D series plow on a 416????

[Hodge71 663]

So if I take my Dads extra rear tach-a-matic and put it on my 416 hydro, can I take the 54" plow from my 1973 18 auto boat anchor and mount it on my 416. I know that the angle arms wont be in the right place to angle the blade but other than that will it work? I have 8 inches of snow on my driveway and my 1/8 mile private road that needs to go. I talked to a plow guy today and he told me $300 to do both.... . I politiely told him to take a long walk of a short pier. So is this swap feasible?????

[Trouty56 565]

I don't know how much longer the D series is but there is a place to move the rear cross shaft forward on the a frame. Probably have to pull the pins and put them on the outside so the rear attach is on the inside maybe. Rig it up and try it.

[Hodge71 663]

Bob, The A frame on my plow looks exactly like the late c series a frame. It does have another set of holes forward of the rear ones. I honestly dont think I need them though. So either I was lied to about the plow too, or they use the same frame. My D tach-a-matic is in front of my axle where as the c series is behind/below the rear axle. So I think if I use chain from the lift link to the plow lift I should be ok. I will have to get off the tractor to angle the blade but it might get me out of this jam.

[CRE1992 135]

Try it and let us know!! I've been wondering the same thing...

[1maidenfan 201]

Why are you calling your 18 auto a boat anchor? I have one and it works great. Just curious.

[Trouty56 565]

Well then give it a go.....and plow that snow.....!!! That 416 will love that big plow.....lol

[Hodge71 663]

Maiden,

Boat anchor pretty much describes it as it sits. I got my call from my hydro guy yesterday and I'm looking at probably $1000 minimum to fix it, the pump is shot. The swash plate is galled because it was run out of oil. Most likely when the o-rings were blown out. Its so bad that it cant be polished out and Sundstrand made them specifically for the Wheel Horse D. Theres no other interchangeability. Its covered under an different post that I have open in transmissions. I bought the D for a plow tractor and theres no way it will be done, especially because I have 8 inches of snow that I need to clear. Its sittting undr a tarp full of snow in my back yard. Its been a long haul and I may just part it out after I visit my hydro guy on Monday.

[can whlvr 991]

so if i were you i would allready have it hooked up,the only way to really know is go try it

[Hodge71 663]

Don,

If I had a garage I would have. But its 9 degrees right now and my son doesnt feel good. We even missed a hockey game tonight cuz hes under the weather. Tomorrow morning I will begin the process

[Kelly 1,028]

I think it will fit , but as you stated the angle handle will not be in the right spot.

[ericj 1,576]

i had a D160 that had the pump trashed from being run dry on oil and was told by just about everyone that D series hydro were D's only, till i talked to my dads old dealer he told me to bring him a pump and motor off any wheel horse sunstrand. he took one from a c120 took it apart and made it work, tractor ran great. so all you need to fix your d is a sunstrand out of a c series tractor good luck

[Trouty56 565]

I've thought the swash plates and pistons look the same. Even the housings look the same. Good post ericj.....

I have a pump and motor from a c for that very reason....possibly some parts may work.

[Rollerman 290]

D's would be geared differently, but the guts should be that same with exception of the final drive on the hydro motor & anything unique to the D's manifold setup.

[Hodge71 663]

Stephen,

I know there are definite gearing differences as the D's have a top speed of 7.3f and 3.0r and the C is around 6.3f and 2.5r. How would the pump from a C work on a D? I'm just lost as to how the swash plates could interchange. Gear ratio should be controlled by the hydro motor internals. Am I correct in assuming this? I guess maybe I will understand more once I see my stuff tomorrow.

[Trouty56 565]

The swash plate is just a smooth surface for the small pistons to compress and expand upon as they suck up fluid and and then push out fluid either causing pressure, the pump, or releasing pressure, the motor. Finding a C series pump will have the movable swash plate and some spare pistons if you need any. If the faces of these become scarred they will need to be replaced also. The motor has a swash plate right on the cover. This is what is replaced upside down at times resulting in the tractor going in reverse when the lever is forward.

