C120 K301 12hp 8 spd Starting Issue

[gwest_ca-(File Mod) 11,388]

Ignition switch. Napa usually carries this in stock. Click on the pictures.

 

Clutch pedal switches rarely fail in my experience

The other switch in the starter circuit is the pto switch and I think this is the one you have. If not let us know.

 

Garry

[raven2955 23]

i have ordered a switch thru EBay 103 990  I have a VOM and continuity tester and test light. I also downloaded all the great info I just received from you folks to my Wheelhorse Library on my computer. I will clean the tractor up and begin looking at the wiring diagram I have. wish I had a color coded as I would probably try  to make sure wires were back to more like original. 

I have several tractors and a engine Kohler 8hp that was disassembled and the previous owner was in over his head. I like trouble shooting and I am patient enough to learn as I go.

Will look at clutch switch and check for continuity first

 

[ebinmaine 71,804]

@raven2955

Good to hear you have the patience and tools to work through this.

As far as the color coding on the wires...

 

@BOB ELLISONELLISON or @953 nut 

Both have great schematic diagrams I have used to rewire my tractors that are the same vintage as yours.

 

 

[raven2955 23]

Just finish tracing the wiring on the C120. The pto wires are gone , the pTO safety switch was cut and the wire was ran straight to the solenoid. I am having a hard time find the switch for the clutch. The one on mines is recessed in the hole I can push the switch with a small screw but wondering why it isn't sticking out so the clutch lever can push it in. I will be redoing all the wires just to make sure they are wired correctly. Can someone direct to a site to get the safety interlock switches PTO and clutch would like to order replacements just in case.

[raven2955 23]

Can't find  the PTO Clutch interlock switch  for the clutch, I think I will need one because the switch on mines is recessed inside the whole no way for the clutch lever to depress it

The wires were cut and disconeected fro the Pto switch looks like they were connected directly to the solenoid . I will need to re-wire

If anyone has a site on-line where I can get the switches would be appreciated

 

[BOB ELLISON 2,981]

This is the wiring diagram I redid  to help me . Hope it helps you

[BOB ELLISON 2,981]

You can bypass the pto switch just to get it running. But you really do need that switch for safety.  AZ has them and others here will chime in with an answer as to where to get them.

[raven2955 23]

AZ?

[BOB ELLISON 2,981]

3 minutes ago, raven2955 said:

AZ?

In the vendor section. 

https://www.wheelhorseforum.com/forum/169-a-z-tractor/

[BOB ELLISON 2,981]

8 minutes ago, raven2955 said:

AZ?

In the vendor section. 

https://www.wheelhorseforum.com/forum/169-a-z-tractor/

 

Here is there Web site

 

http://a-ztractor.com

 

[raven2955 23]

Went to A-z tractor tried to search for Clutch pedal switch, clutch PTO safety interlock switch  no luck 

Is there some other name i need to use

[raven2955 23]

Will call them tomorrow

[BOB ELLISON 2,981]

41 minutes ago, raven2955 said:

Will call them tomorrow

I don't know them by any other name then the interlock switch or safety switch. 

I do know they also went on a early jeep as a  switch.  

I just found this in my notes.

 

101845. INTERLOCK SWITCH for PTO & CLUTCH.  Use on B80-C160 ( Replaces Gravely 034640 Scag 48021 Simplicity 1654634SM 1654634 Snapper 1654634 1654634SM Toro 284250) Crown Automotive J5751207 Backup Light Switch for 80-81 Jeep CJ Series & 81-90 SJ & J Series with T176 or T177 4 Speed Manual Transmission

Edited January 25, 2019 by BOB ELLISON

[oliver2-44 10,567]

I just checked and internet vendors Partstree and Pats Small Engine have them new, about $50 each. Use there parts look and in the drop down menues select

Toro/wheelhorse

riding products

1975

c-120

electrical

this takes you to parts schematic and list

[ebinmaine 71,804]

6 hours ago, raven2955 said:

Will call them tomorrow

That's the thing to do right there.

Lincoln is a great guy.

FYI.. I don't have much luck finding things on his website so I ALWAYS call him instead.

(I don't have much luck on a lot of websites) 

 

He knows his inventory pretty well off the top of his head and also has a lot of knowledge of what belongs where.

 

It may be a good investment in your time to:

6 hours ago, BOB ELLISON said:

bypass the pto switch just to get it running

 

That way you know it runs and drives and then you can add the PTO safety circuit in separately.

 

 

On the foot clutch switch area be sure to check side to side adjustment of the pedal. There's a locking collar that holds it in the correct place.

 

[raven2955 23]

ONCE I CHANGE THE SWITCH i WILL . The problem is when i turn the switch I get nothing. Now that I know the safety interlock switches were by-passed . I want to see what happens with the right switch and go from there. Thanks again!!

[BOB ELLISON 2,981]

10 hours ago, oliver2-44 said:

I just checked and internet vendors Partstree and Pats Small Engine have them new, about $50 each. Use there parts look and in the drop down menues select

Toro/wheelhorse

riding products

1975

c-120

electrical

this takes you to parts schematic and list

Less then $20.00 shipped at Amazon 

Part # J5751207

[raven2955 23]

okay, so I replaced the ignition switch today. The engine tried to turn over from turning the key. That was an improvement, thanks again for letting me know that I had the wrong switch.

Engine still doesn't fire up. I used test light on solenoid from battery and from solenoid to Starter (while turning key to start it. Good light for both. I used 3 different type in-line spark testers. Getting spark to plug . (spark plug is new). Now I am wondering if rectifier-regulator might be the next step to test?

 

[953 nut 59,216]

9 minutes ago, raven2955 said:

wondering if rectifier-regulator might be the next step to test?

Not yet!   The rectifier/regulator just charges the battery for you while the engine is running, has nothing to do with starting or ignition.

If you haven't done so, clean and tighten all if the electrical connections including grounds then see if the starter performs better. Will it turn over better if you take a jumper from the battery "+" to the starter?

[raven2955 23]

Did the jumper test, will start cleaning connections and cleaning grounds. 

[tunahead72 2,536]

Before you get too much further into your troubleshooting, how strong is your battery?  Check the voltage, if you don't have at least 12.6 volts, I would put it on a charger to get it more fully charged.  You might be able to get away with less, but a weak battery can certainly cause starting problems, and sometimes other goofy, hard-to-understand issues as well.

 

[raven2955 23]

yes I have put a charger on it several times. I am also wondering what would happen if I put starting fluid into the Spark plug port since its looks like I a getting spark to there. Will also continue cleaning up the electrical wait for Clutch switch a new harness. Since prior owner bypassed not sure what else so restoring to original state is important to me.

[wallfish 17,848]

Don't use starting fluid. Just a little gasoline will work fine. Or spray a little carb cleaner or gas directly into the carb.

[raven2955 23]

She started !!    Closed choke all the way after putting a little gas in  spark plug port. The engine turned over. When switches arrive will be the job of getting wiring done as PTO switch wires are completely missing. Could be the fact that it is really cold but notice smoking from fins. will need to check to see if running hot or too lean.

But she fies up. 

[raven2955 23]

I think the wrong ignition switch was the main problem here. Thanks for help with that