Muffler getting red hot

[Skins 3]

Hello everyone. New to the group and bought my first wheel horse about a week ago. 520Lxi. Has liquid cooled Kawasaki with 219 hours. As I'm a newbie had a couple questions. One thing I'm seeing that I didn't notice at first is that when looking sideways into muffler shroud I can see that the muffler is getting red hot. Was wondering if I'm running lean or is this how they normally run.There is a slight stumble at full throttle after it warms up. Old plugs were a light brown and both looked the same. At least they weren't white. It's my understanding that previous owner replaced carb. Maybe it's not adjusted right, not sure at this point. He was a really old guy. Apparently rather than replacing a bad part on old carb he just got a new one. So far I've drained tank and new gas and added a little sea foam. Replaced plugs, changed engine and transmission oil. Another question I have is about coolant. Operators manual says to use permanent ethylene glycol mix. Replacing coolant is not listed on maintenance schedule. I thought I'd replace all fluids since I really don't know much about the history of machine. Do people still use glycol or are they putting in anti freeze. Also looks like my left axle seal may be leaking. Nothing on the floor after about a week, Just an oily film. Was just a little low on fluid when I got it but may not have been checked for many years. Not too concerned about it for the time being. I absolutely love this machine as it came with snowblower attachment and cab. I'm planning on using it to clear snow this winter, but just want to make sure it's running correctly. Also wondering if there's anything else I should be looking for or concerned about. Any input from the group would be greatly appreciated.

 

 

 

[WHX?? 46,774]

To Red Square. Plenty of xi experts here so they will be along to offer advice and welcome!

[SylvanLakeWH 24,130]

[953 nut 51,681]

You may want to remove the muffler to be sure there aren't any obstructions.

I don't own any of the liquid cooled models but unless your engine's operating temperature is higher than the normal range the red color on the muffler probably isn't a problem.

[Pullstart 59,720]

  I recently picked up a 520xi, that’s quite a machine there!  Congrats on the 22 hp liquid cooled score!

[lynnmor 6,777]

 

Spark plug readings to determine fuel mixture should be done after a long, hard run and an immediate shutdown, looking at plugs that may have idled a while or was not worked hard will not be useful.  Since there is a stumble after full warmup it may indeed be lean.

 

If possible, see if the original carburetor is available, you may now have a cheap Chinese one.  There is only the idle mixture screw to adjust and that isn't enough to turn the exhaust red.  There are two jets, main and pilot, that could be less than ideal or partially plugged, you could open it up and do a proper cleaning.

 

The ethylene glycol is the green anti-freeze used for many years before the orange and yellow stuff came out.  That type anti-freeze should be replaced every few years.  If you get full strength green anti-freeze, instead of buying the premixed watered down version, use distilled water to bring it to 50%.

 

I would keep an axle seal on hand in case the leak suddenly gets worse, you don't want to have downtime waiting for parts in snow season.

 

 

[Skins 3]

3 hours ago, lynnmor said:

 

Spark plug readings to determine fuel mixture should be done after a long, hard run and an immediate shutdown, looking at plugs that may have idled a while or was not worked hard will not be useful.  Since there is a stumble after full warmup it may indeed be lean.

 

If possible, see if the original carburetor is available, you may now have a cheap Chinese one.  There is only the idle mixture screw to adjust and that isn't enough to turn the exhaust red.  There are two jets, main and pilot, that could be less than ideal or partially plugged, you could open it up and do a proper cleaning.

 

The ethylene glycol is the green anti-freeze used for many years before the orange and yellow stuff came out.  That type anti-freeze should be replaced every few years.  If you get full strength green anti-freeze, instead of buying the premixed watered down version, use distilled water to bring it to 50%.

 

I would keep an axle seal on hand in case the leak suddenly gets worse, you don't want to have downtime waiting for parts in snow season.

 

 

 

[DennisThornton 4,769]

Carb too lean?

