can help me get this all into context. 

 

 

 

[Mr Magoo 226]

3 hours ago, ebinmaine said:

You'll find all the help you need here so don't sweat that even for half a second.

 

Just keep asking questions or search for what you're looking for and you'll come up with it.

 

Value...

I can't give you a great basis for the value because I live in a different area but I think $150 is a very conservative price considering the transmission alone can often get that much.

 

When giving consideration to maximum volume you should look at what the new box store temporary tractors are selling for.

I would rather put $2,500 into an old tractor every 5 or 7 years then to go by a new one at any point.

The value that you have in mind of around $600 is probably fairly close for your area. But don't consider that to be a maximum.

 

 

I totally get that. My main hobby is restoring old telescopes. The kind of scopes I like are the bit heavy beasts of days gone by that not many people want these days because they don’t have all of the bells, whistles, and computerized gizmos that the modern models have. Then again that is why they are also lost looking at the night sky trying to find something without a computer. Most of mine are really rough when I get them. Most of the time I will have more money in the restoration than what the market value is. The one I’m working on right now is a prime example of this. Stored in barn for 25 years and a big mess, but I love it and it will be a show stopper when it is done. Sometimes you just do it for the love of it. If I did not restore these, they would go to the dump. 

[MikMacMike 494]

43 minutes ago, ebinmaine said:

That is AWESOME

 

47 minutes ago, Mr Magoo said:

I totally get that. My main hobby is restoring old telescopes. The kind of scopes I like are the bit heavy beasts of days gone by that not many people want these days because they don’t have all of the bells, whistles, and computerized gizmos that the modern models have. Then again that is why they are also lost looking at the night sky trying to find something without a computer. Most of mine are really rough when I get them. Most of the time I will have more money in the restoration than what the market value is. The one I’m working on right now is a prime example of this. Stored in barn for 25 years and a big mess, but I love it and it will be a show stopper when it is done. Sometimes you just do it for the love of it. If I did not restore these, they would go to the dump. 

whaaazoooo thats no telescope you you foolin hahaha thats a dang canon to scare anyone who even thinks of trespassing .....thats huge!

[Mr Magoo 226]

The one I am doing now is about 16” longer than this one and another 2” bigger in diameter. We do call them “yard cannons”!