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69-Raider-10

HELP!! Bronco 14 not starting and its snowing heavy!

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Hi all. Just picked this 71 Bronco 14 up 3 days ago. Ran great thus far and then came out today to just a cranking motor. Heres what I did so far to no avail:

- Checked Fuel to carb ✔

- Cleaned plug ✔

- Checked and replaced inline fuse ✔

- Checked spark ✔ (Its there. Not sure how strong)

- Checked plug wire again and other wires to see if any popped off. None were. ✔

 

Thats where Im stopped. This ignition is new to me so I dont want to fool with it until I hear what to do and not to do.

 

Any help is appreciated! I have no plow without this one! Need help! Thanks!!!!

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K321S with points ignition?

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Spray some carb cleaner into the carb and try cranking her...If she fires up you have spark and it is a fuel problem.  no pop then try a new plug first.

 

What ignition do you have . Coil and points, magneto or breakerless.

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I would get a new spark plug and go from there. A cleaned plug can fool you into chasing problems that don't exist.

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Combination of Paul and Dick's suggestion......Prove you have spark....if not, plu would be first culprit to swap due to ease.

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Posted (edited)

D. All of the above.

Some great ideas there.

 

 I'm really not going to be able to help you solve this but I'm curious to see what does so I'm going to follow along.

Edited by ebinmaine

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2 hours ago, classiccat said:

 

 

2 hours ago, pfrederi said:

Spray some carb cleaner into the carb and try cranking her...If she fires up you have spark and it is a fuel problem.  no pop then try a new plug first.

 

What ignition do you have . Coil and points, magneto or breakerless.

 

Ugghh.... Im horrible at quoting. Trying to get you all in one reply. Forget it. :lol:

 

I did change the plug. Sorry I didnt make that clear. The first plug had nothing but the second had spark. I hit the carb and the head at separate times with ether and neither got so much as a pop. I yanked the gas tank off to get to the inline fuse and the hose was rotted so Im replacing that. 

But now I have spark, ether direct to head with clean plug, and compression )(from what I can tell). What the hell is left to get this sucker to fire??

20180307_144309.jpg

20180307_144247_HDR.jpg

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20180307_144304_HDR.jpg

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Posted (edited)

If you have spark with plug installed, the it will fire with ether.

 

If its not firing on ether, I would chase grounding or plug wire issue as my first suspected culprit.

 

Spark while grounded to head does not necessarily mean spark once you install the plug. A test probe would help narrow down whether the slight change leads to no power to plug....

 

IMO

 

 

Edited by Aldon
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is that a breakerless ignition coil peeking-out at us in the lower-right?

 

20180307_144247_HDR.jpg

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17 minutes ago, classiccat said:

is that a breakerless ignition coil peeking-out at us in the lower-right?

 

20180307_144247_HDR.jpg

Yes indeed. First time I've had one. Wish I had points to dry and clean. I'd feel a whole lot better! LOL I don't know what to do with this.

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34 minutes ago, Aldon said:

If you have spark with plug installed, the it will fire with ether.

 

If its not firing on ether, I would chase grounding or plug wire issue as my first suspected culprit.

 

Spark while grounded to head does not necessarily mean spark once you install the plug. A test probe would help narrow down whether the slight change leads to no power to plug....

 

IMO

 

 

Aldon, great info on the spark not necessarily firing in the head. Never knew that. And of course I cant find my plug tester anywhere. Off to Autozone! Ill let you know. Thanks!

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In the meantime, look at this crazy contraption I picked up last night. Honda HT3813

Liquid cooled 

Twin cylinder

Radiator and fan. 

Its a mini car engine! I had to have it! :lol:

Also picked up a 416-8 but she is ugly right now. Runs great, 250 Hours, body is beat down. Im swapping tins out and throwing AG tires on her. She'll be a worker bee this summer for sure!

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Looks very wet everywhere. Had an old impala that would light up like a christmas tree around the plug wires. Shorting all over.

Dry everything? 25kvolts will find the easiest path if the wire insulation is weak.

Water in the float bowel will cause a no fire.

Ether should make it fire for a second or two though.

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Posted (edited)
21 minutes ago, 69-Raider-10 said:

Aldon, greaWheel Horse Tractorst info on the spark not necessarily firing in the head. Never knew that. And of course I cant find my plug tester anywhere. Off to Autozone! Ill let you know. Thanks!

 

 Because i lose things a lot I now have 3 plug testers from Harbor Freight.

 

 

This is exactly what i went through a few years ago with C-81 even with new Champion plug would spark laying on the head but wouldn't run.  Put in an autolite and fired right up.  I don't use Champions any more.   ( I have been told they have improved...but you only get one chance to piss me off)

 

 

Edit:  There is nothing unique about a breaker-less ignition plug wire steal one from another horse.

Edited by pfrederi
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5 hours ago, The Gman said:

Looks very wet everywhere. Had an old impala that would light up like a christmas tree around the plug wires. Shorting all over.

Dry everything? 25kvolts will find the easiest path if the wire insulation is weak.

Water in the float bowel will cause a no fire.

Ether should make it fire for a second or two though.

