Dead k341

[manant 57]

I have a c160 automatic with a 16hp Kohler k341 engine.  After mowing for an hour or so the other day, engine started to belch blue smoke and went klunk!  It had been using oil and smoking on start-up, so I have been good about checking/adding oil before starting.

 

Yesterday I pulled the head off and the piston had shattered and valves bent.

1. Can the engine be repaired and/or is it worth it?

2. Is there a good replacement engine for the tractor?

3. Who needs a c160 chassis and 48" mowing deck in excellent working order, minus an engine?

 

 

[Fordiesel69 226]

Shame................

 

The piston was probably loose and after running this way for too long, finally broke a skirt.

 

To answer your question, the engine is probably toast, but you should tear it down and know for certain, they are not expensive to rebuild if you can do most of the labor yourself.

 

The only replacement for a kohler is another.

 

I would buy it right now, but you are too far.  It is worth fixing, and keeping.

[squonk 38,989]

I would look for another running 16 or 14 Horser. I had what I thought was a decent K341 to rebuild a few years ago. Took it to a machine shop to check out. The parts (including a crank ,he said was out of round and couldn't be turned) and Machine work was $900! 

Edited June 15, 2014 by squonk

[Lagersolut 613]

I never dealth with these people but found them when taking in all the options for the 10 hp kohler in my C series - specializing in Reman. short blocks -

 

 

http://shop.kustomlawnandgarden.com/WHEEL-HORSE-KOHLER-K301-12-HP-ENGINE-BLOCK-REMANUFACTURED-WH12.htm

Edited June 15, 2014 by Golds-Red

[oldredrider 2,547]

PM sent

[manant 57]

I took the engine to a machine shop and it looks like the block is OK. I plan to have the cylinder  re-bored and re-grind the valve seats. I do have to completely break down the engine and

I am having difficulty getting the flywheel off on side and the belt pulley on the other.  Any hints?   When I get it back  I will install a rebuild kit and hope for the best.

[Fordiesel69 226]

Oxy-acetalene torch.

[manant 57]

I noticed that the piston fragments that bent the valves also scored the underside if the head. Is it Ok to use the head as is or can I Dremmel the rough spots smooth?

What problems would the rough surface cause?

[Fordiesel69 226]

You can reuse the head, and clean as little as possible.  The more you grind, the more space there will be, therefore decreaseing your compression.  A little bit of damage is not going to be the end of the world.

[manant 57]

Bad news.  The upper balance gear shaft broke the cast iron holding it in. The balance gear shaft was no longer perpendicular to the cast iron body.  Unless you can rebuild and run the engine without the balance gears I am afraid its toast.  Otherwise. I have lots of good parts left.

Fordiesel69, I really appreciate your help thus far.

[oldredrider 2,547]

Take those balance gears out and throw them as far as you can. There will be no noticable difference in how the engine runs.

I remove them from every engine I go into. Saves headaches down the road.

[manant 57]

I have the engine running again!

A local man re-bored the cylinder 0.010 over and reground the valve seats.

I got a rebuild kit with piston, rings, rod, valve,s and gaskets an put all together, minus the balance gears.  It started on the third crank - I guess it took some cranks to get fuel to the carb.

All I need now is to tune the carb, and off I go!

I appreciate the helpful hints provided.

[Fordiesel69 226]

How does the bottom end sound?  Any knocking? 

 

You got super lucky on this one.  The balance gear stud is a blessing that it got broke.  It would have probably taken out your #2 rebuilt as well.

[manant 57]

The engine sounds great. No knocking.  The fellow who re-bored the engine has done a bunch of them over the years and has rebuilt them for pulling.  He made sure my ring gaps were correct and checked some other tolerances (rod to crank side clearance, crank to bearing clearance, etc.) He said the good balance gear stud in the block was still tight, so we left it in.  He just tapped the bad shaft hole and put in an Allen plug.

 

I almost messed up yesterday.  The governor arm was not as tight as it should have been and the engine started revving to high. I shut it down quickly when it started revving.  It did it several times until I figured out what was happening.   I reset the governor and tightened it correctly, and got it running smoothly and was mowing when the engine stopped.  I thought I blew the head gasket, but I re-torqued the head bolts and it is working fine again.  I knew I needed to re-torque the bolts but did not know how soon to do it.  My guess is it should have been after the first engine heat up/cool down. The engine does seem to vibrate a little more without the balance gears but it is barely noticeable.

