Dad was right all along...

[Horse-Drawn 1]

After today's events, I had to call my dad and apologize. In my youth, he always yelled at me for leaving the B-80's key on. "Don't leave that on, you'll burn up the points!" I think what he meant to say, but in a much less scary way, is that... Assuming "today is your lucky day" & you kill the engine with the points in the closed position, you'll burn up the coil if the key is left on. As an adult, trained in the field, I know this...

Today, the kids were riding the same B-80 around in the snow, taking turns pulling each other on the tube. After they were done, they parked in back in the garage. Somehow the key was left on & it was my "lucky day." As my wife came home from the store, she noticed smoke rolling from my garage. "Get outside! The garage is on fire!" NOT what I wanted to hear. I almost threw up when I came around the corner and saw smoke rolling from the windows and vents. Besides the 2 WH's and a Polaris 800 4x4, a machine shop & a lifetime worth of tools were in there. I opened the door to find no fire! Just oil spraying & smoke pouring from under the B-80's hood. After a moment of confusion, I realized what was going on & why. The key was left on & the coil not only overheated, but exploded. I have an extra, so not a huge deal there. But there was a huge oily mess covering the tractor, my Polaris & a good 10x10' area on concrete. I decided to make this a learning experience instead of my first thought of strangling them. Now they know why I repeat their grandfather's famous line every time they use the B-80.

No major damage today, but I swear I just aged 10 years. :thumbs:

[Horse'n Around 22]

Wow, That had to be really terrifying,I bet in addition to the 10 years you also gained a few extra gray hairs too. Im glad that the damage was so minimal. This is something that could easily happen to anyone of us . I know that after hearing this I will be even more careful to make sure the key is off and even out of the switch.

John

[neil 2,398]

tha main thing is you are all ok and the tractors are are ok and the house isnt burnt down.

I had a similar problem by l3eaving the ignition on

i have a b111 that my wife was using one particular day and she got off the tractor and left the ignition on, off coarse the battery drained but when i went to start it again i turned the key NOTHING so now i have to jump across the solonoid to start

what do you think might wrong would something have blown

its a briggs engine and im no not hot on electrical things

[mavfreak 11]

Here is something you may want to try and that is put a couple small hooks up and hang the keys on there.

Thats how I learned when I was ten

At least its a life lesson learned and not a life lose or anything else

[rmaynard 14,909]

The tractor gods were with you. They just gave you a warning this time. Could have been much worse. I'm glad no one was hurt, and no major damage was done.

Edit: Post number 2,379

[Horse-Drawn 1]

Good point with the small hooks...

I told them that, unless it's running, the key stays in my pocket & they have no reason to use it if I'm not home. Maybe, after my blood pressure returns to normal, we'll try the hook. <_<

As part of my "retraining program", I explained to them that it would take them a decade or more @ several hundred dollars a month to replace what could've been lost. And that would've only covered the things that could be replaced. We're all a little wiser in my house now, lol.

I definitely feel lucky. If she hadn't come home when she did, I know the end result would've been devastating.

[sscotsman 132]

Wow! thats quit a story..

glad things turned out mostly ok..(well, better than it might have been!)

Does this key issue apply to ANY tractor? or only specific ones?

I have a key in my 854..when I turn it off, I first throttle it all the way down, it idles very slowly, but the engine wont turn off completely that way, so I turn it off with the key..but I have never removed the key from the switch..never knew I should!

(I have only owned the tractor a few months)

guess I better start removing the key!

thanks for the warning..I never even heard of anything like this before.

Scot

[Horse-Drawn 1]

You can leave the key in the switch, but it should be in the off position. As several of us noted, you can be sure the ignition is off by removing the key, lol.

MY issue should only apply to tractors with points and "wet" coils. ...The pop can sized ones. Other ignition types will not cause the same end result if left on, but will drain your battery.

The other hazard of leaving it on applies to non-hydro types. If the key is on and the trans is in gear, it can be push started with out you in the seat.

[tunahead72 2,343]

I told them that, unless it's running, the key stays in my pocket & they have no reason to use it if I'm not home. Maybe, after my blood pressure returns to normal, we'll try the hook. <_<

You're a wise and patient man, Jay, kudos for being able to think logically at a time like that.

I went through a period a bunch of years ago with my daughter, who was probably 4 or so at the time. She used to sit on the WH while it was parked in the shed and pretend to drive it (can't blame her for that!), and she got in the habit of turning the key on and would occasionally leave it like that when she got off. Of course, I didn't know what was going on then, all I knew was that my battery kept dying for some reason.

It never occurred to me that anything as potentially dangerous as what you're describing could have happened. I'm glad that nothing TOO horrible happened in your case, you'll get through it.

Thanks for sharing this story with all of us, I learn something new from this forum every time I get on!

