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WildmanC120

Picked up a C-161 Twin Auto. Got troubleshooting questions.

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OK, So I scored the C-161 that was in the classifieds.  I'm working on getting it running now.  1st things 1st, I put a new battery in it and charged it over night. When I turn the key I can see the amp meter needle move but engine does not turn over.  I can jump the starter and the engine turns over so I know starter is good. I suspect that the solenoid is no good.  How do I test it?  Probably just worth it for the $10 to replace it.

 

Also, while cranking the engine I have no spark.I removed the wire on the back side of the coil and still no spark.  What are the specs on the coil to check if its good or bad?

 

Tractor is in real nice shape now that it has been washed.  Hopefully she runs well when we get a few things straightened out. 

 

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Since you have no spark and no crank I would suspect the ignition switch and related wiring before the solenoid. See if you have 12 volts on the little solenoid wire with the key in the crank position. If you don't check the switch and even though your ammeter moves you can have a bad connection there. 

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56 minutes ago, squonk said:

Since you have no spark and no crank I would suspect the ignition switch and related wiring before the solenoid. See if you have 12 volts on the little solenoid wire with the key in the crank position. If you don't check the switch and even though your ammeter moves you can have a bad connection there. 

Ok I had to fix a wire but I now have 12v on the 1 small terminal when I turn the key to crank.  Engine does not turn over so I assume I have a bad solenoid. 

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Make sure the solenoid is grounded.  Loosen and retighten the mounting bolts before writing it off.

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In stead of testing the small solenoid terminal place the probe on the metal base of the solenoid and try starting. If you have power at the base the solenoid in not grounded. If you don't have power there the solenoid is suspect.

The ignition is magneto type so don't look for power there. It is self powered.

Garry

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Thank you for the manuals.

 

I have ruled out that the old solenoid is bad.  I have removed it from the tractor and tested it and still did not work.  I was able to locate a suitable replacement at my local auto parts store and have installed it.  I can now crank the engine over with the key switch.  One problem fixed and now to get spark.  

 

It looks like I have the magneto type ignition on my engine.  I have removed it, cleaned the flywheel as it was disgusting even though that should not matter, and reset the gap.  I have tried turning over the engine with and without the ground wire on the back and still no spark. Is there a way to OHM out the coil on this or just spend the 40 and replace it?

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I have not seen a wiring diagram, but based on my recent C160 experience....... are there safety switches keeping it from allowing it to crank via the key?

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Ok so after some more tinkering, yes I do have the magneto ignition.  It seems to work now but the spark is really weak.  It was good enough to actually get it to fire up and run though.  I used an external fuel tank.  The engine actually sounds really good so I'm happy there.  

 

Gonna order a new coil anyways just to be safe.  Also a carb kit won't hurt as you can tell the carb is dirty.  But it runs so that's sweet. 

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If this is your engine number 401417-0130-01 here is a parts list. 

Item 121 requires date code to identify the correct carb kit

https://www.partstree.com/parts/briggs-and-stratton/engines-400000-xxxx-xx-to-49z999-xxxx-xx/401417-0130-99-briggs-stratton-horizontal-engine/carburetor-assy-manifold-a-c/

 

This one is no longer available from B&S

Briggs and Stratton 393301

Carburetor Overhaul Kit

Used Before Code Date 79031900

 

Still available from B&S

Briggs and Stratton 694056 (replaces 394502)

Carburetor Overhaul Kit

or

Stens 

https://www.bantasaw.com/catalog/viewproduct.asp?i=&p=1692

This one identified by 3-screw fuel pump.

 

Garry

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engine sounds good, having used the  (  sea foam soaking  spray concentrate l  ) in carburetor I would do that, with a recommended hot soak .  also in gas tank. remember you are trying to recover a lot of issues, but you are running. yes those safety switches , will kill off spark , make up a jumper to verify that issue. looks like an early 80,s model, with that plastic rear fender, easily swapped over to the steel type. good luck with this, that engine / drivetrain chassis will let you turn this into what ever you want, Pete 

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11 hours ago, gwest_ca said:

If this is your engine number 401417-0130-01 here is a parts list. 

Item 121 requires date code to identify the correct carb kit

https://www.partstree.com/parts/briggs-and-stratton/engines-400000-xxxx-xx-to-49z999-xxxx-xx/401417-0130-99-briggs-stratton-horizontal-engine/carburetor-assy-manifold-a-c/

 

This one is no longer available from B&S

Briggs and Stratton 393301

Carburetor Overhaul Kit

Used Before Code Date 79031900

 

Still available from B&S

Briggs and Stratton 694056 (replaces 394502)

Carburetor Overhaul Kit

or

Stens 

https://www.bantasaw.com/catalog/viewproduct.asp?i=&p=1692

This one identified by 3-screw fuel pump.