I don't believe there is any gearing other than the drive gear on the back of the motor that transfers the rotation to the tranny.

If indeed they are the same plates and pistons this could be the news to save the day.

I'm just taking a stab at this Jeff. It is worth looking into to me.

[refracman 166]

The pump and motor on a C are bolted together, not so on a D, that is where the manifold comes into play. Your local NAPA dealer can get you the Orings needed to install the manifold

Same pump and motor. The D pump might have a higher volume but basicly are the same.

The brass plates you can have them faced down 30 thousands to remove scoreing before they are unuseable.

[Hodge71 663]

Well the D series plow does fit the 416 and it pushes pretty damn good too. Now that I see this, its just one more reason for me to scrap the D. I'm going to ponder on this further today and see. I always wanted a D since I was able to read my dads 1974 ABCD's of tractoring brochure. But sentimentality unfortunately isnt going to pay the money needed to fix this hydro. I guess I can use it as a learning experience on people and the right way to buy a tractor. I guess I'll see how I feel tomorrow after my trip to the hydro doctor.....

[Hodge71 663]

Heres some after pics of my drive and road too. Took me about and hour and a half but I must say this thing pushes snow awesome!!!!

[Kelly 1,028]

You plowed that WHOLE road in the first pic? your nuts buy a beater truck with a plow, I like plowing with my tractors, but there is a point I would have to say no.

[Sparky-(Admin) 19,580]

I think he only cleared the driveway Kelly, just showed the road to show how much snow fell.

Thats what I think anyway.

Mike.............

[Rollerman 290]

Stephen,

I know there are definite gearing differences as the D's have a top speed of 7.3f and 3.0r and the C is around 6.3f and 2.5r. How would the pump from a C work on a D? I'm just lost as to how the swash plates could interchange. Gear ratio should be controlled by the hydro motor internals. Am I correct in assuming this? I guess maybe I will understand more once I see my stuff tomorrow.

Jeff you pulled your D160 hydro motor off the trans case right?

The gearing between the motor & the trans is lower on the D's (& GT 14's) on account of the taller rubber.

Don't give up on the D yet, you may want to keep your eyes out for a parts machine.

IMOP with a D....you really need a parts unit too.

Parts are just not as common as the smaller Horses.

Good job on the plowing :text-coolphotos:

[Hodge71 663]

Kelly,

I guess I'm nuts. I did plow the whole road and my driveway. My iPhone makes the pics look a whole lot worse than it is, more panoramic I guess. Its really only about 20 feet wide and 1/8 mile long. The section in front of my house is paved, the section around the bend isn't. That was the whole reason I wanted this 18 auto in the first place, I plow quite a bit. I am actually going a set of bolt on "ears" for this plow like the full size plows have to keep the pile in front of it a bit more. It will be just shy of 66" when I'm done.

Rollerman,

This was a parts machine to start with, The problem is I didnt know that when I bought it. I should have spent more time researching a real operating D. I wouldnt be in this position. Hindsight is always 20/20 and I was in this thing for the long haul. Then I saw how my 416 pushed the snow. Its a shame, the 18 auto itself isnt bad other than rust, dents etc. from the abuse its seen. The hydro was the only problem so far that has the potential cost me a ton of cash. Unfortunately I didnt think it was that bad until after I tore the tractor down to the engine and frame to repaint it all. I should have found out how bad the hydro was before I sunk all this time and money into bodywork and paint. Experience is what you get right after you need it......

[Kelly 1,028]

I have a hydro pump I'd sell from a D was working when pulled if your interested send me a PM.

[can whlvr 991]

glad to hear you got the plow on,the 416 is one of the best machines out therevery capable,good luck on that d tranny,maybe a good used one is the way to go and keep the old one incase of parts needed later,good luck

[73-18 automatic 8]

The D tranny is the same as a C series the difference is one is called a divorced hydro (pump and motor are seperate D series) and (the other the pump and motor are together C series)