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Talyn walsh

My wheel horse c125 will not get spark what so ever

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Talyn walsh

Okay so I had a c125 with the k301 and it was rough so I rebuilt the engine and restored most of the tractor I re did all of the wiring and I went off the wheel horse owners manual for the wiring diagram everything looks like it should I have replaced all of the accessories all of the ignition system is brand new literally everything I set the breaker points I’ve checked and make sure everything is perfect probably 50 times and still I have no spark the only possible way I get spark is when I put a pair of jumper cables on a different tractor and hook them up to my ignition coil on the c125 that is the only way I see spark actually happening please someone out there help me I’ve been trying to figure it out for almost a year now 

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Maxwell-8
Posted (edited)

Maybe a picture could help.

Edited by Maxwell-8

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Gregor
Posted (edited)

There are so many possibilities, it's hard to know where to begin. What if any safety switches have you hooked up on the tractor? Seat switch? Brake pedal switch? PTO switch?

 

Did you replace the ignition switch? There are 2 types of switches. One is for battery ignition, the other for magneto ignition. They are NOT interchangeable.

Edited by Gregor
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Achto
Posted (edited)

:WRS:

 

Are you getting power to the "+" side of the coil when the ignition switch is on? 

Edited by Achto
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OutdoorEnvy

Yeah lots of options here but start simple and go from there.  If you painted anything or there is lots of rust I would check all ground locations and remove paint and rust so you have good metal to metal contact for all grounds, especially the negative battery cable ground spot for the tractor.   Use dielectric grease too on the grounds if you have it.  It helps.  A multimeter will help a lot as you determine the power path and where the loss is occurring.  Starter switch and solenoid are the first places to check once you have established all grounds are good.  Then on to safety switches if those check out fine...  good luck with it.  Stay the course and it will get worked out... 

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Pullstart

:text-welcomeconfetti:  
 

It could be as simple as using the wrong ignition switch too.  Pictures of what you have going on, having a volt meter at your ready and using a known wiring diagram and understanding where the power travels will help us all tremendously!

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953 nut
5 hours ago, Talyn walsh said:

I put a pair of jumper cables on a different tractor and hook them up to my ignition coil on the c125 that is the only way I see spark actually happening

:WRS:

If you run a jumper from the battery on the C-125 to the coil + do you get a spark? Will the engine turn over from the key but there is no spark? With the key in the on position do you have 12 volts to the coil +?

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squonk

Is this a shaker plate mounted engine? If so check the separate ground cable for the plate and connections

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Ed Kennell
6 hours ago, Talyn walsh said:

only possible way I get spark is when I put a pair of jumper cables on a different tractor and hook them up to my ignition coil on the c125 that is the only way I see spark actually happening please

Does the engine run OK when you  add a jumper from the 125s + battery to the + coil post?  If it does, it is clear there is a break in the ignition circuit.    Use your VOM to backtrack the circuit from the coil to find the point where the 12v.  is missing.   Could be the ignition switch, seat, PTO, pedal safety switches, or a broken wire.

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Talyn walsh
4 hours ago, Achto said:

:WRS:

 

Are you getting power to the "+" side of the coil when the ignition switch is on? 

I’m not sure I’ll have to check 

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Talyn walsh
2 hours ago, 953 nut said:

:WRS:

If you run a jumper from the battery on the C-125 to the coil + do you get a spark? Will the engine turn over from the key but there is no spark? With the key in the on position do you have 12 volts to the coil +?

The engine turns when I turn the key I’m not sure if I’m getting 12v to the + on the coil I really don’t think I am if I’m getting getting 12v whats should I do 

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Talyn walsh
6 hours ago, Gregor said:

There are so many possibilities, it's hard to know where to begin. What if any safety switches have you hooked up on the tractor? Seat switch? Brake pedal switch? PTO switch?

 

Did you replace the ignition switch? There are 2 types of switches. One is for battery ignition, the other for magneto ignition. They are NOT interchangeable.

I replaced the ignition switch with the same one from factory just a 5 prong 2 position ignition switch 

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Talyn walsh
4 hours ago, Achto said:

:WRS:

 

Are you getting power to the "+" side of the coil when the ignition switch is on? 

I don’t think so I’m gonna have to check that out if I’m not getting the 12v what do I do 

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Talyn walsh
2 hours ago, squonk said:

Is this a shaker plate mounted engine? If so check the separate ground cable for the plate and connections

The grounds wires that are on the plate that mount the engine to the frame?

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Talyn walsh
3 hours ago, pullstart said:

:text-welcomeconfetti:  
 

It could be as simple as using the wrong ignition switch too.  Pictures of what you have going on, having a volt meter at your ready and using a known wiring diagram and understanding where the power travels will help us all tremendously!

