C120 K301 12hp 8 spd Starting Issue

[raven2955 23]

Ok , here is the issue. When the starter switch is off and I put a screw driver across the s and m terminals the engine fires up and runs until I remove the screw driver.

I know the reason for turn off is switch is in off position and I by passed it. What is a pssible reason for nothing from switch when I turn the key. I press the clutch down and Turn key to start position as it is spring loaded. I looked under the seat thereis no seat switch  wondering if I have a ground problem or another safety switch I'm missing

[Lee1977 7,131]

You have two safety switches one under the clutch and another under the PT O lever. Is the PTO in the off position? The other possibility is a bad switch or a bad connection in the wire to the solenoid or a bad solenoid.

Edited January 24, 2019 by Lee1977

[ebinmaine 71,793]

I'm kind of wondering why you have an M terminal on your ignition switch.

M should stand for Magneto and if that is actually there and you have a c120 you should have a battery ignition and not a Magneto ignition.

Is this a switch that has worked fine for you in the past?

Has the tractor been modified?

 

[raven2955 23]

PTO is in the off position Will check the for safety switch under clutch. Would the engine start when I bypass with screw driver if solenoid wire bad?

[953 nut 59,210]

15 minutes ago, raven2955 said:

When the starter switch is off and I put a screw driver across the s and m terminals the engine fires up and runs until I remove the screw driver.

Don't do that!

If your engine has a magneto and you accidentally connect 12 volts to it you will see lots of smoke and can start looking for a new one. With the key in the off position the "M" terminal is grounded and the "S" terminal will not be connected to ground or the battery.

Tell us the back story, what have you done to the wiring on your tractor lately?

[raven2955 23]

The starter switch is 5 terminals. I bought it that way in October was not running just got around to working on it. What switch should be on it. 

Terminals are S,M,B,G,L. I thought M was for shut off when key is turned to off (grounds it out)

[ebinmaine 71,793]

Just now, raven2955 said:

thought M was for shut off when key is turned to off (grounds it out

you are correct about your assumption but only on tractors that have a Magneto ignition

 

 

do you have a year or model number or maybe pictures or anything like that that we can go by?

 

 

if your tractor has a points ignition like a c120 should, that is the wrong ignition switch.

 

that is actually a very common mistake because many many many many many small engine repair places and big box stores don't even bother to keep the old style switch in stock anymore.

 

[Lee1977 7,131]

I think he shorted across the solenoid with the screw driver. Don't know how he could use a screw driver on the switch.

Edited January 24, 2019 by Lee1977

[raven2955 23]

I have not done any wiring work previous owner may have and gave up.Thats why he sold it couldn't get it to run. He told me he used it regularly and one day it did not start. engine turns when you put screw driver across solenoid but does not fire up. 

[ebinmaine 71,793]

Just now, raven2955 said:

I have not done any wiring work previous owner may have and gave up.Thats why he sold it couldn't get it to run. He told me he used it regularly and one day it did not start. engine turns when you put screw driver across solenoid but does not fire up. 

Okay yeah that kind of makes sense.

 

before we get too deep into it we probably better have a couple of pictures and a model number and make sure we're dealing with the correct engine.

 

@953 nut has some excellent wiring schematic diagrams that are very easy to follow that will help you out quite a bit.

 

You will probably find that the repair is actually pretty easy to do with the

 

Correct switch

[raven2955 23]

[953 nut 59,210]

Presuming you have a battery ignition system and the wiring has not been screwed up you should have a 103 990 ignition switch. Take a picture of the front of your engine on the flywheel side so we can tell what type of ignition system you have. No telling what changes could have been made in a few decades of previous ownership.

[953 nut 59,210]

Yep, you posted while I was responding. Get the 103 990 switch and you will probably be getting some seat time soon!    

[Lee1977 7,131]

To check the solenoid take a hot wire from the battery and touch the center post on the solenoid if it turns over the solenoid is good.

[raven2955 23]

May have found the problem. The first picture is the Clutch switch. Looks like broken wires

 

 

[ebinmaine 71,793]

1 minute ago, raven2955 said:

Clutch switch. Looks like broken wires

That's definitely a problem but that engine is a battery ignition and you clearly have the wrong switch.

 

 

[raven2955 23]

Where do I get this switch and wheel the current wiring harness work? also looks like I need that clutch switch. Where are they available

[953 nut 59,210]

4 minutes ago, raven2955 said:

found  THE  A problem.

 

[ebinmaine 71,793]

Just now, raven2955 said:

Where do I get this switch and wheel the current wiring harness work? also looks like I need that clutch switch. Where are they available

Many auto parts stores will be able to cross that number. I'm looking at a Cole hersee brand box and their part number is 24037 - BX

 

if you're not in a huge rush to get it I could check my stock and see if I have a clutch switch and verify that it is good with a digital voltmeter. It would cost you the price of shipping.

 

If you can get one of them from a Toro dealer you may be able to find it locally.

 

[raven2955 23]

Sounds good let me know. I will look into Cole Hersee for ignition switch

[raven2955 23]

This is a great site!!

Very knowledgeable folks

[ebinmaine 71,793]

5 minutes ago, raven2955 said:

This is a great site!!

Very knowledgeable folks

Agreed.

I've learned a lot!!!!

[roadapples 6,983]

49 minutes ago, ebinmaine said:

Agreed.

I've learned a lot!!!!

The hard part is trying to remember all I've learned cause I'm to puter dumb to store it...

[ebinmaine 71,793]

6 hours ago, roadapples said:

The hard part is trying to remember all I've learned cause I'm to puter dumb to store it...

When I find something I really want to save I print it.

Or have my resident computer expert Trina help me out.

[ebinmaine 71,793]

7 hours ago, raven2955 said:

Sounds good let me know. 

Will do.

Do you have a DVOM?

 

You've already proven that at least one previous owner of that tractor had less then enough knowledge to fix it correctly.... And didn't take the time to do the research as you are now.

 

If your switch wires are cut it's entirely possible that your switch still works just fine and someone was trying to bypass it for no reason.

 

Also on the ignition switch... See if your local Auto Parts store can cross that number to a Standard brand if they don't have Cole hersee.