Manuals

[littleredrider 408]

Did they make some changes to the Yahoo group for looking at manuals?? At one point I could look at about everything, now you have subscribe or some BS to look at anything. I have a hotmail account, and apparently they don't like it, so had to use my wife's Yahoo account.

All I want to do is check stupid part numbers and cross reference, and they gotta do that.....

[pfrederi 17,169]

You have always had to join each of the different groups. Because of file size limitations he has added a lot of new groups to hold all the manuals. I just joined 5 or 6 new ones yesterday. If you were a member of the older groups I do not see why you would have a problem joining the new ones. Must be a Yahoo issue. I also use hot mail for my Yahoo groups messages....

[littleredrider 408]

Luckily Partstree still has some manuals, but some there is no pictures for reference....

[rmaynard 14,926]

I have never had any success finding anything I need at Yahoo Groups.

Go to MyWheelHorse.com. All the manuals that Mike scanned are well organized.

Also, there was a thread last October where most of the manuals were made available in a zipped format.

I have found most everything I need between MyWheelHorse.com, this link:

http://www.wheelhorseforum.com/index.php?...=0entry180582

and Small Engine Parts Warehouse website.

Bob

[tunahead72 2,346]

littleredrider,

Are there any particular manuals you need, but can't find anywhere? You might try listing them here, maybe you'll get lucky and somebody can either send you a copy or give you a direct link.

Just a thought, good luck!

[littleredrider 408]

Nothing in particular. I know when I had the 702 and 753, I was comparing parts between those two and an 854.

I got "approved" to join the group, so should be good to go. Thanks for the help!!!!

[JUSS10 250]

as a heads up, they did change the group up some. it used to be grouped 1, 2, 3, etc now they split it up each group to sub groups like 1-1, 1-2, 1-3, etc i have found that even though i was part of group 1, i now have to be approved all over again for all the 1-X groups and so on...

[Martin 2,130]

I have never had any success finding anything I need at Yahoo Groups.

Go to MyWheelHorse.com. All the manuals that Mike scanned are well organized.

Also, there was a thread last October where most of the manuals were made available in a zipped format.

I have found most everything I need between MyWheelHorse.com, this link:

http://www.wheelhorseforum.com/index.php?...=0entry180582

and Small Engine Parts Warehouse website.

Bob

x2 for me too.

i gave up on yahoo groups.

since using mywheelhorse.com i dont even bother with anything else. i have been able to find everything i need on that site. every once in a while it takes a little hunting but for the most part its me not looking in the most logical place.

[Dockfishin 51]

what's stopping us from having the manuals here for easy access? yahoo groups, to be honest I don't care for at all. I tried signing up at the other site and it doesn't accept yahoo email accts. I don't have a isp email address so guess I'm out of luck with that one. :hide:

[DoctorHfuhruhurr 136]

You have always had to join each of the different groups. Because of file size limitations he has added a lot of new groups to hold all the manuals. I just joined 5 or 6 new ones yesterday. If you were a member of the older groups I do not see why you would have a problem joining the new ones. Must be a Yahoo issue. I also use hot mail for my Yahoo groups messages....

On yahoo groups they don't optimize the manuals and waste a ton of disk space which is why they have to have so many groups. I was able to save over 100 megabytes when I optimized the manuals I had. OCR and removing watermark spam also reduces the file size.

http://www.mytractorforum.com/showthread.php?t=157025

[MikesRJ 552]

Mr. Bowley, isn't saying "removing watermark spam" like saying "sure I stole other folks work"?

[littleredrider 408]

Even after I got "approved for an account" still have to ask for permission to get some manuals.

I spent bout 1/2 hour last nite downloading the manuals and zip thingy that anonymous posted. SOOOOOO much nicer!!!!!!

[DoctorHfuhruhurr 136]

Mr. Bowley, isn't saying "removing watermark spam" like saying "sure I stole other folks work"?

Technically it's copyright infringement. Yes, I suppose you are correct, any site other than Toro hosting their copyrighted manuals is like saying "sure I stole other peoples work".

[sscotsman 132]

Mr. Bowley, isn't saying "removing watermark spam" like saying "sure I stole other folks work"?

Technically it's copyright infringement. Yes, I suppose you are correct, any site other than Toro hosting their copyrighted manuals is like saying "sure I stole other peoples work".

anyone who owns an old owners manual, scans it, and puts it online can not claim to 'own" that manual..they cant copyright it, because they didnt create it.

but you often see many sites that put a big copyright notice across every page of the manual, with the name of their website or some such thing..but they dont own it! so they shouldnt do that..

technically the sites that do that are the ones infringing on a copyright themselves! but with many old owners manuals, I dont think the manufacurers really care, because they dont sell the manuals that are that old, so they have nothing to lose by "hobby forums" sharing the manuals..if anything, it only creates good will for the manufacturer to have the old manuals available, it fosters the hobby and creates a lot of people saying "man I love "brand-x"..great old machines, check out this classic I restored"..etc etc..if the manuals werent available, the hobby would be greatly diminished.

but copyright? no..unless you are Toro, you cant claim to copyright any Wheel Horse manual..even if its on your personal webpage...so I agree about the "watermark spam"..no one should do that, and no one has the right to do it.

