New to me 856 with belt issues

[RandyLittrell 3,906]

I picked up a little 856 in nice shape. I replaced a few ends on the battery cables and cleaned out the tank before I even started it and it fired up and ran like a top except for the belt hopping up and down. 

 

I pulled the guard and the clutch pulley, pulley was in great shape and the belt was just chewed up. I bought a new belt and installed it this morning, but I didn't think the tab above the pulley looked like it was in the right place.

 

But, you can see where it's welded and been there since new. I thought it should be rotated farther forward so it stopped the belt when the clutch is pushed in. The new belt jumped off right away and looks like too much space between the pulley and the tab to me when the clutch is pushed in. 

 

Here are some pics and appreciate the help!!!!

 

 

 

 

 

[953 nut 60,348]

       Is that new belt the same length as he old belt?      Looks much too long, should be a 1/2" 70".   Also the driven pulley on the transmission appears that it might be a bit smaller than what came on an 857.

[rmaynard 16,372]

Belt should be 1/2" x 70". It does look like the belt is being rubbed by the guide on the top. If the belt was shorter, the pulley would stop further forward. I would make sure that the belt is correct. The guide on the idler has nothing to do with stopping the belt. That is done by the belt cover and the tabs over and under the drive pulley.

 

 

 

@953 nut may be onto something with the pulley size.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited July 10 by rmaynard

[peter lena 9,309]

@ Randy Littrell ,  while I agree with others on the correct belt size , think that original type idler pulley , could be the culprit , known for  bearing hang up issues , that by itself  can upset a belt  function . pete  

[wallfish 18,242]

There's evidence the belt is also rubbing at the back of the tower. The engine or engine pulley on the shaft needs to be moved outward just a tad so it doesn't rub there. It might also be possible to slightly bend the arm holding the idler pulley out just a tad.

 

There's evidence that tab on the idler is rubbing the belt as well. Hence all of the belt dust right after it. If that belt length is correct and since you have the pulley off, use a crescent wrench, tightened on to the tab and bend it upwards about 1/16-1/8" and that should stop the rubbing.

 

For the belt slap check all of the pulley grooves. One little bump on them will cause the belt to slap and wobble which also causes the pedal to vibrate back and forth. New belts can also cause that because of the "memory" in them from the packaging. Stress the belt by running it under heavy load

 

Edited July 10 by wallfish

[ebinmaine 72,988]

1 hour ago, wallfish said:

For the belt slap check

 

Check the clutch pedal spring too.  

We replace ALL of them now.  

[Ed Kennell 42,169]

IMO, that tab on the idler pulley needs to be rotated forward so it pinches the belt and aids on stopping the belt from moving when the clutch is disengaged.   The tab should not be close to the belt when the clutch is engaged and the belt is moving.

 

 

 

 

[Handy Don 14,129]

While you have the idler pulley off, you can also easily use a long straightedge to check the alignment of the engine and transaxle pulleys.

I’m suspicious, too, of the transaxle pulley being hugged in too tight against the transaxle case--the input shaft on the 3-speeds is quite short so some of those pulleys had their setscrew in the valley of the sheave

[RandyLittrell 3,906]

41 minutes ago, Ed Kennell said:

IMO, that tab on the idler pulley needs to be rotated forward so it pinches the belt and aids on stopping the belt from moving when the clutch is disengaged.   The tab should not be close to the belt when the clutch is engaged and the belt is moving.

 

 

 

 

 

 

This was my thought as well Ed!

 

 

Edited July 10 by RandyLittrell

[RandyLittrell 3,906]

2 hours ago, wallfish said:

There's evidence the belt is also rubbing at the back of the tower. The engine or engine pulley on the shaft needs to be moved outward just a tad so it doesn't rub there. It might also be possible to slightly bend the arm holding the idler pulley out just a tad.

 

There's evidence that tab on the idler is rubbing the belt as well. Hence all of the belt dust right after it. If that belt length is correct and since you have the pulley off, use a crescent wrench, tightened on to the tab and bend it upwards about 1/16-1/8" and that should stop the rubbing.

