Deck unlevel left to right

[Handy Don 10,613]

Sorry, just went back and realized "DUH" the deck is on the ground and off the tractor.

You'll need to mount it up before you can really check the lift/leveling.

[pfrederi 17,147]

Side discharge blade tip lower in the front.  i believe RD are the opposite.

[Jeff-C175 7,195]

1 hour ago, Handy Don said:

¼" higher

 

You may be right... I always have to go back and look at the manual to recall if they should be higher or lower at the front!

 

Just saw Paul's reply... he's always correct.

 

 

Edited March 5, 2022 by Jeff-C175

[conehead 14]

Jeff and Don, thanks for the feedback and links. I have found and downloaded the owner's manual for my deck. Thanks to you both. Since I have "discovered" this photo-sharing thing, I thought I might provide a few more images to help with the discussion. Referencing the first photo, why are there two holes for the adjustment rod? And is the rod currently in the correct hole? Should I have a washer between the cotter pin and the steel tong? It seems pretty sloppy. Photos two and three show the change in the left to right levelness, it is much better since I adjusted the screw on the rod further out the rod. I have made note of the finish height adjustment from front to back and will correct it accordingly. All of the adjustments I am currently making are with the mower deck off of the tractor and the deck is on my garage floor. Also, it appears that the large wheels on the outside of the mower deck may be different sizes.... As I measure each one they are about 1/4" off from each other. I would think that could be a culprit to the problem.

Any additional thoughts are appreciated.

Conant

[Jeff-C175 7,195]

1 hour ago, conehead said:

why are there two holes for the adjustment rod?

 

I have no idea!  

 

1 hour ago, conehead said:

is the rod currently in the correct hole?

 

Not sure which is 'correct'.  As you can see in my photo I've got the rod in the inner hole.

 

1 hour ago, conehead said:

Should I have a washer between the cotter pin and the steel tong?

 

It surely couldn't hurt.  It will still work without it though.  A washer would add to the life of the cotter pin I'm sure.  I use the bent hairpin style on mine.  Not saying that's what you should use, but I find they tend to last longer due to the extra thickness of the pin.

 

1 hour ago, conehead said:

adjustments I am currently making are with the mower deck off of the tractor and the deck is on my garage floor

 

The rear rod adjustment should probably be made with the deck mounted, but it might not make a difference if it's sitting squarely on the floor.

 

1 hour ago, conehead said:

think that could be a culprit to the problem

 

Probably right about that!  The wear on all the parts is 'cumulative'.  But certainly those wheels should be the same diameter.

What about swapping those wheels side for side?  If that levels it, your golden!

 

 

[conehead 14]

Ah, an interesting idea about the wheels. I'll give it a try tomorrow. Any thoughts about the adjustment rod and the hole it should be in. I just looked at your photo and see that your rod is in the hole closer to the deck while mine is in the other one.... thoughts? 

[conehead 14]

Oh, never mind Jeff, I just saw your previous comments. sorry.

[Jeff-C175 7,195]

5 minutes ago, conehead said:

Oh, never mind Jeff, I just saw your previous comments. sorry.

 

No prob Conant!  But I pulled out my paper manual to see if it said which hole was correct.  It doesn't say, and the picture is too small for me to see, but it appears that the manual shows it in the outer hole best I can tell.  I doubt it makes much difference though.

 

By the way, I don't see if you noted the size of your deck?  Is it a 42" or a 48" ?

 

My manual says that the gage wheels on the 42" decks have eccentric bolts and can be adjusted to level the deck when in cutting position.

 

 

[conehead 14]

Hey Jeff,

Thanks for taking a look at your manual. I have the 42" deck, that's cool about the bolts. I plan to pull the wheels tomorrow for a closer look. I am currently on eBay looking for replacement wheels and probably blades; both are pretty rough.

Thanks again, I really appreciate it.

Conant

[Jeff-C175 7,195]

13 minutes ago, conehead said:

looking for replacement wheels and probably blades

 

Check with our vendors here also...

 

https://www.wheelhorseforum.com/forum/92-vendors/

 

 

[Handy Don 10,613]

You guys are doing fine without me for now!

I hope by now you've identified the correct manual from the files and downloaded it yourself to look over, @conehead.

It does sound like you've got a collection of ailments piling up.

 

I'll also point out one more thing. There are "stops" on each side of the deck frame (arrow below). These adjust so that when the deck is in its "lifted" position, it is horizontal and tucks neatly under the tractor and doesn't sway back and forth (which it can do once the gage wheels are off the ground). Once you have it mounted again, you'll see how they work.

 

 

38 minutes ago, Jeff-C175 said:

gage wheels on the 42" decks have eccentric bolts

I'd forgotten about these from when I refurbished our 42" (manuals are really handy--thanks !)

[conehead 14]

Jeff, thanks for the suggestion about WH vendors.  And Don, thanks for the heads up on the deck stops; I'll make sure to adjust as necessary. I'm feeling better about what's going on with the deck; I definitely have a better understanding of the deck dynamics. Between the guidance you guys provided and the manual I downloaded, I think I'm in a pretty good spot now. As I sit here right now, I feel that I am well on my way to getting the deck back into shape and resolving the unbalanced cut of last season. Thanks to you both. I will continue to post as I keep plugging away on this. I hope you both have a great Saturday night.

Conant

[Handy Don 10,613]

This group is terrific. I'm happy to be of help and I've been pleased to accept help too! BTW, that looks like a pretty clean deck so with care, you can expect it to last a goodly while!