Scot

[MikesRJ 552]

Ok. :hide:

[sscotsman 132]

Ok.

ok what?

Scot

[racinfool40 202]

OK, So if Mikesrj takes the time to copy-scan and all the work involved to add them to his site which is a big help to use all!!!and doesn't add the water mark then any one can go there and copy his manuals and put them on any auction sit??? Thats not fair for some one to gain on all his work..In my opinion just sayin!!! :hide:

[CasualObserver 3,406]

My question is quite simply... who cares? You're downloading a manual (for FREE may I remind you) that you need or want for your own collection or personal use. It's not original. No one will likely be looking at it but you.... So who cares if there's a light printed watermark on it. It's irrelevant. If you don't like it, then get one from Toro. They'll be happy to sell you a reprint from microfiche for a couple dollars with a stamp on the front that says "Best copy available."

Quit yer bitchin and just be appreciative that Mike and all the other contributors took the time to scan their manuals to make them available as a favor to the masses.

And @ Dockfishin... it's been brought up many times, but we don't have the capacity on this forum to support a library of manuals.

[sscotsman 132]

OK, So if Mikesrj takes the time to copy-scan and all the work involved to add them to his site which is a big help to use all!!!and doesn't add the water mark then any one can go there and copy his manuals and put them on any auction sit??? Thats not fair for some one to gain on all his work..In my opinion just sayin!!!

oh! Mike uses a water mark?

opps..I didnt know that.. sorry Mike! I didnt know..

well yeah, people stealing stuff for ebay is always a problem..

but really, what difference does it make to Mike, personally, if people steal manuals then sell them on ebay? I have had plently of things stolen off of my websites..here is the most recent example:

http://tinyurl.com/3dafdqe

my original photo:

http://gold.mylargescale.com/scottychaos/LVRR_SD70.html

nothing I can do about it, except report it to ebay..which I did..which will do nothing..all I can do is "let it go" and dont let the criminal scum bother me.. I make no money from any of my webpages, so there is no "real" effect to me..

but thats a price we pay for dealing with the internet..you know the saying "the only way to prevent your stuff from being stolen on the internet is to not upload it at all!"

So Mike's watermark might prevent "his" manuals from being stolen and sold on ebay..but there are plenty of other "not watermarked" manuals out there people can steal and use instead..so what is really being gained by using the watermarks? they are not "his" manuals in the first place..he doesnt own them..if they are stolen and sold on ebay..well, so what really? how does that harm Mike personally? it doesnt..its just an annoyance. all the watermark really does is make the manuals more difficult to read for the honest people who want to use them personally, to work on their tractors..

there will always be dishonest scumbags on the internet..nothing we can do about it..all we can do is continue to freely share our information with fellow hobbiests, and let the annoying stuff go..

if it IS your personal artwork being stolen, things you actually created yourself, being stolen and re-sold by others, and its stuff you sell yourself, and the ebay scum causes you personal financial loss..well thats a totally different issue..but thats not the case here..

I still say dont use the watermark..I have bought old Ariens advertisements on-line, and posted them on my webpage:

http://gold.mylargescale.com/scottychaos/Ariens/Page12.html

I could put a big ugly watermark across them, to "protect" them..but they arent really "mine" to begin with..I dont own them..I choose to share them in somewhat high-res form, for the simple enjoyment of others..if someone "steals" them and tries to sell them on ebay..well, so be it...my only option to prevent that is a big ugly watermark which IMO ruins the enjoyment of the image, or simply choose to not upload them at all, and keep them to myself..neither option is aceptable to me..

so I play the game the way I want to play it, and ignore the (very minor, IMO) consequences, so that the majority, the honest people, can fully enjoy what I choose to share..

Scot

[Martin 2,130]

i personally dont care about the watermark, i am just grateful that mike has this site up for all of our benefit. its a minor inconvenience.

im not really interested in purchasing anything manual related when i can go to his site and get the info i need.

thankyou mike for all your work to make these manuals available to us so easy and organized.

[Dockfishin 51]

I'd like to sign up Mike, If it could be made possible with my yahoo, I have no isp email. I'd be appreciative and watermarks dont bother me :hide:

[sscotsman 132]

I dont really care about the watermarks..

my only point is..its pointless.

it prevents nothing.

and IMO it degrades the enjoyment of the vast majority of people who want to use the manuals legimitally, for personal use..

When I wrote my first "anti-watermark" post in this thread, I had no idea anyone from Red Square was using watermarks on manuals..I have never seen any Wheel Horse manuals with watermarks on them..(but I have seen it a lot on other manuals) to me, its just pointless..and its just a general observation about the sharing of owners manuals on the internet, it is not remotely personal!

thats all..my opinion! no one has to agree!

Scot