Jump to content
mowerman1193

Any Electrical Knowledge Here?

Recommended Posts

mowerman1193

Lost power in the storms the other night. I have a 5000 Watt. gen. Anyone know if I could back feed from my air comperesor 240V outlet in the barn and shut my breaker power off in the house? Only long enough to run my well pump for 15-20 Min. so I could flush the toilet and run some water in the tub for futur flushes. Pump is wired in... but I thought I would buy a plug for it to plug into my genny. Then got my crazy idea above that would save me from unwiring it hooking up a plug to run it a few min. etc.

Thanks for any advice.

Kevin

They say might be 3+ more days before power is restored.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 
nylyon

Does your generator put out 240V?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 
squonk

oops read it wrong. Thought you wanted to run the compressor. Why not just plug the well pump into a cord and plug it into the gen? Much safer.

Edited by squonk

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 
nylyon

Kevin, as you probably know, it's dangerous and illegal to back feed your home with a generator, there are however, many posts on the internet which will tell you how do do it.  IF you elect to follow those posts be sure, 100% certain, that the main's are shut OFF to protect those working on the restoration of the power and to protect you should power come back on while you are back feeding.

 

If your generator is only 120V, I would advise against trying to run any 240V equipment such as a well pump.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 
mowerman1193

My well pump is wired direct with no plug. Yes genny has 240 outlets. I am in town now so I think I will just pick up a plug to wire up to my pump. pump is also 240. Just thought it would quicker and easier to back feed through my compressor outlet..

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 
squonk

Plugging your pump in directly to  the genny will reduce voltage drop from a long electrical circuit (example genny in barn and pump in house ect) That pump will draw increased wattage at start up so you will need all the voltage you can get. What I would do is when the power is back on and their is no emergency, and if a permanent stand by jenny with the proper transfer switches is out of the question, I would wire an outlet near the pump so you can plug the pump in. Then go to an electric supply house and buy like either an #10 or #8 cable and make a super heavy extension cord with the proper ends and have the cord ready for the next emergency.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 
CRE1992

First off as Karl said, back feeding is illegal. However many of us have done it because of emergencies. Secondly your 5000w generator only puts out about 20.8 amps at 240volts if I remember correctly. So go check your breaker panel and find out what breaker is protecting your well pump and see the amp rating on it. I can honestly say you will probably stall that generator flat out if your well draws 20 or more amps at 240volts. As during start up the inrush of current on the well is greater that of which is normally runs after starting.

 

Also the correct plug for your generator if it is indeed a 4 prong connector is a L14-20P to plug into the generator. And good luck finding one because mostly everyone is looking for one right now. It took me 4 days after Hurricane Sandy to find the correct plug for my generator. However my grandfather who was an electrician thankfully had a 3 phase 4 prong twist lock plug which I was able to modify.

Edited by CRE1992
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 
flyovrcntry

The squirrel will enlighten you.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 
mowerman1193

Well I got home to find the power was back on.. I did think about the amps that the pump draws and was not sure what amp breaker I had. Something I am going to look into.. I can deal with the power outages usually I run a bathtub full of water etc. and don't usually have the power off long enough to need a generator. This time I was running my tub full of water when the power went off, so I didn't get much water.. Anyway I have power now and I am going to research what I need to have to hook up the generator when that need arises next time I will be prepared.

 

Thanks for all the comments and suggestions..

Kevin 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 
flyovrcntry

But why not just turn the main breaker off and jump it there.

We had bad wind sturm a couple years ago and the power was off for several day's.I had my generaor humming,running the icebox and a few lights.You knew which houses had a generator at night.I was sitting outside one night,had just changed oil and gassed up the generator.I was looking around and noticed my neighbors porch light.I thought,well it's about time he broke down and bought a generator.I guess you know where this is going.I had been running my generator for about two hours after the power came back on  :banghead:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 
cleat

There is now a unit that plugs in between your meter and the meter base that allows you to connect your generator legally. I am looking into one of these for my place which I now illegally back feed.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 
CRE1992

Well I got home to find the power was back on.. I did think about the amps that the pump draws and was not sure what amp breaker I had. Something I am going to look into.. I can deal with the power outages usually I run a bathtub full of water etc. and don't usually have the power off long enough to need a generator. This time I was running my tub full of water when the power went off, so I didn't get much water.. Anyway I have power now and I am going to research what I need to have to hook up the generator when that need arises next time I will be prepared.

 

Thanks for all the comments and suggestions..

Kevin 

 

But why not just turn the main breaker off and jump it there.

We had bad wind sturm a couple years ago and the power was off for several day's.I had my generaor humming,running the icebox and a few lights.You knew which houses had a generator at night.I was sitting outside one night,had just changed oil and gassed up the generator.I was looking around and noticed my neighbors porch light.I thought,well it's about time he broke down and bought a generator.I guess you know where this is going.I had been running my generator for about two hours after the power came back on  :banghead:

 

 

There is now a unit that plugs in between your meter and the meter base that allows you to connect your generator legally. I am looking into one of these for my place which I now illegally back feed.

 

If all of you are looking for a cheap and legal way to power your house using a generator, I recommend going with an interlock kit designed to go on your electrical panel.

They are not hard to do, but if you have doubts I recommend hiring someone to do it. You can buy what you need ahead of time and thus save them from having to get it. Parts wise including interlock kit, 100ft 10/3 romex wire, 25 feet of 10-4 SOOW for generator cord 2 ends one female one male. L14-20 ends for 20 amp generator or L14-30 ends if you have a 30 Amp generator. And a generator power inlet box. Parts wise this endeavor will run you about $300-$350 if bought from an electrical supply house. Then add whatever for installation.

