Briggs V-Twin swap/PTO question

[ebinmaine 72,450]

3 hours ago, Lee1977 said:

Vanguard fits in a C-series.

Appreciate the pics Don.  

 

How's the tone and decibel level of that muffler?

Looks good.  

 

[Lee1977 7,190]

It's not quite but it got rid of the loud annoying sounds. I think it sound good, might be too loud for some, I worked in a weave room for a couple of years 60 years ago. I don't think it's louder then my 520

 

[kpinnc 14,588]

On 5/26/2023 at 5:15 PM, Lee1977 said:

Couple more pioctures of how close the Vanguard fits in a C-series.

 

Don how close is the breather to your hood? I know I've seen the tractor in person, but I didn't pay attention.

[ebinmaine 72,450]

2 hours ago, kpinnc said:

 

Don how close is the breather to your hood? I know I've seen the tractor in person, but I didn't pay attention.

 

Are all the Briggs Vanguard engines the same basic size?

 

[Lee1977 7,190]

5 hours ago, kpinnc said:

 

Don how close is the breather to your hood? I know I've seen the tractor in person, but I didn't pay attention.

 

3 hours ago, ebinmaine said:

 

Are all the Briggs Vanguard engines the same basic size?

 

I have to warp the hood to get it closed. When it come down it's around 1" off on the flywheel side. If you look close at the pictures the hood doesn't come all the way back on the dash when closed,

All the V-twins up to the 16, 18. 23 HP are close to the same size. The height stays colse to the same, the width and lenght chanes a couple of inches. My 18 went in where the 16 was it was tight with the 16.

Did a little work on the engine mount.

[peter lena 9,239]

@Lee1977  good thoughts there , notice your fuel line layout  inside those frame rails ?  just a brain fart , pete

[ebinmaine 72,450]

I took a few minutes to pop the air cleaner off and find the ID label. 

Appears to be a 1997 model year. 

 

 

 

We're sporting a 2 BBL carb here. 

 

 

[kpinnc 14,588]

17 hours ago, ebinmaine said:

We're sporting a 2 BBL carb here. 

 

I got one of those!

 

Hope to get it working next week!

 

BTW I have an adapter for these carbs to use flex hose for a remote filter if you're interested. I forgot about it until finding it in a box the other day. Best pic I got- it's taped up but you get the idea...

 

 

Edited June 18, 2023 by kpinnc

[ebinmaine 72,450]

4 hours ago, kpinnc said:

BTW I have an adapter for these carbs to use flex hose for a remote filter if you're interested

Ya know I may very well need that. 

Would you PM or email me with details?

 

[Lee1977 7,190]

This is the breather I had on the 16, it will go under the hood of a c-series.

It's just a couple 1/4" aluminum plates. I also has a couple of 1/2 PVC pipe spacers under it where it's bolted down. Don't remember the length 5/8" or 3/4".

 

[ebinmaine 72,450]

Found this adapter plate that I was reminded of by something @Lee1977 said. 

 

 

@Sparky gave it to me a year or three ago.  

 

Given an adjustment to the holes it should work for a Briggs V-Twin adapter.  

 

[Lee1977 7,190]

Looks to have the holes to to bolt down to a standard Kohler big block mount.  You can mount it with that plate but the PTO placement will be farther to the front. 

The Vanguard hole need to be closer to the back Kohler holes if you want to used the 7473 drive belt and keep the original location of the PTO.

[kpinnc 14,588]

2 hours ago, Lee1977 said:

The Vanguard hole need to be closer to the back Kohler holes if you want to used the 7473 drive belt and keep the original location of the PTO.

 

I think mine sits a bit further forward than Don's. The Onan adapter plate may have the PTO loop slightly forward as well.

 

 

 

[ebinmaine 72,450]

7 hours ago, kpinnc said:

 

I think mine sits a bit further forward than Don's. 

Did you use the stock 7473 belt?

[Lee1977 7,190]

Are you using one of the Tecumseh power tractors? That plate you have has a Kohler bolt pattern, are they the same on the Tecumseh?

I just checked the Toro parts viewer the frames have the same parts number. 

 

Edited July 5, 2023 by Lee1977

[ebinmaine 72,450]

3 minutes ago, Lee1977 said:

Are you using one of the Tecumseh power tractors? That plate you have has a Kohler bolt pattern, are they the same on the Tecumseh?

