K321: OUCH.

[Mudrig150 331]

So about this motor: it's a K321 from a John deere 214. It's...seen better days. It has had a fuel pump replacement, which went on with no gasket, and of course leaks like a sieve. It must've ran without oil, the original owner decided to run it till it blew up, then rebuilt it, even worse than original. They added an insert to fix the excessive tolerance on the crank, replaced the whole piston, and honed it.

EVERYTHING THEY DID IS WRONG.

 

The insert was added onto the heavily scored crank, which of course was grabbed by the ridges and it began spinning the insert.

 

They honed it incorrectly by shoving the hone in and not moving it at all while holding the button on the drill, so the crosshatching is horizontal.

 

The motor, to no one's surprise, threw another rod after just about 4 or 5 hours of running.

 

Luckily for me, it threw both rods into the oil pan, which ruined the pan and required RTV, Silicone, and a pan gasket to seal after the first thrown rod.

 

Good thing we have a John deere 140 crank and piston I can use to replace the damaged ones, so I guess I'll rehone the cylinder and reuse the new piston head from the 214 motor and the rod and crank from the 140 motor.

[rmaynard 16,299]

Sounds like a bit of a basket case. However, being a K series engine, there is not much that can be done to it that can't be undone. Since the rod was destroyed after only 4-5 hours, I'd venture a guess that the rod cap was installed backward, with the oil hole pointing in the wrong direction. Sure way to kill a rod.

[Mudrig150 331]

12 minutes ago, rmaynard said:

Sounds like a bit of a basket case. However, being a K series engine, there is not much that can be done to it that can't be undone. Since the rod was destroyed after only 4-5 hours, I'd venture a guess that the rod cap was installed backward, with the oil hole pointing in the wrong direction. Sure way to kill a rod.

 

It was the right way, they just started it up with no oil. Great way to break in a rebuild, lol.

[Pullstart 66,843]

I think..... that....   

[Mudrig150 331]

I'll get them. Just need to transfer from my phone to computer.

[Mudrig150 331]

Bore.

[Mudrig150 331]

[Mudrig150 331]

Replacement rod and crank.

[Tuneup 1,452]

i got an old siren like that in an estate sale. Annoys the neighbors. Thanks for working to bring a Kohler back from the dead!

[richmondred01 2,307]

Did you mic the bore and crank?

Ive rebuilt hundreds of the k series engines and from what I’ve seen after 30+ years of service they are worn/out of round and need to be bored and the crank ground.

If they are out of spec the same thing will happen. Also check the bottom of the cylinder apron for chips and cracks from when the rod gave way. If so it will need a sleeve or the block trashed. 

I would mic the center of the bore before proceeding.

 

 

Edited May 4, 2019 by richmondred01

[Mudrig150 331]

So I spent 6 whole hours yesterday and still wasn't able to get the flywheel off. I've been at this for almost a week at this point. I'm getting tired of this. My whole weight on a pry bar on the flywheel and still won't pop. It's like the freaking hulk pounded the flywheel on with a sledgehammer.

 

Anyway, I decided that since the flywheel is being an annoying son of a heck I'd just take the rest of the motor apart.

Oh.

My.

God.

The list of stuff they did wrong keeps piling up. Here's the updated version.

• Didn't mic crank when adding insert
• Honed it sort of correctly (They roughed it up but not well)
• Fuel pump screws hand tightened (didn't use a screw driver or anything)
• No gasket on fuel pump
• No gasket, seal, gaskets, or sponge in breather
• incorrect baffle in breather
• gaskets in breather replaced with way too much silicone
• Rod and cap in backwards
• Coil shroud on sideways
• Muffler chopped open and rewelded
• Baffle and muffler shield horribly cracked and damaged
• Condensor not bolted down
• Pliers used on everything

Yikes.

 

So, the bore is roughed up, but the crosshatching is horizontal, not diagonal. Would I still be able to use the bore and have the rings seat?

[953 nut 60,086]

25 minutes ago, Mudrig150 said:

Would I still be able to use the bore and have the rings seat?

Like @richmondred01 said, everything needs to be measured prior to taking the next step. Judging from the list of bonehead moves the prior owned made I doubt that they measured anything. 

[richmondred01 2,307]

Wow.

dont hit the flywheel with a hammer.

you need a puller.

 

[Mudrig150 331]

Puller ripped the threads out of the flywheel. It's on there REALLY tight.

 

Just about 140 pounds on the pry bar plus the mechanical advantage, and only thing that accomplished was bending the crank. Still didn't pop. I'm about ready to just break the end of the crank off to get this freaking flywheel off.

[richmondred01 2,307]

Maybe time to walk away for a few hours.

[Mudrig150 331]

I've been soaking it in PB blaster for a week. A WEEK. Bout ready to take a sledgehammer to the crank to get this dang flywheel off. Just snap it in half. The crank is junk anyway.

[953 nut 60,086]

If you drill out the crankshaft With progressively larger bits you probably can weaken it enough to break the flywheel free without destroying the block.

[Mudrig150 331]

Maybe I could just very carefully smash the flywheel to free the crank?

[richmondred01 2,307]

13 minutes ago, Mudrig150 said:

Maybe I could just very carefully smash the flywheel to free the crank?

 

Ive been rebuilding these k Kohler engines for 45 years and I’ve never had to “carefully smash” anything. So I guess I’m not qualified to field that question.

 

[Mudrig150 331]

Hit the flywheel carefully to split it. Like, not just flailing a hammer around. Hit right at the top of the flywheel and hopefully that'll break something loose, whether is be the flywheel or the end of the crank...

[oldredrider 2,553]

If you've already trashed the flywheel and crank, what are you going for? 

Find another line of work.

[pfrederi 18,690]

Drill out and retap the puller holes for 7/16.  Then use some heat on the flywheel.    Heat is bad for the magnets but at this point they are probably toast.

[oliver2-44 10,735]

Are you using 2 pry bars, one from each side?  If your prying from just one side it won’t ever come off the tapered shaft 

[Mudrig150 331]

I got the flywheel off, yay!!!!

It was just...loose. Like I lifted it and it didn't even pop, just slid off.

Huh.

Oh, and I figured out why it was so stubborn. The keyway must've been worn, so they filled it with welds and welded the key in...? Another thing to add to the list of destruction.

 

So I got the crank out and decided to test fit a rod with horribly worn end (probably .30 out of spec), and it was tight on the shaft. As in literally no rotation on the journal. So they used too big of an insert. That explains why it threw another rod.

But hey, the block and skirt are perfectly fine! A little sludged up, but fine either way. Good.

Also I do believe it's well within spec. I shoved the rod in and it fits nice and tight. Also good.

Crank teeth on the donor crank are fine, so are the camshaft teeth. Also good!

Governor seems fine. Every part is pretty much usable, except the rod and crank, of course.

Edited May 7, 2019 by Mudrig150

[Tuneup 1,452]

It's always a pry from both sides and a good center tap that does it for me. Reminds me of the old rear brakes on a VW Bug. 256 ft lb nut. Others have fun with the rear axle hubs, as did I and scratched the hood of my new car as the hub shattered (shhhh - don't tell the wife!). Seems you've done everything but sit back and stare at it while enjoying a beer. This method of relaxation is highly recommended. Sorry for your troubles.

 

Edited - Yee Haa! You got it out. A little early for a beer but you might consider it anyway.

Edited May 7, 2019 by Tuneup