And thank your dad for sharing with YOU!

[corn53 4]

:thumbs: for the insight!!! I`m glad everyone is fine.

[wheelhorse656 20]

I told them that, unless it's running, the key stays in my pocket & they have no reason to use it if I'm not home.

[Coadster32 793]

Wow! quite a story. Glad everything worked out ok for you. I thought it was cute, and helpful to have my kids (4 and 2) help me put lights on the 854. They learned how to turn them on, and I let them do it while I was in the garage with them. Of course, it was left in the run position, and killed the battery. (sound like it could have been worse). I sisnce keep the keys out of the tractor. I'm still a bit miffed on which coil this would happen to though.

[Horse-Drawn 1]

this kind... it's oil cooled.

ignitioncoil by Horse-Drawn, on Flickr

If the points are closed, the coil is "charging" and building heat. It was not designed to be "on" all the time. It will, by my guess, take around 20min. to overheat & POP. Boiling oil will spray about 10' if not restricted (on my B-80, it's not). Then the coil will ignite the remaining oil inside of the housing.

[Coadster32 793]

Thanks for the pic, and explanation. From the outside, it looks pretty much the same as a normal coil. Is there a way to tell besided labels?

[rmaynard 14,909]

I have grandsons that play on my tractors all the time. But since mine won't turn over without the clutch being depressed, and their little legs are too short to reach the pedals, I have always felt safe. However, I never gave the exploding coil a thought.

Now, all keys are hanging on a nail out of the reach of little hand.

[JC 1965 1,528]

I remember reading somewhere that if you leave the key in the ignition switch in the on position, it can also damage the regulator/rectifier. Maybe someone that knows more about it will chime in. Anyway glad you didn't have anymore damage and especially that no one was hurt. :thumbs:

[tgranthamfd 28]

I left the key on, on mine, yesterday. By chance, wondered back out to the shed and realized what I had done, and the coil was extremely hot. found this post and now understand why it was so hot. Luckily not damaged here. Thanks for this post and hope all will be ok with your horse.

[stroker 0]

ignition system on these old tractors are what isknown as a 'kettering" type, i do realize the manufacturers of these small engins overlooked an important component with this type of ignition. THE SERIES CURRENT LIMITER RESISTOR. if you are an old tymer you probably remember this resistor as a white block mounted on the firewall of old cars. IMPORTANT component, it prevents point burning under normal use and probably would prevent coil blowout should key get left on. i always install one on any point system. see your napa dealer for one.

[corn53 4]

I just acquired a new . I was trying to get her running so I started cleaning the carb. I touched the coil and noticed she was hot. I remembered this post and sure enough I left the switch on. I couldnt believe how hot it was.

[corn53 4]

:thumbs:

[sgtsampay 117]

Very good information to know. Never knew that about coils..

[TT-(Moderator) 1,128]

the manufacturers of these small engins overlooked an important component with this type of ignition. THE SERIES CURRENT LIMITER RESISTOR

OEM Kohler coils have an internal resistor. :thumbs:

[tunahead72 2,343]

I got lucky ... this time.

I ran out of gas yesterday, just as I was finishing mowing my back yard. I was close enough to be able to push my 310-8 into the shed and park it for the evening.

This morning, I went back out to fill up the gas tank and check the fluids, and to scratch my head a little about how to fix my hood hinges. As I moved around the tractor, I had this feeling that something was wrong, but I couldn't quite place it.

I started looking at things more closely, and finally realized that my voltmeter was reading somewhere in the middle of the gauge. The fact that it was indicating anything at all meant that my ignition was on, and that I had forgotten to turn it off after the engine sputtered to a stop the night before, and it had been on all night long!

But wait, wasn't there just a thread on RedSquare about coils overheating and possibly exploding because some guy left his ignition on too long?

I checked the coil, carefully, and fortunately found that it was cool to the touch, and my faithful Wheel Horse started easily and seems to be fine.

No lectures from me, I'm using the hook from now on.

[Save Old Iron 1,563]

But wait, wasn't there just a thread on RedSquare about coils overheating and possibly exploding because some guy left his ignition on too long?

The overheating coil issue is only true if

your tractor ignition is coil based

and

the engine happens to stop at a point in its rotation where the points are closed.

If you have a tractor which has a magneto based ignition system, an overheating coil is not possible.

Why ? First you don't have an ignition coil and second, there is no power hookup to a magneto to allow it to overheat.

[Save Old Iron 1,563]

the coil was extremely hot. found this post and now understand why it was so hot.

12 volt ignition coils usually have internal resistances of around 3 to 4 ohms.

This resistance will allow about 4 amps of current to flow thru the coil and at 12 volts x 4 amps

that is about 50 watts or a little less than a 60 watt light bulb as far as heating.