Transmission oil question

[scotty 252]

My b-80 3 speed says it takes 2 quarts of gear oil and and i cant get over 1 quart of oil before it overflows. i jacked it up when i drained the oil to get it out of the hump also. Wondering if there is a somthing im missing.

[Lane Ranger 10,517]

It may depend on how long you had B-80  -it is original to you as owner??

 

The transmission can have water and oil mixed in it that is gummed up at the consistency of pudding.  This can be stuck to gears and casing and keep from getting a true refill done.   Cleaning out with kerosene or diesel fuel  before refilling is one way to really remove old fluid/gear oil in transmission.

[scotty 252]

Ive had it for a year and this is the second time ive changed it in the past year. The last time i changed it it also took 1 quart.

[Racinbob 10,361]

On a level surface all the oil won't drain out. When draining hoist the front up quite a but. There's a 'hump' inside the case that the oil needs to get over. I also hoist up each rear tire to individually drain and what may be in the axle housing. I doubt that amounts to much though.

[scotty 252]

I did jack up the whole wheel horse up to about 45 degrees. Maybe that wasnt high enough?

[Racinbob 10,361]

I would certainly think it would be. You'll get a ton of conflicting comments on the capacity of these transmissions. Personally, I fill to whatever the book says for mine leaving the fill plug on and filling through the shifter hole.

Edited October 26, 2014 by Racinbob

[stevasaurus 22,237]

Actually, the manual says "may take 2 quarts".  We just did a thread discussing this topic. Like Lane said, could be crud build-up.  It is also hard to get all the oil out of the axles.

How did the oil look when you drained it the 1st time and the 2nd??  I think I usually get about 1 1/2 qts in them before the oil starts to come out the over-flow.  (these have been cleaned out, bench tested for at least 1/2 hours and the oil rechecked after that). 

[Racinbob 10,361]

Good point Steve. I forgot to mention the dipstick if it has one. The 2 quarts did take mine right to the full mark after running it for a bit. The last time this was brought up I mentioned that I filled the 5010 with 1 1/2 quarts but had second thoughts about it after we talked.

[scotty 252]

I didnt think about the axles holding oil. Thats more then likely the problem.The oil that came out looked pretty good other then some water both times. Thanks for responses!

[stevasaurus 22,237]

Ya, when I rebuild a transmission any more (unless it is locked up), I will drain it and then throw in about 2 qts of diesel and run it on the bench.  This makes cleanup much nicer.  When I drain out the diesel, I tip up the front of the trans to get the stuff that is on the other side of the hump (about 2 or more oz) and then tip the trans on one side and then the other.  The axles do hold some oil...maybe 1 or a little more oz on each side.  If you pull out your shifter, you can look down in the trans and get a good idea if things look clean, or if you have sludge build up.

 

You should not be getting any water in the trans...except maybe a little condensation in the winter.  Check out the condition of your shifter boot (this is where water usually gets in), you can still get boots from your TORO dealer...thinking about $6 or $7.  Does the horse sit outside?  Do you hose off the grass after cutting?  Sounds like you are getting water from somewhere.  Anyway, "I think", if you have a dip stick...fill to the full mark.  If not, fill until it starts to run out the fill plug...run the horse for a while and re-check at the fill plug.  Fill the trans through the shifter hole, or through one of the bolt holes where the seat and fenders bolt on.  The gears throw the oil around inside the trans, and lubricate everything (including the shift ball on the shifter)...if you overfill, I am not sure if the trans can throw the oil around like it should. 

[Don1977 604]

I  had my 312-8 transmission apart for new axle bearings and seals. With the plug out of the side oil ran out before it took two quarts.  The only oil left in it was the the little left coating the inside. I put the plug back and finished the last quart. Not sure how much I had put in when it ran out.

Edited October 26, 2014 by Don1977

[scotty 252]

The shifter boot is about a year old and doesnt have any cracks. This wheel horse sits inside and if it gets left outside a tarp fully covers the transmission. It only has a little bit of water in it. More than likely it is from condensation like you said. Sounds like i should flush it to get any kind of bad oil off of the gears. My model doesnt have a dipstick sadly. I ran it around and in every gear for a while and it still checked out full.

[boovuc 1,090]

Hi Scotty,

 

No matter what you do, when your dealing with very viscous liquids, you will never get all the fluid out that went in it per the printed specs.

Ever pour fairly viscous paint from one container to another? There is a lot left in the old container. Same is true with that gear oil and the more surfaces it coats, the more residual will be left in the transmission case. This is a good thing since that is one of the properties you want gear oil to do. Coat moving parts and stay in place!

I seldom get much more than a quart of gear oil from my 8 speeds when I change them out which includes running them until the rear-end is warmed up and jacking the front-end in the air.

[stevasaurus 22,237]

Scotty, you said you changed the oil a year ago...why did you decide to drain it this year??  How did the oil look when it came out??  If it looked pretty clean and you have new oil back in it, I would just call it good at this point.  Maybe flush it in about 3 or 4 years from now.  If that oil looked milky...OK...time to flush it out. 

[rmaynard 14,924]

As has been discussed in several other threads, you can't get 2 quarts in by filling through the plug on the left rear side. After draining all the oil out through the drain hole in the bottom, and lifting the front end to get the small amount that remains in front of the bolt hump, remove the shift lever and add 2 quarts through the shift lever hole. Since you don't have a dipstick on that transmission, there is no way to check the level. Putting 2 quarts into an empty transmission, or even one with a small amount of fluid remaining in it will not over fill it.

[scotty 252]

Well i changed it because i read somwhere the oil had to be safe for yellow metals so i got some new from walmart that said it was safe (85w-140). The oil looked quite good. Does the oil have to yellow metal safe? (Sorry for all the questions)

[rmaynard 14,924]

I use the Walmart brand in all of mine. It is fine. 

[boovuc 1,090]

Are there any brass gears and or other parts in the older 8-Speeds? With a cast-iron case, I don't know what yellow metals would be in the transmissions that would call for yellow metal safe gear oils. I just throw 80-90w gear oil in mine every decade as long as the oil looks OK in them.

[gwest_ca-(File Mod) 10,513]

Some of the gears have brass or bronze bushings in them.

 

Garry

[stevasaurus 22,237]

The cluster gear is the only one that has the bushings...both ends.    That is it for all of the 2 piece cast iron WH transmissions.  The 3 piece trannys have that and the axle and differential carriage bushings.

Edited October 28, 2014 by stevasaurus

[boovuc 1,090]

Never knew that. I should actually look at the gear oil I have used in my 8 Speeds. As I wrote above, I don't change mine often. Only if I notice any discoloring. Now I just picked up a 50 dollar 310-8 circa mid 80's with a K series motor today. I pulled the rear dipstick and sniffed it. I think I may have found where they put Jimmy Hoffa's remains! I'll be changing this oil real soon! 

[Tankman 3,515]

Only ever changed gear lube is the oil in use looks dirty. My Horses live indoors, never subject to weather unless movin' snow.

 

Clean 80w90 or 145 'bout 1-1/2 quarts is the best I've been able to do.

 

Note. UPS only uses Mobil 80w90 synthetic gear lube. Their history of vehicle maintenance proved to them, best service life.

 

A friend was racing, one race per rear. After he changed to synthetic gear lube, Mobil 1, he got three races per year. He's sold.  

[diamondred 63]

I too removed oil from the gear case and it looked like pudding. I wonder if I could boil the water out of it and save the oil.... as long as I didn't get the oil too hot???

[stevasaurus 22,237]

diamondred...you are kidding...right?  Let the pros do the recycling. 

[AMC RULES 36,954]

Are you kidding?