 

Garry

Thanks. I found a real Briggs  Rand and grabbed it. 

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You’re going to love that twin Briggs. They have tons of power and are bullet proof in my experience. Here’s my dad’s that I have now. All he did to it was regular maintenance and some rattle can from time to time to protect the metal. He replaced the seat pan with metal almost 40 years ago.  I’ve painted the wheels, replaced the tires, and added WH wheel weights since these pics were taken a couple years ago but other than that it’s just like dad used it for about 3 decades.  It sat in his basement after he passed away for almost 10 years until I pulled it out and got it running again. 

 

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9 hours ago, cschannuth said:

You’re going to love that twin Briggs. They have tons of power and are bullet proof in my experience. Here’s my dad’s that I have now. All he did to it was regular maintenance and some rattle can from time to time to protect the metal. He replaced the seat pan with metal almost 40 years ago.  I’ve painted the wheels, replaced the tires, and added WH wheel weights since these pics were taken a couple years ago but other than that it’s just like dad used it for about 3 decades.  It sat in his basement after he passed away for almost 10 years until I pulled it out and got it running again. 

 

0FA4C03E-45AB-4005-9664-C07845558E4E.thumb.jpeg.1aa7e7e921d1327e5b8835f8dd6baa2d.jpeg6D6A5DDF-6FB6-41CD-B218-7EE9445ECC56.thumb.jpeg.2d57bd7f10d51517dfeac150ef33e673.jpeg

That looks to be in excellent condition.  I like that rear fender much better then the fiber glass one that's on mine.  Really changes the look.  

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6 minutes ago, WildmanC120 said:

That looks to be in excellent condition.  I like that rear fender much better then the fiber glass one that's on mine.  Really changes the look.  

 

I like it too. Dad bought this tractor used from a neighbor when it was a couple years old and the original was already broken. He was a nut for keeping things nice so he swapped it out as soon as he got it.

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Made some more progress.  Cleaned and rebuilt the carb, Ran new fuel line and filter. Installed the new coil.  Seemed to run decent for a few minutes then after attempting to drive it, started running like the carb was messed up again.  Made some adjustments and it was better but then acting up.  Even though I have a nice new fuel filter installed, wondering if some crud got by it.I guess I gotta tear it apart again. 

Installed an old style headlight lens too.  Although not correct, it looks way better then the smashed one that was on there. 

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IMG_20181019_175115.jpg

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3 minutes ago, Razorback said:

Nice! You’ll get it running right!

I'm sure I will. Just frustrating.  It's getting colder here real quick and I'm hoping to use this as my snow blower tractor. 

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Wonderful tractor - those original fenders are a little bulky in appearance but having one without cracks and missing plastic is a rarity. It's a great feeling when the engine first starts.

Be sure to get that tank out and cleaned. Check the screen on the valve or just replace the valve to be sure the screen isn't blocking feed. I can't tell you what was in the tank of the old '80 I saved. Oh, and what's in those fuel lines? Keep the pics coming!

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2 hours ago, Tuneup said:

Wonderful tractor - those original fenders are a little bulky in appearance but having one without cracks and missing plastic is a rarity. It's a great feeling when the engine first starts.

Be sure to get that tank out and cleaned. Check the screen on the valve or just replace the valve to be sure the screen isn't blocking feed. I can't tell you what was in the tank of the old '80 I saved. Oh, and what's in those fuel lines? Keep the pics coming!

Fuel line is Stens True Blue.  It is supposed to be up to 100% ethanol safe. 

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Well....I think the engine just locked up.  I cleaned out my shed so I could fit it in there with my C-120.  Went to start it and it fired and ran for a second and stalled.  Tried restarting and all it did was crank over with no fire.  After about 10 seconds or so of cranking, it began to slow as if it was being loaded and then suddenly stopped.  Now when you hit the starter it just goes click click click.  You can see it try to turn over but wont. I pulled the plugs and same thing.  I cannot turn the crank over by hand forward or backward. Sigh.  

What the best engine to swap into this thing?  Was thinking the 22HP predator but unsure of the PTO setup.  Would like to keep everything as stock as I can. 

Edited by WildmanC120
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Is the battery charged?

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34 minutes ago, Cee245 said:

Is the battery charged?

Yes. New and charged. I cannot turn it over with a wrench on flywheel. 

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I would say if you pulled the plugs already fill the cylinders with Marvel Mystery oil and let it sit for a day or two. Then try to bump it over with a wrench. 

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