 

For the belt slap check all of the pulley grooves. One little bump on them will cause the belt to slap and wobble which also causes the pedal to vibrate back and forth. New belts can also cause that because of the "memory" in them from the packaging. Stress the belt by running it under heavy load

 

 

 

 

Okay, I should have added the new belt is a 1/2" x 70" from Napa and the belt hopping was the old belt not the new. Also, I only ran it a minute or two before I could see something wrong and the belt had jumped off and was in between the pulley and the arm. That is why is was rubbing in places. There is too big a gap between the tab and the pulley in my opinion and I think I will cut and weld it back where I want it. 

 

Thanks for all the help guys, I will try my fix and get back to you!! 

 

Randy

[wallfish 18,242]

32 minutes ago, RandyLittrell said:

I think I will cut and weld it back where I want it. 

I've done that exact same thing before. It's main purpose is to keep the belt on the pulley. Secondary is use as a belt stop.

[Retired Wrencher 5,837]

Randy do your self a favor and return that belt and find a #9691 belt. This matched to your tractor. Never had good luck with aftermarket belts. Easy find on EBay.

[RandyLittrell 3,906]

Well, I pie cut and turn the tab on the tension pulley and it fixed the belt issues!!

 

But.......found out the little horse has a trans issue!! Something not right when you make a turn to the left, it jumps and pops. Feels like something is stripped out inside. 

 

This thing is in nice shape otherwise, so I think I am gonna look for a tranny to swap in and I could rebuild this one at a later date. Just don't have time right now!!

 

Here is some pics on how I did my fix.

 

 

 

Edited July 16 by RandyLittrell

[953 nut 60,348]

16 minutes ago, RandyLittrell said:

it jumps and pops. Feels like something is stripped out inside. 

Have you checked the set screws and keys on the hubs closely?

[RandyLittrell 3,906]

1 minute ago, 953 nut said:

Have you checked the set screws and keys on the hubs closely?

 

 

Good point, it might do that rather than just spin.

 

I have broke a couple on my 1277 with the loader and they just fail completely.

 

I will check that!! Thanks!!!

 

 

 

Randy

[RandyLittrell 3,906]

Okay, the woodruff keys are fine, so something not right in the transmixer!!

 

I have a C-120 that I can rob the trans out of, so can anyone point to a good thread to swap out the 6 speed to an 8 speed?

 

Thanks!!!

[ebinmaine 72,988]

1 minute ago, RandyLittrell said:

Okay, the woodruff keys are fine, so something not right in the transmixer!!

 

I have a C-120 that I can rob the trans out of, so can anyone point to a good thread to swap out the 6 speed to an 8 speed?

 

Thanks!!!

@Pullstart has done it successfully. You will need to modify the brake linkage.

 

Just an fyi. I tried this on a plow tractor where I was near to constant back up go forward back up go forward and I was not at all happy with the end result.

 

IMHO and experience, you're better off to pop out the 6-speed and crack it open. You won't need to modify the linkage and you will still have the limited slip.

 

If this is a tractor that does not need to shift a lot, you'll be fine using the 8-speed.

[Handy Don 14,129]

I agree that the 6-speed repair might well take less time and effort than a 6- to 8-speed swap and lead to a better outcome. 

[RandyLittrell 3,906]

16 minutes ago, ebinmaine said:

@Pullstart has done it successfully. You will need to modify the brake linkage.

 

Just an fyi. I tried this on a plow tractor where I was near to constant back up go forward back up go forward and I was not at all happy with the end result.

 

IMHO and experience, you're better off to pop out the 6-speed and crack it open. You won't need to modify the linkage and you will still have the limited slip.

 

If this is a tractor that does not need to shift a lot, you'll be fine using the 8-speed.

 

 

I have chatted with Eric offline and I think I will rebuild the tranny versus a swap.

 

Thanks for all the help guys!!!!

 

 

 

Randy