How long will a WH last?

[T-Mo-(Moderator) 4,345]

Devin,

I think that the XL's were okay machines for what they were - which was lawn tractors. About the same as the competition. As for it being mistake, I think that's not really an accurate term for it. They were fine for what they were designed to do - mow grass.

[Operator 7]

T-MO---I will put this in capital letters- ready? YOU WERE RIGHT!!!!! My buddies lawn mower is a Scotts. That just proves I don't pay attention to non Horse's. I'm sorry I brought up that subject

Now to kind of stay on Devin topic, I'd like to ask, What ever happened to the Horse factory where the real Horses were built? They still building here in Wisc? Toro stuff?

Randy

[kpinnc 10,745]

Wheel horse did make some mistakes (14-38 HXL)

Actually, that was a Toro machine that they felt deserved the WH name. Toro bought Wheel Horse, and slapped the name on all their lawn tractors.

They owned the name, so I guess they thought Wheel Horse's reputation would be a great selling point for it's "entry level" mowers.

I know Wheel Horse made some vertical shaft lawn tractors, but they were quite a bit better than the norm... The 14-38 could not even make a fair comparison.

Kevin

[KyBlue 652]

T-MO---I will put this in capital letters- ready? YOU WERE RIGHT!!!!! My buddies lawn mower is a Scotts. That just proves I don't pay attention to non Horse's. I'm sorry I brought up that subject

Now to kind of stay on Devin topic, I'd like to ask, What ever happened to the Horse factory where the real Horses were built? They still building here in Wisc? Toro stuff?

Randy

The last factory that WH had, was in South bend Indiana, and its still standing, thou I think there is another factory in there now...

Ya'll really should locate and buy and then read the Book...straight from the horses mouth. Give alot of history and info about the whos and whens and lots of great model info too!

[Operator 7]

Four Star I'll find the book, it's been on E-Bay hasn't it or is that another one about the history. I have one coming that covers more than just Wheel Horses. My old dealer buddy from Racine MN used to go and pick them up here in Wisc. someplace but that must have been a distribution point.

Randy

[fritz 1]

Hey,

I was looking for information on the factorys and the process of the manufacturing of the wheel horses. I have not found any information but I will keep looking. I will do a search on here then I will check yahoo and google. I have not found anything on Google yet though. If any one knows of any sites that would help I would greatly appreciate it. So a Toro Wheel Horse 14-38 HXL is not really a Wheel Horse. The name was just slapped on there? So it could possibl;y be compared to the Wheel Horse model A81? I think that is the correcty model.

Thank you,

Devin

[nylyon-(Admin) 7,121]

I hope this helps you: (Very large files will take some time to download, but they are WELL worth the wait.)

Final production assembly pictures

Final tooling pictures

[Docwheelhorse 2,560]

Thanks for those power point uploads.... still makes me cry too....

Tony

[Operator 7]

Thanks Karl, That was interesting!

Randy

[nylyon-(Admin) 7,121]

And of course, don't forget the song.

[IthacaJeff 151]

Devin:

This is my first contribution on the RedSquare forum, though I've been a member for a while. This is probably the topic I know most about, that is, putting together a cohesive and rationale argument. Your main premise is that Wheel Horses are better built and last longer than other tractors, so where is the data to support that argument? I would suggest you gather production numbers, that is, how many tractors were built (I believe available on RedSquare or other WH sites), and compare to how many are still in use. As it is unlikely that you can find the numbers still in use, you might have to estimate. How? One way might be to gauge popularity based on the number of member of groups (e.g., RedSquare, Yahoo WH groups), number of Ebay items for sale, and so forth. Compare these data to say, Cub Cadet or even JD (remembering that these are still in production).

Remember that popularity does not make WH a great tractor. Take, for example, the Edsel; a poorly conceived car with a now popular following. But, if you take the evidence as a whole -- long production runs with interchangeable parts from year to year, heavy guage steel components throughout, and many of the other points made by other list members -- you can create a strong case of circumstantial evidence.

And if that ain't enough, see if any other 10 hp tractor can do this! (My 310-8 at work).

Jeff in Ithaca, NY

[CasualObserver 3,406]

Devin, you may also find some useful info in the online book preview link in this thread.

http://www.wheelhorseforum.com/index.php?showtopic=320

If you need to cite source info, you should be able to get that book at your local library very easily.

[linen beige 14]

I can't believe nobody, myself included, has thought to mention the importance of the name Wheel Horse and how it came to be used.