[tunahead72 2,342]

8 hours ago, conehead said:

... Referencing the first photo, why are there two holes for the adjustment rod? And is the rod currently in the correct hole? ...

 

 

...

 

I don't remember why exactly, but it matters.  Some of the deck owner's manuals say explicitly that "The trunnion must always be installed in the hole nearest to the gage wheel support shaft".  So, yours is wrong, Jeff's is correct.

 

Here's the particular OM that I got that from, which also gives details on the whole leveling procedure:

Mower Rotary 42in SD 1984 05-42MS03 C OM TIPL SN.pdf - Mower decks & reel - RedSquare Wheel Horse Forum

 

[Jeff-C175 7,195]

1 hour ago, tunahead72 said:

deck owner's manuals say explicitly

 

Thanks Ed,  I just looked at my paper manual again, and sure enough, right there in bold letters, it said exactly that!

 

After thinking about it for a bit I think I understand why it matters.

 

If you perform the adjustment as they prescribe, with the cutting height control at mid-height, when you move it higher or lower the deck angle would change too much when going from high to low.  With the rod closer to the shaft, it won't change as much.

 

It is interesting to note also that the NEWER deck manuals describe using a blade height gauge, measuring the actual blade tip height from the floor, to adjust the trunion rather than the rather simplistic adjustment that is in my paper and in the PDF you linked.  I'm certain that the simple adjustment is quite sufficient!

 

 

[conehead 14]

Hello, Ed. Thanks for jumping in on the discussion and providing the additional downloads. I have added to my WH file for future reference. I plan to continue to work on this project this afternoon and will correct the rod location. Also, thanks to you Jeff for the additional research and verification. As always, very much appreciated.

[Handy Don 10,613]

11 hours ago, Jeff-C175 said:

using a blade height gauge, measuring the actual blade tip height from the floor

There is one other advantage to using one of these after doing it the "simplistic" way to get it close--it'll help you confirm that all the blades are the same height and straight.  I found a bent blade (about ½" off). The "green stuff that might or might not be grass" we mow isn't that picky but I straightened the blade anyway. 

[pfrederi 17,147]

I just put a level on a blade pulley make sure it tips down in front. easier than trying to do measurements under the deck.

[conehead 14]

Gentlemen. Now I REALLY need your help. I spent some time this afternoon continuing to work on the mower deck. One of the projects entailed pulling the outside height adjustment wheels for a couple of reasons, including investigating Jeff's information that these wheels have eccentric bolts to help adjust the level. The wheels are whipped, and I want to replace them. So, when I pulled the right wheel, there were no issues and no eccentric bolt, disappointing. But, when I pulled the left wheel, I discovered a split hub inside the wheel hub that the bolt went through. Much to my dismay, the split hub fell right out of the wheel. Of course, I went back to the right wheel, and upon closer inspection, I discovered the same type of hub in that wheel. It was seized up good, not going anywhere. After putting some thought into it, I decided to shoot it up with WD-40 and pound it with a hammer and punch. It put up quite a fight, but I won. Again, after closer inspection, I discovered that these split hubs are not the same as the left wheel, completely different sizes. The left one fits perfectly into the wheel, no play whatsoever. There is a groove cut in each hub going from the inside to the outside. I suspect the groove allows the grease to move through the hub, keeping the bolt well lubricated. This is not the same for the right wheel. When inserted back into the wheel, there is a lot of slop—also, different styles. The ones in the left wheel have square ends on the inside; those in the right wheel do not have the groove and are tapered on the inside. I think that the split hubs in the left wheel are the right ones, while the split hubs in the right wheel are replacements from the past. I have attached photos to help with my explanation. Both wheels are the same size. I think that the poor fitting hubs in the right wheel added to the issue that I was experiencing with the uneven cut. I am looking forward to the group's assistance with this. I am sure that I am not using the correct terminology for the split hubs. I will be back to work tomorrow, so I will not need to respond quickly to my shout for help. Thanks to you all!

Conant  

[8ntruck 6,376]

I would guess that a previous owner replaced the original bushings with something else - most likely a pair of Oilite bushings from the small parts drawers at the local hardware store.

[Handy Don 10,613]

Agreed that a less than exact bushing replacement. 

New gage wheels are readily available (I just saw a couple in a post by @76c12091520h in his latest haul) and from other vendors on our list.

Can you put up a couple of shots of the wheels and of the axle bolts?

[conehead 14]

Hello, Don.

Photos attached. 

Thanks!

Conant

[Handy Don 10,613]

Thanks for the images. Clarifies in my mind that I would not spend any more time with those wheels than it takes to bring them to the trash can. They have given their all, RIP.

Edited March 8, 2022 by Handy Don

[conehead 14]

Thanks Don. I did some digging at the vendor section of the WH site, I'll be ordering some new wheels this week. Do you know if there is anyone who refurbishes old wheels like this? If so I would be more than happy to forward to them.

Thanks again.

Conant

[Handy Don 10,613]

50 minutes ago, conehead said:

Thanks Don. I did some digging at the vendor section of the WH site, I'll be ordering some new wheels this week. Do you know if there is anyone who refurbishes old wheels like this? If so I would be more than happy to forward to them.

Thanks again.

Conant

With the aged/damaged rubber, hub size variation, and the "extra" hub welded in, they aren't even candidates for refurbishment.

Sometimes we just close our eyes and say "sayonara" (or at least I do).