[WHX?? 46,774]

14 minutes ago, DennisThornton said:

Carb too lean?

Gotta be ... most guys think if it's running rich it overheats, too much fuel.  Actually just the opposite. Sadly with no main jet adjustment jet swapping is in order. 

On my singles I get her good and hot and run it lean then open the main jet screw until the glowing muffler goes away. Best done in darkness to better see the glowing. 

[Skins 3]

15 hours ago, Skins said:

Hello everyone. New to the group and bought my first wheel horse about a week ago. 520Lxi. Has liquid cooled Kawasaki with 219 hours. As I'm a newbie had a couple questions. One thing I'm seeing that I didn't notice at first is that when looking sideways into muffler shroud I can see that the muffler is getting red hot. Was wondering if I'm running lean or is this how they normally run.There is a slight stumble at full throttle after it warms up. Old plugs were a light brown and both looked the same. At least they weren't white. It's my understanding that previous owner replaced carb. Maybe it's not adjusted right, not sure at this point. He was a really old guy. Apparently rather than replacing a bad part on old carb he just got a new one. So far I've drained tank and new gas and added a little sea foam. Replaced plugs, changed engine and transmission oil. Another question I have is about coolant. Operators manual says to use permanent ethylene glycol mix. Replacing coolant is not listed on maintenance schedule. I thought I'd replace all fluids since I really don't know much about the history of machine. Do people still use glycol or are they putting in anti freeze. Also looks like my left axle seal may be leaking. Nothing on the floor after about a week, Just an oily film. Was just a little low on fluid when I got it but may not have been checked for many years. Not too concerned about it for the time being. I absolutely love this machine as it came with snowblower attachment and cab. I'm planning on using it to clear snow this winter, but just want to make sure it's running correctly. Also wondering if there's anything else I should be looking for or concerned about. Any input from the group would be greatly appreciated.

 

 

 

 

[PeacemakerJack 10,671]

That is a great machine!  The Kawasaki FD620D is a really great motor and has a very long life expectancy if maintained properly.  My wife has owned the 523Dxi for just over 5 years now and we love it.  It is the Daihatsu diesel version of your tractor.  The power steering makes snow removal a blast—literally and figuratively😁.  Dual range rear end is sweet for road transport and for slow speed torque applications.  All the manuals for your tractor are available for download and I recommend doing that if you don’t have them already.  

 

You have some good advice up above on your muffler situation.  I have unearthed some information that the newer engines run hotter because of federal regulations concerning emissions.  They have forced manufacturers to set them to run as lean as possible. An adjustable carb is great if one is available to you.  Many of the new ones aren’t adjustable so you can’t “damage the ozone” in your neighborhood🥴.  

 

The only thing i would research on your engine is if that one has the plastic can gear.  I don’t remember off hand which years had those but it isn’t to hard to find out if you do a little online digging as these engines were placed in many John Deere’s and several different Cub models. If it has the plastic can gear, you might want to chance that out at some point.  With the low hours of your machine, I can’t imagine that it would give you problems for awhile...

 

Good luck with your awesome new machine—I would like to get one of those someday!  I’m glad you found us and be careful...these have a way or multiplying in your garage, shed, etc

[shallowwatersailor 3,213]

The 520Lxi is the one model 5xi that I never owned. But many of the tricks in maintaining it are similar to maintaining my former 523Dxi. One thing that I have wondered about is that Toro didn't use the Daihatsu DM950G gas-version of the DM950D. The engine was developed as both a gas block and diesel block engine. It could be that the Kawasaki engine was already being used in the Lawn and Garden industry and would be more readily accepted and serviced. The Kawasaki engine had three less horsepower but may have been cheaper. The 523Dxi diesel tractor was actually developed for the European Market but for those that own/owned one a very nice tractor here in the USA

 

When changing the antifreeze, I would use the green pre-mix antifreeze. Also change the radiator cap at the same time. Hoses should be good unless "squishy." It is important to have the rear end elevated when changing the antifreeze. You can use a set of ramps. The reason is that the radiator is reversed on the chassis against the firewall. It need to be the highpoint in order to burp air pockets out. Also when used for mowing, clean the radiator removable screen when finished.

