What exactly is it? rj? Suburban?

[76c12091520h 3,926]

Ok,need some help from the experts; this has been in my dad's Horse collection for about 30 yrs. His field of expertise ranges from about 1960 on up. What exactly is it and what pieces am I missing beyond the obvious heat shield, belt cover, and recoil? I'm gonna restore it after my 520H and I want to start gathering the missing pieces . I intend to do it cosmetically perfect and as correct as I can. Have at it:

[953 nut 60,385]

1961 401 Suburban.                     It would have had a Kohler K 91 from the factory.

Edited May 4, 2019 by 953 nut

[AMC RULES 37,211]

...and, rarely seen Clinton powered.

[AMC RULES 37,211]

Cool tractor!

[wallfish 18,244]

Agree 1961 401

That Clinton could certainly be a factory original engine. They did produce 401s with a Clinton and I have one too. Not super rare but most of them did come with a K91 Kohler. 

[Shynon 7,484]

2 hours ago, wallfish said:

That Clinton could certainly be a factory original engine.

@WHX22 what year is your burb with the Clinton?

 

[76c12091520h 3,926]

That's what I thought; I couldn't win the argument with my dad the Wheel Horse dealer, he was convinced it was an rj because of the Clinton but I just saw too many things that didn't look right. He still relies on his old paper manuals and parts books, microfiche , etc. What else does anyone see that may be incorrect?

[Pullstart 67,089]

  @76c12091520h!!!  Nice tractor, whether it’s original or not!

[rjg854 12,259]

  @76c12091520h  I have to agree with Kevin 

[wallfish 18,244]

9 hours ago, 76c12091520h said:

That's what I thought; I couldn't win the argument with my dad the Wheel Horse dealer, he was convinced it was an rj because of the Clinton but I just saw too many things that didn't look right. He still relies on his old paper manuals and parts books, microfiche , etc. What else does anyone see that may be incorrect?

401 --- Cast front axle, cast foot pedal, push/pull controls, stamped steel hood stand, idler pulley pulls up on inside of belt, lift selector

RJ --- Steel front axle, steel foot pedal, lever throttle control, steel bar hood stand, idler pulley pushes down on outside of belt, no lift selector

The hoods, belt guards, gas tanks and steering components are different.

That should win the argument, LoL

I don't see anything on there that's incorrect. That's a 1961 deck too. It's just missing the fenders, belt guard and heat shield

[richmondred01 2,307]

11 hours ago, 76c12091520h said:

That's what I thought; I couldn't win the argument with my dad the Wheel Horse dealer, he was convinced it was an rj because of the Clinton but I just saw too many things that didn't look right. He still relies on his old paper manuals and parts books, microfiche , etc. What else does anyone see that may be incorrect?

 

Dont argue with your Dad.

[AMC RULES 37,211]

He's just wrong, that's all.

[richmondred01 2,307]

2 minutes ago, AMC RULES said:

He's just wrong, that's all.

 

Yes I believe he is wrong. However, that doesn't matter.

Dont argue with Dad.

you only get one. 

 

[953 nut 60,385]

8 hours ago, richmondred01 said:

 

Dont argue with your Dad.

Arguing is a NO-NO, correcting misinformation is OK if done tactfully.

[Jennifer 1,878]

Love the tractor!!! Any chance you could get me measurements on your lift link?  I am missing mine and I keep trying to make one but with out knowing true length, etc.  a million thanks!!

[Jennifer 1,878]

Love the tractor!

Edited May 6, 2019 by Jennifer

[Jennifer 1,878]

Oh and I might be wrong but if you could find the shower head muffler for your and a replacement wheel that’s missing on your deck!  The cast foot rest.  Just my two cents!  

[gwest_ca-(File Mod) 11,528]

60719 is the highest 1961 serial number recorded so far. Click on the picture.

 

[oldiron613 584]

This thread makes my day as I recently purchased a 401 Suburban with the Clinton engine and no fenders from a knowledgeable WH collector friend of mine as well which sure seems like an original tractor to both of us. Until seeing this thread though, the one I own was the only 401 I've seen configured this way. Nice tractor!

Edited May 7, 2019 by oldiron613

[953 nut 60,385]

The combined knowledge of all our members can still leave a few gaps.

With nearly six decades of previous owners, having a tractor that is totally original is soooooo unlikely that it is laughable. What is important is that we enjoy our little red tractors and share our hobby with others.

[bottjernat1 2,194]

1960-61 suburban and it should have a kohler they quit using the clinton on the early rj58's my rj58 could have either or but by the 59 and on should be a kohler or a lauson 5.5 hp. my adopted mom owns one all original! it has a i believe 5.5 hp lauson electric start which is hard to find complete. if they have'nt sold it. my late dad paid good money for it like 20 years ago and had it inside on concrete. but we didnt use it hardly. Since me and my adopted family are not speaking last i knew is i took it up to who was a friends place where i stored my late dads stuff. and it was pushed off my trailer and sat in the weeds it makes me sick to know it is most likely still sitting out in the weather. my dad would be pissed if he was alive.

Edited May 7, 2019 by bottjernat1

[953 nut 60,385]

8 minutes ago, bottjernat1 said:

1960 suburban

1961!

[76c12091520h 3,926]

Thanks to everyone for all the feedback, now that I know what to look for, the differences in the models are obvious, it was just something that was out of my comfort zone. I will be tracking down the missing parts over the next year to begin the restoration after I'm done with my 520. As far as that Clinton engine goes, never say never. While there is no way  to prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that it's the engine it was  born with, it certainly could be and having spent the last 4 days researching and looking at it I have no doubt it is. See attached:                     I'm sure 50+ yrs ago when these were built they were using whatever parts they  had available at the time they came down the line, whether that was a Kohler, Lawson, Clinton, etc.  

[oldiron613 584]

Here is a picture of my Wheel Horse 401 model powered by a Clinton 1290; very similar to yours. I recently saw another at the Garden Tractor Daze show in Portage, WI last month that was configured exactly the same, without fenders which makes me think this configuration may have been the "budget 401" at the time. It's an oddity, but there's certainly a few of them out there. I notice too, that the engine serial number on mine is very close to yours as well. 

[WHX?? 51,916]

On ‎5‎/‎4‎/‎2019 at 6:54 PM, Shynon said:

@WHX22 what year is your burb with the Clinton?

 

Somehow missed this thread but also have one with a Clinton I either believed to be original or possibly a service replacement. More leaning toward original now after knowing there are more out there.