Gas containing 10% ethanol its going up 15%

[treepatrol 0]

Gas containing 10% ethanol its going up 15%

What are you guys using in your tanks for our wheelhorses??

[rmaynard 14,898]

All of my lawn & garden equipment currently run 91 octane.

[treepatrol 0]

I started using this its starting better? So you use just hightest gas ??

LAWN & GARDEN

Star Tron

[treepatrol 0]

Why was this moved it pertains to our wheelhorses ???

Moved: Gas containing 10% ethanol its going up 15%

What are you guys using???

To non tractor related i think this is directly related to our wh tractors??? :banghead:

[VinsRJ 721]

Why was this moved it pertains to our wheelhorses ???

Moved: Gas containing 10% ethanol its going up 15%

What are you guys using???

To non tractor related i think this is directly related to our wh tractors???

Don't take offense to the move..... although the topic is tractor related.... its not Wheel Horse specific or Wheel Horse tractor model specific. Its a much wider subject matter. :banghead:

[treepatrol 0]

:banghead:

[6wheeler 586]

I just run 92 octane gas. As far as the ethanol goes, I haven't seen any real problems. I had an older Toro snowblower that I always had to re-adjust the carb on it. I am not sure the fuel had anything to do with it, the carb probably needed rebuilding. Its gone now. The tractors seem to do fine(for now anyway). The only thing that concerns me about it is heat. I think if a guy just keeps em clean to cut down on heat build-up they'll be fine. I have heard that rust in the tank could be a problem or eating fuel lines could happen but that may be some sort of a myth. I do put a berrymans treatment in the first fill in the spring, it seems to clean the carbs nice and they run well. Here in Mn. we have oxygenated gas all the time and a certain amount of ethanol year around (the amount changes when winter comes). The state says it is for the environment, But I think it is a good reason to jack up the prices. I am going to try E-85 in one of my older JD's with a kohler engine this summer, just to see how it works thats my 1/4 cents worth. Pat

[TT-(Moderator) 1,127]

All gasoline in my area is now 10% ethanol. Anything built without ethanol compatibility is having some type of rejection to it too....... from the diaphragms in saw & trimmer carbs to sensors and seals on automobiles.

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This topic was moved because gasoline is not a Wheel Horse tractor.

[treepatrol 0]

Thanks 6wheeler I noticed on mine this fall i bought regular and thats when my 310 started having to use more throttle?? Hopefully this stuff will work well startron gas treatment takes very little to the gas for treatment . Mines a 10 horsepower.

I am going to use nothing but hightest from now on and see how this new treatment stuff works?

Iam worried about the heat from the ethenol too. :thumbs:

[treepatrol 0]

Thanks Terry Iam wondering about our carbs mines a 310-8 .

iam hoping it dosent eat up the hoses either :banghead:

[DMK855 15]

The best thing for this gas is to not let them sit extended periods with the fuel in them!! The new gas can "phase separate".

I pull all of my WH's out every couple weeks and start them, let them run, turn off the gas , and then wait for them to stall out. Another thing that helps is keeping them away from high moisture levels!!! (ie... storing them outside) I also use Seafoam in all my gas for my small engine stuff.

More info.....

http://fuelschool.blogspot.com/2009/02/pha...ol-blended.html

[Jim_M 178]

I figure if you can't beat em, join em.

I converted a K341 to run on E85 and I like it. It makes more horsepower, runs cooler and there's no carbon build up. E85 is cheaper to buy but it takes more of it to run right so there's no savings in fuel cost, but I believe the engine will last longer.

I haven't had any problems with moisture so far.

[Redbirdman 7]

have heard that rust in the tank could be a problem or eating fuel lines could happen but that may be some sort of a myth

No that's not a myth. However, over the years a lot has changed with both the fuel and the composition of the products they damaged. There is no question that shortly after the 'winterized' fuel was introduced the older rubber gas lines and fuel parts started to degenerate. Small bits of rubber were showing up in fuel screens and carb jets. About the same time very heavy rust was showing up in older gas tanks. As an example: My 48 HD survived 30 to 40 years without a bit of rust in the tank. Shortly after NJ went to winterized fuel the interior of the tank was covered with heavy rust. The same did not seem to bother newer tanks, but the old one's suffered. And this was reported in the marine industry, landscape equipment and antique cars as well. It was no myth. Then Gov Christy Whitless tried very hard to make it a myth, but those of us that suffered the damage knew it was true!

I have since been running 100 low leaded Aviation gasoline in all my equipment that does not have so-called pollution abatement equipment. I realize it is not easy to stock up on 'the blue devil' unless you visit an airport a lot, but for me it has been well worth the little extra cost...............

Of course, part of my job is to take a 'sample' from the av-gas tank every day to check for rust/sand and water....................that helps

ED :banghead:

[CTPATRIOT 12]

100LL or pump gas with Star Tron :banghead:

[baerpath 517]

AV gas isn't only at the airports our local Mobil has it avaliable for " off road use only"

Just check around three local places sell leaded gas around here and non ethenal gas can be bought still.

Duane

[Redbirdman 7]

AV gas isn't only at the airports our local Mobil has it avaliable for " off road use only

REALLY! cool! Buy it please! they are talking about doing away with it because not enough is sold.

What do they charge at the pump?