Im with you on this. I'm now convinced this puppy one big short. I watched behind the dash when I turned her over and smoke instantly from the key switch. I let it hang for a few minutes and popped the plug again, no spark to be seen anywhere. I think its time this old gal gets a total rewire. I went over just a few feet of power wires and found no less than a half dozen bare wire spots within an inch of chasis. Im hoping something didnt short the ignition and fry it somehow. I have to go find literature on this breakerless ignition and see what its all about. Might have to add it to the Things I Hate List right behind twist lock throttle cables, S.S Ignition systems on the Lauson / Tecumseh Motors, MTD,

Fuel shut-off solenoids, Joe Buck, Any Cowboys fan living in PA who has no connection to Texas whatsoever but has developed this clearly phony heartwrenching yarn about how their grandfather was a fan and he/she grew up watching the cowboys every Sunday. RIP Poppy. - MALARKEY!!!! YOU ARE JUST AN ANTAGONIST AND DONT GIVE A RIP ABOUT FOOTBALL!! 

If you want proof just ask them to do something on Sunday when the "Boys" are playing anybody but the Eagles. You'll never hear, "Sorry man, my squad is playing the Browns at 1."

Try asking an Eagles fan to do something on a Thursday night in August and you'll get, "Are you out of your mind? The Birds are playing the Jets tonight and I want to see that Corner from Clemson we picked up in the 7th Round and the walk-on kicker from Jersey. My brother-in-laws son from a previous marriage is roomates with the kids cousin."

:lol::lol:

Ok, Im done ranting.

 

5 hours ago, pfrederi said:

 

 Because i lose things a lot I now have 3 plug testers from Harbor Freight.

 

 

This is exactly what i went through a few years ago with C-81 even with new Champion plug would spark laying on the head but wouldn't run.  Put in an autolite and fired right up.  I don't use Champions any more.   ( I have been told they have improved...but you only get one chance to piss me off)

 

 

Edit:  There is nothing unique about a breaker-less ignition plug wire steal one from another horse.

 

Autozone was out of them and Harbor Freight is just far enough away that I didnt want to take the drive. 

I have Champion H10C's (?) In all my horses and come to think about it I have had to switch quite a few out the last couple years. Whats a good Autolite or NGK crossover?

Thanks!!

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I used to drive a '64 Rambler Wagon many many years ago.  It ran fine when the sun was out, but rain, snow or a dark cloud pass by, the thing would quit.  I discovered that spraying some WD40 around the distributor, ignition coil and plug wires would get it to run.  

 

If you have a short in your ignition switch, you might try some WD 40!   It makes a mess, but it does a FINE job of displacing moisture!   It might give you a clue as to where your trouble is.   As The Gman said, the thing looks VERY wet.  
 

Best regards,  Pete

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Yep.

W. D.

Water.

Displacer.

Good stuff. 

 

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Not an expert, but when this happened to me last year the PTO switch was the culprit. I would check all your safety switches to make sure they are all working and, in the case of the PTO that it is not engaged.

 

I would also retrace your electrical lines and make sure the new fuse connections you replaced are secure.

 

Finally, check all grounds.

 

:twocents-02cents:

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I don't think the Bronco has a PTO or seat switch, don't know but could be wrong.

Here is a guide on the breakerless ignition that may be helpful.

Breakerless.JPG.b8555667984ad1dafce1940146b38660.JPG.65d16ca273b3cd2ca62de3763742507e.JPG

 

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If you remove the wire from the ignition switch at the module you will eliminate all chassis wiring as potential problem items.

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A hint that you are not familiar with this ignition system requires a warning.

The breakerless ignition is self powered and the single ignition wire that goes back to the ignition switch is simply grounded to the chassis to shut it off. Do not allow any battery voltage into that wire as that will smoke the coil. To rule out a wiring problem disconnect that wire and isolate it from the chassis and the engine should run. Ground the wire to shut it off.

 

Garry

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10 hours ago, Rugerhound said:

I used to drive a '64 Rambler Wagon many many years ago.  It ran fine when the sun was out, but rain, snow or a dark cloud pass by, the thing would quit.  I discovered that spraying some WD40 around the distributor, ignition coil and plug wires would get it to run.  

 

If you have a short in your ignition switch, you might try some WD 40!   It makes a mess, but it does a FINE job of displacing moisture!   It might give you a clue as to where your trouble is.   As The Gman said, the thing looks VERY wet.  
 

Best regards,  Pete

 

3 hours ago, ebinmaine said:

Yep.

W. D.

Water.

Displacer.

Good stuff. 

 

 

 

My father in law taught me the WD is Water Displacer, and that it was the 40th recipe that worked and just happened to be a lubricant as well!  He swears by spraying his entire ignition system every fall on his old Chevy plow truck, that sits all year long between snow plowing seasons.  It runs like a champ, MOST OF THE TIME!  :handgestures-thumbupright:

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As an addition to what Richard posted above this is the test for the coil.  You indicated you had a spark but it was weak.  "Usually" the trigger either it works or it doesn't.  However the coil may be failing and not putting out enough voltage...

coil.JPG

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Thank you everyone! Too many to quote. Once again a combination of several great suggestions and excellent information has pulled me through. The Bronco is riding once more!

In a nut shell it was a mixture of excessive moisture and bare wires in tight places. I ended up pulling the ignition switch and cleaning it on the wheel, as well as cleaning all the terminal connections to the back. Then I cut out and replaced the single lead coming off the bottom of the coil and it's 2 branch connectors. Sprayed a little electrical contact cleaner/dryer on the chasis grounds and under dash, gave it a bit and turned the key. Back in business. Thanks again! 

 

Ps. Be ready for the 416-8 questions this weekend! Picking it up today. :lol:

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3 hours ago, 69-Raider-10 said:

Back in business. Thanks again!

:woohoo:

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