 

There is a filter screen for the transmission/transaxle fluid (besides the filter mounted on the transmission) for the hydraulic steering. It is behind the left-hand intake air screen of the body. I used Mobil 1 10W-30 synthetic motor oil in my hydros. It flows better in the winter and it can be purchaesed in a 5 quart jug. The quantity to refill is 4.5 quarts. Check the hub bolts to the axle to make sure they haven't loosened. You might consider changing the lugbolts to lugscrews if you need to remove the rear wheels. The thread is the same as older GM vehicles. It makes it a simpler remove and install the wheels. If you need to adjust the forward/reverse motion you will need to remove the right rear wheel to adjust the eccentric bolt. Make sure that the tractor is well supported as you will need to get slightly underneath to adjust it.

[tom2p 2,393]

2 hours ago, PeacemakerJack said:

 

The only thing i would research on your engine is if that one has the plastic can gear.  I don’t remember off hand which years had those but it isn’t to hard to find out if you do a little online digging as these engines were placed in many John Deere’s and several different Cub models. If it has the plastic can gear, you might want to chance that out at some point.  With the low hours of your machine, I can’t imagine that it would give you problems for awhile...

 

 

Peacemaker Jack  - 

 

remember back in the day when many GM engines had the plastic / nylon covered timing gears ?

 

bad memories for me unfortunately 

 

they failed on a Buick GS I had - but fortunately just required new timing chain and gear 

 

but contributed to failure of the engine in my 69 Hurst Olds ... forced to do a complete rebuild including new crank and rods ...

 

[Skins 3]

8 hours ago, lynnmor said:

 

Spark plug readings to determine fuel mixture should be done after a long, hard run and an immediate shutdown, looking at plugs that may have idled a while or was not worked hard will not be useful.  Since there is a stumble after full warmup it may indeed be lean.

 

If possible, see if the original carburetor is available, you may now have a cheap Chinese one.  There is only the idle mixture screw to adjust and that isn't enough to turn the exhaust red.  There are two jets, main and pilot, that could be less than ideal or partially plugged, you could open it up and do a proper cleaning.

 

The ethylene glycol is the green anti-freeze used for many years before the orange and yellow stuff came out.  That type anti-freeze should be replaced every few years.  If you get full strength green anti-freeze, instead of buying the premixed watered down version, use distilled water to bring it to 50%.

 

I would keep an axle seal on hand in case the leak suddenly gets worse, you don't want to have downtime waiting for parts in snow season.

 

 

 

5 hours ago, Skins said:

 

Thank you. This is really good information. After reading your reply I took carb off and had a look as it comes off pretty easy. Didn't open anything up, was just curious if it had a Chinese replacement. All I could find on carb body was the letters TK and numbers 1-12 in a circular pattern with arrow pointing at about 11-1/2. Didn't see the word China. I also noticed that the wire to solenoid valve was disconnected. Seemed to make no difference weather wire was connected or not. I assume the intent is for positive fuel shut off with ignition off but not sure. Looked again with lights off and pipe from head to muffler was also really red from muffler to about 1/2 way to head. Worse on right, Maybe because heat from left cylinder goes by it and exits machine on right. Now I'm starting to get a little more concerened. Someone else had mentioned possible muffler obstruction.I suppose that could be a possibility, however I don't hear any rattling like broken baffles but maybe I wouldn't. Just wondering if you had any additional thoughts.

 

5 hours ago, Skins said:

 

 

[lynnmor 6,777]

I can't imagine taking off a carburetor and not taking it apart to clean inside.  That solenoid is to shut off the fuel so it doesn't backfire on shutdown.  I don't know what markings the original carburetor had on it, most would have the brand and model number at a minimum.  There are way too many folks that just change out carburetors when the good quality original only needed a bit of cleaning.