I just checked the Toro parts viewer the frames have the same parts number. 

 

 

I was going to put it in a formerly Kohler powered C160 8 speed tractor. 

 

That the frames are the same though because I may swap the engines around later.

 

 

[kpinnc 14,588]

5 hours ago, ebinmaine said:

Did you use the stock 7473 belt?

 

I honestly don't remember.

 

But for the heck of it, I set an Onan adapter in the correct bolt holes (bolts installed) of a C series frame that had the factory loop bracket installed. The Onan adapter loop hole is significantly farther forward. 

 

 

[ebinmaine 72,450]

6 minutes ago, kpinnc said:

Onan adapter loop hole is significantly farther forward. 

Now isn't that interesting 🤔

[ebinmaine 72,450]

I dropped off my Briggs Vanguard V twin 20 HP to my small engine shop. He gave it a 2 second look over. Initial indications are good. Sometime in the next few weeks he's going to check it over a little better and verify that it is in decent usable condition.

 

[Lee1977 7,190]

I used the same crank shaft location raised the engine 3/4" . The back side of the hole for the "PTO loop is the center line of the crank shaft. I have a tall 350 amp battery. the 1977 WH has a small battery

The solenoid switch is clamped to the starter with a hose clamp, I had to rotate it up close to the engine to make room. I bent the gas tank support up and added a piece of split gas hose as the plastic gas tank

was rubbing the valve cover. I also sawed a hole in tank support to get to the rear spark plug. Yes you have to remove the gas tank to get to that rear plug. I use the same drive and deck belts. I'm using a Briggs

key switch,  Couldn't  get the magnum switch to shut down, I had one from the old 16 vanguard. If you have the same telephone number I'll give you a call later this afternoon.

[ebinmaine 72,450]

46 minutes ago, Lee1977 said:

I used the same crank shaft location raised the engine 3/4" . The back side of the hole for the "PTO loop is the center line of the crank shaft. I have a tall 350 amp battery. the 1977 WH has a small battery

The solenoid switch is clamped to the starter with a hose clamp, I had to rotate it up close to the engine to make room. I bent the gas tank support up and added a piece of split gas hose as the plastic gas tank

was rubbing the valve cover. I also sawed a hole in tank support to get to the rear spark plug. Yes you have to remove the gas tank to get to that rear plug. I use the same drive and deck belts. I'm using a Briggs

key switch,  Couldn't  get the magnum switch to shut down, I had one from the old 16 vanguard. If you have the same telephone number I'll give you a call later this afternoon.

 

Try me Saturday or Sunday afternoon Don. 

[Bill D 2,246]

On 5/24/2023 at 11:29 AM, ebinmaine said:

 

 

Am I correct in thinking that when you went from a battery points ignition on the Kohler to the magneto ignition on the Briggs and Stratton you must have changed ignition switches the original 103990 to the 103991...?

 

 

I just wire a 5 pin relay in place of the coil.  Wire the magneto kill wire thru the normally closed contacts.  When the relay is energized the contacts open allowing the engine to run.  When you turn the key off the relay is denergized closing the contacts and shutting the engine off.

Edited May 3 by Bill D

[ebinmaine 72,450]

I got the V twin back from the engine shop yesterday.  

All looks good. 

Starts good. No smoke. Runs well, on the floor at least.  

 

Wiring colors from the engine. 

Yellow is ignition switch ground.

The following need to be changed.  

Currently: 

Red is fuel solenoid positive.

Black is VR feed to battery.

 

[kpinnc 14,588]

8 hours ago, ebinmaine said:

I got the V twin back from the engine shop yesterday.  

All looks good. 

 

Whatcha gonna set her on? 

[ebinmaine 72,450]

6 hours ago, kpinnc said:

 

Whatcha gonna set her on? 

 

I'm thinking the Tecumsehorse is a great candidate. 

That tractor is apparently low hours. The chassis is very tight. Not worn. 

 

I've now swapped the OTR Lawn trac 24x12.00-12 tires on to the rear and it has a 5 lug conversion front happening. 

It also has a splayed forward front axle. 

 

That engine runs fine but makes a tick I'm not sure is OK. May be perfectly normal but I'd rather save and shelf it. 

 

A nice 20 HP V Twin would be another great addition.