 

How do you set the high end engine speed?  I do not have Tach.  I saw on this site a way to measure the RPMs with a mulitmeter and a wire wrapped around the spark plug wire, but my readings were too erratic to get any conclusions. I tried it first on my Troybuilt tiller with a K161 engine, because I knew that engine was running correctly.  I think my Craftsman meter is too sensitive. I hate to buy a Tinytach just to set the speed one time.

I appreciate your interest and previous help on getting the flywheel off.

[MaineDad 85]

Did you put the high speed bracket stop back on when you rebuilt the engine?

[manant 57]

I did attach the high speed stop bracket, but do not know where to set it for the correct rpms. It is about where it was for the original engine,

[jackhammer 544]

Having 4 tractors I got this at ama  zon.     Im sure their are a bunch of different ones out there

I just set it on top of the engine  asnd as you say arap the wire 5 times.

 

Other members will chime in

Good luck

 

SenDec Surface-Mount Hour Meter with Tachometer, Model# 806-100-1032

 

Rick

[manant 57]

Thanks for the info.  I had just ordered a less expensive unit which I hope will do the trick. Unfortunately it comes from China and will take a few weeks to get here.

In the meantime I have set the high RPMs low and used the Tractor for an hour yesterday.

[manant 57]

^{I got the Tach and it seemed to work OK on my K161 engine with a magneto, but when I switched to the k341 with  coil it does not read accurately.  I set the unit to the specified mode and it was showing idle speed at 2500rpm  and running speed of 5000.}

^{I emailed the company with a detailed account and asked some specific questions such as how many wire wraps on the spark wire and they sent back a message for me to read the paper instructions. I think I will read the instructions for returns.}

[oldredrider 2,547]

The magneto ignition fires every revolution. A coil/points set up on Kohler fires every other revolution. There is nothing wrong with the tach.

Your readings indicate it is idling at 1250 rpm and WOT is 2500 rpm.

Adjust your carb/linkage to correspond for the difference and you're good to go.

[manant 57]

The tach has three settings.  I had it on the "03" setting for spark every other revolution. Regardless it was erratic and would not hold a RPM reading.  If I moved the tach three inches in any direction, I would get different readings. I had the wire wrap up next to the plug end and I plan to move the wire wrapping toward the middle of the spark plug wire (half way between the plug and coil) to see if that makes a difference. I have tried different number of wraps and even tried no wrap, just held to the plug wire with a clothes pin, still get erratic readings. I plan to keep at it.

[oldredrider 2,547]

Check out this post. SOI has the answer to tach readings IF you have a meter that reads Hertz.

The wire wrap tachs are a bit tricky...until you discover the trick...trial and error.

[manant 57]

Thanks for the input.  I have tried the multimeter procedure.  With the meter set on Hz I get a reading three feet away from the engine without any wire connection at all.  I have tried just touching the meter lead to the plug wire, wrapping the lead around the wire etc. Regardless I get inconsistent, erratic readings.  I will just keep experimenting until get this thing right, with the tach or the multimeter.  Thanks again for the input.  Reqardless, I DO NOT HAVE A DEAD K341 anymore.  It is on my c160 and running again. I just have to be careful how high I rev the engine.  I do want it right though.

[Road-Track 39]

I run the mini tachs on both of my tractors. I found that if your readings are fluctuating you need to check a few things. On my 14hp the carb needed to cleaned and blown out with compressed air. After that the fluctuation stopped and I could adjust the high and low idles. On the 16hp I found the governor was causing the searching by watching the linkage. I reset the sensitivity by changing the spring holes and readjusting the length of the throttle arm linkage to the same length as the 14hp. Both run very smoothly now.

 

Would have never known without the use of a tachometer.

 

Hope this helps

[manant 57]

I ended up buying a Briggs & Stratton tach that works off of engine vibrations.  It reads either Hz or RPM's.  It is a simple concept where you turn the dial that extends a wire sensor and you read the dial when the wire is at the greatest vibration. I now have the idle at 1300 and open throttle at 3000.

 

I thank all who have helped with my project. It looked hopeless at first, but the engine is humming now.