The most even tempered, easily worked with, dependable horse in a team was hitched closest to the wagon. He was dubbed the "Wheel" horse. All the other horses in the team took their lead from him.

The Pond company invented the garden tractor. Wheel Horses are famous for their dependability and ease of use. All the others are still following that lead. A more appropriate name for their products could not have been used.

[CasualObserver 3,406]

The Pond company invented the garden tractor.

Now Jim, let's not mislead the boy. The Pond's did not "invent" the garden tractor. There were tons of two wheel garden tractors long before the first Pond was built. Keep in mind that Elmer Pond worked for his brother Harold Pond assembling Shaw Garden Tractors. Harold went on to start Speedex Garden Tractors, and Elmer went on to start Pond Garden Tractors who eventually made Wheel Horse. It's a toss-up to know who built the first four wheeled one though. Wheel Horse fans argue that it is the 1946 Pond Lever Steer, and Speedex fans argue that it is Speedex Model B. I say who knows.... but the point is by definition, neither Pond brother "invented" the garden tractor, and we wouldn't want Devin to put incorrect information into his report/speech/whatever it is.

[linen beige 14]

The four wheeled version is what I meant. I guess it would be more correct to say that the Ponds developed the first successful four wheeled garden tractor.

[Rollerman 290]

To be honest Jim....Speedex Model B's go back to 1939 & the FG in the early 40ies

The Martino book even shows Elmer turning dirt on one prior to the Lever Steer when he was working for his brother Harold selling his Speedex tractors.

Then there is the Bolens, Economy, Gibson, Jaques, Mayrath, Shaw, & probably others I'm missing.

Like Jason said...there were a lot of companies who jumped into the garden tractor market in the 40ies.....most were bigger "truck patch" sized garden tractors.

I do think Wheel Horse gets the credit for being the first to offer the down sized rideing garden tractor...the Rideaway Jr designed for a homeowner with a small garden & or yard to mow.

[linen beige 14]

most were bigger "truck patch" sized garden tractors.

I do think Wheel Horse gets the credit for being the first to offer the down sized rideing garden tractor...the Rideaway Jr designed for a homeowner with a small garden & or yard to mow.

That's the point.

Wheel Horse popularized what we know of as a garden tractor. When the Ride Away Juniors hit the market they instantly became "The one to beat". The larger ones would be called compacts.

[bitten 133]

Devin

I cant wait to see your report, I seems that you are doing a good job on the reserch part of it.

I had written a very long reply to your question, but the more I wrote the more I was thinking about apple to orenges. There is no way for me to tell.

If you get a new Wheel Horse( there is still some around) and a new box store piece of equipment you are going to spend a lot more, but would have to think that in equal use and service the Wheel Horse is going to out last 4 or 5 of the box store stuff. Things wear out, period. In my onist opinion Wheel Horse made theres to wear out at a minimum.

I have a 1969 GT14 and around here dont know of any one that has a older garden tractors.

Good luck with your report and like I said cant wait to see it.

P.J.

[T-Mo-(Moderator) 4,345]

Devin,

I also want to echo P.J.'s comments and sentiments, I applaud you for the tremendous amount of research you're doing. By the time you're done with this report, you're be the go-to guy for questions, commentary, etc.

Rollerman,

:thumbs:

[C-Series14 15]

I will go ahead and give my 2 cents worth since I have been mowing grass since I was around 9 years old. I have mowed with Bolens, JD's, and WH's. The C-160 8-speed I mowed with as a kid did 5 times the amount of work the other 2 did and it lasted twice as long. I mowed a horse farm with the C-160, that's alot of grass! Fast forward to where I live now. When I starting mowing my current yard, I had a Bolens, it was cute, tight turning radius, and mowed decent. But it kept needing parts and I needed a WH. Found a 1984 C-145 Auto and along with my yard, I ended up back at the same horse farm and mowed there for many years with several different "OLD" WH's from my collection. For the last 4 or 5 years I have mowed around 2 acres a week with a 1979 C-141 8-speed. Changing of the oil is ALL I have done to it in that time. This tractor also is used in the winter plowing snow. Looking around the neighborhood, I don't see folks mowing with the same mower they had 5 years ago. It all comes down to reliability and care. Granted, there are some who still use the same mower but it is just a matter of time because they just don't do the maintenance, how do I know? They go thru cars like they do mowers!!! I had one neighbor that was going thru a different mower each year! It sat outside year round, usually where ever he stopped mowing, and I never saw him change the oil or sharpen the blades. Maintenance is the key.

Good luck...you have alot of good info it looks like.