I don’t have any pictures right now but I have a 5 prong ignition switch with 2 positions 

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Talyn walsh
6 hours ago, Gregor said:

There are so many possibilities, it's hard to know where to begin. What if any safety switches have you hooked up on the tractor? Seat switch? Brake pedal switch? PTO switch?

 

Did you replace the ignition switch? There are 2 types of switches. One is for battery ignition, the other for magneto ignition. They are NOT interchangeable.

When I got the tractor it was bad it was basically being eaten by nature for probably 12 years and when I pulled it all apart and re did the wiring I took the only safety switch out which was the PTO safety switch i by passed it and got rid of it because I was trying to make the wiring as simple as possible and I didn’t really care to have the PTO switch 

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Talyn walsh
3 hours ago, OutdoorEnvy said:

Yeah lots of options here but start simple and go from there.  If you painted anything or there is lots of rust I would check all ground locations and remove paint and rust so you have good metal to metal contact for all grounds, especially the negative battery cable ground spot for the tractor.   Use dielectric grease too on the grounds if you have it.  It helps.  A multimeter will help a lot as you determine the power path and where the loss is occurring.  Starter switch and solenoid are the first places to check once you have established all grounds are good.  Then on to safety switches if those check out fine...  good luck with it.  Stay the course and it will get worked out... 

I checked all my grounds except the negative battery wire I’m gonna go back today and make sure everything and I mean literally everything is where it is supposed to go and make sure everything has a clean connection 

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Gregor

While you are there, as mentioned earlier, run a jumper wire directly from battery + to + on coil.

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Talyn walsh
6 minutes ago, Gregor said:

While you are there, as mentioned earlier, run a jumper wire directly from battery + to + on coil.

What I was doing is I have a 520 and I drove the 520 up the the 125 and put the positive and negative onto the 520 battery and then put the other side of the jumper cables onto the positive and negative on the ignition coil on the 125 but I haven’t tried running a jumper from the positive on the 125 battery to the + on the ignition coil i should try that 

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Gregor
1 minute ago, Talyn walsh said:

What I was doing is I have a 520 and I drove the 520 up the the 125 and put the positive and negative onto the 520 battery and then put the other side of the jumper cables onto the positive and negative on the ignition coil on the 125 but I haven’t tried running a jumper from the positive on the 125 battery to the + on the ignition coil i should try that 

Yes   I am guessing, since you can crank your motor over with the key, your grounds should be ok. But there are always exceptipons

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Achto
1 minute ago, Talyn walsh said:

put the positive and negative onto the 520 battery and then put the other side of the jumper cables onto the positive and negative on the ignition coil on the 125

 

This should not be done this way. Don't hook a negative lead to the negative on the coil. Only a power wire to the positive side of the coil. Your points need to create the ground for the negative side of the coil.

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Talyn walsh
4 minutes ago, Gregor said:

Yes   I am guessing, since you can crank your motor over with the key, your grounds should be ok. But there are always exceptipons

So should I try to run jumper from my battery to the + and - on my ignition coil and see if that works if that does work and I get spark what should I do from there 

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Gregor

Only 1 wire   Battery +  to coil +  Thats all

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Gregor

Here are 2 ignition switches. The top one is 5 pole 3 position (stop, run, start) battery ignition switch from Amazon.

 

The bottom one is a 5 pole, 3 position, (stop, run, start) magneto ingition switch from Oreily Auto parts.

 

My point is. Both switches are 5 pole, 3 position, identical looking switches. They are NOT the same.

Do you happen to know the part number of the new switch you installed?

350956170_Screenshot2021-07-14at10-09-07PrimeLineIgnitionSwitch7-01850DOReillyAutoParts.png.637bfe176c83a5b18dbdc0af1e833b1e.png43427669_Screenshot2021-07-14at10-14-20AmazoncomStensStarterSwitchJohnDeereAM102551(430-538)IndustrialScientific.png.dbbcddc1f4c50b424d2c8df8e2f261fd.png

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Achto
5 minutes ago, Talyn walsh said:

So should I try to run jumper from my battery to the + and - on my ignition coil and see if that works if that does work and I get spark what should I do from there 

 

As @Gregor said only a wire from the "+" side of the battery to the "+" side of the coil. NOTE - Do not leave this jump wire on for a long period of time with out the engine cranking, you will at best burn your points, at worst over heat and wreck your coil.

 

Best practice would be to turn your ignition switch "on" and see if you are getting power on the "+" side of the coil. If you are not, figure out why and fix the issue.

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