[Skins 3]

1 hour ago, lynnmor said:

I can't imagine taking off a carburetor and not taking it apart to clean inside.  That solenoid is to shut off the fuel so it doesn't backfire on shutdown.  I don't know what markings the original carburetor had on it, most would have the brand and model number at a minimum.  There are way too many folks that just change out carburetors when the good quality original only needed a bit of cleaning.

Thanks for the info. I'll probably go through the carb this weekend when I have more time. Muffler seems ok. I don't think I'll have much luck getting old carb from original owner but it doesn't cost anything to make a call. Thanks again. 

[Skins 3]

4 hours ago, shallowwatersailor said:

The 520Lxi is the one model 5xi that I never owned. But many of the tricks in maintaining it are similar to maintaining my former 523Dxi. One thing that I have wondered about is that Toro didn't use the Daihatsu DM950G gas-version of the DM950D. The engine was developed as both a gas block and diesel block engine. It could be that the Kawasaki engine was already being used in the Lawn and Garden industry and would be more readily accepted and serviced. The Kawasaki engine had three less horsepower but may have been cheaper. The 523Dxi diesel tractor was actually developed for the European Market but for those that own/owned one a very nice tractor here in the USA

 

When changing the antifreeze, I would use the green pre-mix antifreeze. Also change the radiator cap at the same time. Hoses should be good unless "squishy." It is important to have the rear end elevated when changing the antifreeze. You can use a set of ramps. The reason is that the radiator is reversed on the chassis against the firewall. It need to be the highpoint in order to burp air pockets out. Also when used for mowing, clean the radiator removable screen when finished.

 

There is a filter screen for the transmission/transaxle fluid (besides the filter mounted on the transmission) for the hydraulic steering. It is behind the left-hand intake air screen of the body. I used Mobil 1 10W-30 synthetic motor oil in my hydros. It flows better in the winter and it can be purchaesed in a 5 quart jug. The quantity to refill is 4.5 quarts. Check the hub bolts to the axle to make sure they haven't loosened. You might consider changing the lugbolts to lugscrews if you need to remove the rear wheels. The thread is the same as older GM vehicles. It makes it a simpler remove and install the wheels. If you need to adjust the forward/reverse motion you will need to remove the right rear wheel to adjust the eccentric bolt. Make sure that the tractor is well supported as you will need to get slightly underneath to adjust it.

Thanks for the info. This is really good stuff.

[Skins 3]

On 10/22/2020 at 10:09 AM, shallowwatersailor said:

The 520Lxi is the one model 5xi that I never owned. But many of the tricks in maintaining it are similar to maintaining my former 523Dxi. One thing that I have wondered about is that Toro didn't use the Daihatsu DM950G gas-version of the DM950D. The engine was developed as both a gas block and diesel block engine. It could be that the Kawasaki engine was already being used in the Lawn and Garden industry and would be more readily accepted and serviced. The Kawasaki engine had three less horsepower but may have been cheaper. The 523Dxi diesel tractor was actually developed for the European Market but for those that own/owned one a very nice tractor here in the USA

 

When changing the antifreeze, I would use the green pre-mix antifreeze. Also change the radiator cap at the same time. Hoses should be good unless "squishy." It is important to have the rear end elevated when changing the antifreeze. You can use a set of ramps. The reason is that the radiator is reversed on the chassis against the firewall. It need to be the highpoint in order to burp air pockets out. Also when used for mowing, clean the radiator removable screen when finished.

 

There is a filter screen for the transmission/transaxle fluid (besides the filter mounted on the transmission) for the hydraulic steering. It is behind the left-hand intake air screen of the body. I used Mobil 1 10W-30 synthetic motor oil in my hydros. It flows better in the winter and it can be purchaesed in a 5 quart jug. The quantity to refill is 4.5 quarts. Check the hub bolts to the axle to make sure they haven't loosened. You might consider changing the lugbolts to lugscrews if you need to remove the rear wheels. The thread is the same as older GM vehicles. It makes it a simpler remove and install the wheels. If you need to adjust the forward/reverse motion you will need to remove the right rear wheel to adjust the eccentric bolt. Make sure that the tractor is well supported as you will need to get slightly underneath to adjust it.