 

Also you have the ability to run any circuit in your house though I recommend only turning on the ones you need.

 

Take a look at this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n7DkaorEQPQ

Edited by CRE1992

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 
flyovrcntry

I think the most convenient way is to pull the meter and jump it right there.Then it doesn't matter when they turn the power back on,you won't have a problem.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 
Sparky

I think the most convenient way is to pull the meter and jump it right there.Then it doesn't matter when they turn the power back on,you won't have a problem.

  Really?? The homeowner is not allowed in the meter socket here in Connecticut, and even if you were that's another illegal hookup. I find it hard to believe thats allowed anywhere (willing to bet its not allowed in any state). The interlock setup is the best method on the market right now and its totally legal. There is absolutely no way a mistake could be made and power back-fed to the lines. I have an older setup in my house, its a 200amp whole house manual transfer switch. If I'm not home my son, wife, father, father-in-law etc....can use it and there's no chance it can get screwed up.

  When the word illegal is thrown around to describe these hook-ups its not done to label the hook-up but to assign blame. If you were to hook-up an illegal generator setup and you (or your wife, son, father, father-in-law..etc...) screws up and backfeeds a line and someone gets hurt or killed YOU are liable! Any money you saved will be surpassed by the lawsuit.

  It amazes me that guys will go out and plop down big money on a generator and then cheap out on the hook-up.

 Mike..........

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 
rmaynard

Well said Mike. The lineman have a tough job as it is when there is a massive power outage, and to even think that someone may be backfeeding a line they are trying to repair is, well, unthinkable.

 

I just installed (with the assistance of a licensed electrician) a whole-house generator this past summer for a customer. The automatic switching devices are fool-proof, and well worth the money they cost.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 
nylyon

I think that the interlock cost me like $150, add another $25 for the breaker and $50 or so for the wire and $25 for the outlet and your good to go.  Hardest part was running the wire.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 
Sparky

I think that the interlock cost me like $150, add another $25 for the breaker and $50 or so for the wire and $25 for the outlet and your good to go.  Hardest part was running the wire.

Exactly! For a $250 investment you now have peace of mind that anyone can use your generator without an issue.

Mike............

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 
flyovrcntry

Yeah,that's a nice set up if that's what you choose to do.Myself I don't have a fear of electric and don't want to install something I will prob never use.

We don't have prolonged power outages very often,in the past 10 years I have been without power less than 7 days.

And I don't call the building and zoning everytime I want to do something.

You wont have a feedback of power with the meter out or the main turned off.We don't have to notify someone if we turn our main breaker off,and I do that myself without an electrician.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 
shorts

I'm not bashful about doing my own electrical work, to  turn off the main and work inside the box is relatively safe especially if you cover the hot wires that feed the main with cardboard while you are in the box, or in my case I just turn off the disconnect at the meter box, 320A service with 2 200A disconnects one for the house and one for the garage.

 

To cut the wire seal and pull the meter opens up a legal can of worms about bypassing the meter that can get real expensive real fast, If you have a legitamite need to remove the meter your best bet is to have a licensed electrician pull it, make the repair reinstall the meter and call to have it resealed right away

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 
CRE1992

Well said Mike. The lineman have a tough job as it is when there is a massive power outage, and to even think that someone may be backfeeding a line they are trying to repair is, well, unthinkable.

 

I just installed (with the assistance of a licensed electrician) a whole-house generator this past summer for a customer. The automatic switching devices are fool-proof, and well worth the money they cost.

 

Actually you would be surprised the automatic switching transfer switches maybe fool proof, but an interlock switch is a lot more fool proof plus, an interlock switch has no expensive circuit boards which go bad. The whole automatic transfer switch is great for convenience but I would rather have a manual interlock. Also those are not the only circuit boards that go bad. The circuit board that tells the generator to start up weekly for exercising can go bad on homeowner units and make it run 24/7.

 

I worked as an electrician's apprentice for 3 years and ran into problems like this more often that you would think. We had one 2 year old generac unit whose circuit board got fried (unknown reason) making the gen run 24/7 for 2 days before the home owner realized it was the generator running. The gas shut of valve by the generator was so rusted that you couldn't turn it we had to turn off the natural gas at the meter and let it run until it starved all of the gas out of the lines and stalled. Then it began to crank over and over again trying to start. So we disconnected the battery and ended that fiasco lol. That circuit board cost $450 btw.

 

Kind of a worse case scenario.

 

Also for anyone looking at installing a whole house generator I recommend you go with a Kohler generator not a Generac. The generacs seem hit or miss from what I have seen.

 

Personally I have 3 Kohler 4 cylinder water cooled generators which run at 1800rpm so they use less fuel, they are quiet and can run 24/7 for days on end. Though I wouldn't do that. They can be hooked up to natural gas/propane or run on gasoline. I plan on getting a little honda EU2000i to run the fridge and furnace at night.

 

Here is one of my Kohler 7.5C62's. They produce 7.5kw and are very simple to work on, just like a big version of a kohler k series just water cooled. Plus I have 3 of them for what a decent portable runs now. $400x3=$1200. They are also compact only 22" wide and about 42" long. But they weigh like 500lbs haha.

 

AF5C4B79-A866-48E7-9C3F-2D271021D639-265

456B3B8A-828F-49AD-9FB6-86ACA70CF9B4-631

8CC09CE5-D2C0-4646-BAE3-45BBC17B9B74-631FCDD0673-A62D-4331-B44D-A4290C252015-631

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 
shorts

CRE1992

 

I have to agree, the all electronic controlled gen sets are convenient, but I like the reliability of a manual switchgear and 1800rpm engine with magneto ignition and gear drive mechanical governor turning an old fashioned generator with brushes, multi fuel is also good.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×
×
  • Create New...