You seem to know a lot about these machine so I hope you don't mind if I ask you another question. I went through carb and it seemed to take care of my red hot muffler problem, as well as the stumble I was getting after at full throttle when warmed up however while giving it a test drive after carb cleaning I decided engage the snowblower attachment which turned for a couple seconds and stopped. When I got in garage a saw that wires were pulled out of connector for electric PTO clutch. Attached wires again at pigtail and saw entire PTO clutch turned and pulled out wires again. Not at clutch itself but at pigtail connector. Was wondering if you know if these electric pto clutches can be fixed or rebuilt or am I looking at a new one. I plan on getting this thing working right no matter what it takes.

[lynnmor 6,777]

Look at items 8, 9 & 10 to see if they are intact.  Parts List

[shallowwatersailor 3,213]

15 hours ago, Skins said:

 When I got in garage a saw that wires were pulled out of connector for electric PTO clutch. Attached wires again at pigtail and saw entire PTO clutch turned and pulled out wires again. Not at clutch itself but at pigtail connector. Was wondering if you know if these electric pto clutches can be fixed or rebuilt or am I looking at a new one. I plan on getting this thing working right no matter what it takes.

 

From what you wrote, it sounds as if your entire PTO assembly is rotating. There is a bracket (if I remember correctly) that is bolted to the engine block. I think that this is a picture of the PTO for your tractor.

 

Edited October 26, 2020 by shallowwatersailor

[peter lena 8,067]

TOM2P,

[peter lena 8,067]

TOM , I REMBER THOSE PLASTIC COATED TIMING GEARS , AND ALSO THE fact  that the plastic debris in the crankcase , plugged and starved the oil pump causing many rebuilds, was working at a Buick/Pontiac dealership , very interesting is that gm  never did anything to improve the problem , you rebuilt an engine with the same poorly designed stuff that you just took out . water pumps were the same junk , a guaranteed failure in less than a year , replaced with the same unit that failed . good idea, pete

[tom2p 2,393]

10 minutes ago, peter lena said:

TOM , I REMBER THOSE PLASTIC COATED TIMING GEARS , AND ALSO THE fact  that the plastic debris in the crankcase , plugged and starved the oil pump causing many rebuilds, was working at a Buick/Pontiac dealership , very interesting is that gm  never did anything to improve the problem , you rebuilt an engine with the same poorly designed stuff that you just took out . water pumps were the same junk , a guaranteed failure in less than a year , replaced with the same unit that failed . good idea, pete

that's what happened to my Olds 455 - starved for oil and destroyed bunch of rod bearings ... also took out crank bearings ... etc ...

 

crank also had to be replaced because it had microscopic cracks when checked (astrofluxed or magnifluxed ?) 

car was down for a while because a lot of money required for the rebuild 

 

 

[tom2p 2,393]

 

apologize for hi-jacking the post 

 

but lesson to be learned - be aware of plastic gears 

 

[Skins 3]

8 hours ago, shallowwatersailor said:

 

From what you wrote, it sounds as if your entire PTO assembly is rotating. There is a bracket (if I remember correctly) that is bolted to the engine block. I think that this is a picture of the PTO for your tractor.

 

Thanks for the info. My clutch is aftermarket as it has a date code of 2004 but looks very similar. What I didn't realize at first is that there's a small tab that comes down from the muffler shroud and fits into slot on clutch. Kind of embarrassing that I missed that but I'm learning. Only had it a little over a week. It was kind of an impulse buy, but I have no regrets. I can't believe how solid these tractors are. Makes my newer Cub Cadet seem like a toy.