The airports are from $3.50 to 4.00 a galloon.............

ed

[smoreau 658]

:ROTF: I,m a auto teck and what ethenal is alcohal, and when its made the put a aditive in it to keep people from drinking it. yes when it's made it like white lightning and it mixes well with water almost like a sponge. I have seen gas stations in detroit and flint mi that are owned by people from the other side of the ocean with a garden hose run into there e85 tanks. so if they have a 10,000 gallon tank and it has 9,000 gallons of e85 in them and thay add 1,000 gallons of water to the tank they just made 1,000 extra gallons of fuel. no it's not e85 any more but more like e90-e92. the water will mix thith the ethenal and the e85 cars will run but may have some drivability problems. so how does this pretain to wheel horse tractors? your rubber fuel line will get ROCK HARD and the rubber diaphrams will get very stiff. when the lines are moved around from working on your wheel horse or just the vibration will brake small pieces of inside the line will brake off and you know where it goes. They do make e85 compatible fuel line that will not get hard and some oring seals that are e85 compatible. that should help alittle if you change your fuel line and put a filter very close to the carb. as for rust in the tanks. yes they will rust a e85 vehical has a fuel tank and fuel lines that are e85 compatible. yousaly the lines are stainless as steel lines will rust out from the inside. I know in my ocupation if I use a standered fuel pressure guage on a e85 car and it has e85 in it at the time, it will feel fine untill I go and use it again a day or two latter an I could use it for a walking stick. thats how fast it will harden the lines if they aren't ethenal compatible. as for 15% in the fuel, are wheel horses will run fine but the rubber fuel lines will get hard and the older steel tanks will rust. they do make a do it yourself tank liner kit that has a cleaner, prep and liner in a kit for around $40 from your local auto parts store and you should be able to get e85 rubber fuel line to solve some of your problems. I don't like this at all and I feel all your pain. farm gas I beleve dosn't have ethenal in it I think. so find a farmer and ask if you could buy some fuel from him may be a answer for now. as for e85 car owners. don't put it in your tank! it will cost you more money then if you put in 10-15 percent ethenal in our tank. for example; it cost you $9 for 3 gal of 10% and you can go 60 miles on that 3 gallons thats 20 miles to the gallon, it cost you $8.50 foor 3 gal of e85 and you can go 50 miles on that 3 gallons. thats 16.66 miles to the gallon. it will cost you more than 50 cents to go the extra 10 miles to compare to the 10-15% fuels. just my 2 cents worth and good luck to all with this problem.

and just a nother note. joing to a higher octain still has 10-15% in it

[Redbirdman 7]

just my 2 cents worth and good luck

That knowledge is worth far more than 2 cents my friend!

THANK YOU!

ed

[6wheeler 586]

Thanks Scott, Here in Mn. all gas sold for on/off highway use has ethanol in it Except AV fuel. And yes, the octane level makes no difference. I believe our current state mandate is 15%. I read in the paper the former Gov. Tim Pawlenty, started the move towards 20% before he left office in Dec. I think new fuel lines may be in order. But on the plus side to all of this, In this climate where I live temps can and do drop to -40 degrees in winter. I haven't bought a bottle of heat in 10 years. Thats gotta be worth something.

[smoreau 658]

Thanks Scott, Here in Mn. all gas sold for on/off highway use has ethanol in it Except AV fuel. And yes, the octane level makes no difference. I believe our current state mandate is 15%. I read in the paper the former Gov. Tim Pawlenty, started the move towards 20% before he left office in Dec. I think new fuel lines may be in order. But on the plus side to all of this, In this climate where I live temps can and do drop to -40 degrees in winter. I haven't bought a bottle of heat in 10 years. Thats gotta be worth something.

I do agree with you and another thing is that all those additives tha people put in there tanks. don't bother. gas line antifreeze or dry gas? its just alcohal at 15% there should be no water in your tank and all these fuel system cleaners are is alcohal. fuel injection cleaner actually should NOT be used unless you have a problem. if you use it on a regular basis it will actualy do more harm then good. it just meens there is no magic merical stuff in a can that you can buy. most vehical manufactures do not want any additives added to your gas tank. thats strait from your owners manuel. you know that book that sits in your glove box that you are suppost to read before you drive the vehical. I personally have never in my life put any thing other than gas in my tanks (car,tractor etc.) unless it is going to set for more then 3 months. then a little stable would't be bad. but thats just to keep the fuel from going bad not to clean some thing or make it run better. todays fuels have all that stuff in them already. just another 2 cents worth

[wh500special 2,053]

...that are owned by poeple from the other side of the ocean...

Adding 1000 gallons of water to the tank actually drops the ethanol concentration to about 77%. I'll have to take your word for it that cars will run on it.

Farm fuel usually only differs from road fuel in that the road tax is not paid. You can elect to use it, but the sheriff and the tax man aren't usually crazy about it.

For the last 20 years when given a choice between plain gasoline and that which contained 10% alcohol I have always elected to choose the ethanol. The reason was simply to prevent the accumulation of moisture in my gas tank. many of the problems - and I deliberately don't say "most" here since this doesn't explain all of them - attributed to the 10% ethanol addition have come from areas and tanks that historically haven't had alcohol introduced into their fuel. In these areas moisture has been building up and sitting in the bottom of the tank for years. With the introduction of alcohol, that water is soluablized and is sucked into the fuel system of the engine causing a host of problems. Rust, dirt, and sediment tends to go along with the water.

I think there are more myths surrounding ethanol as a fuel additive on the internet than there are facts. The correlations I have generally seen have been that it is problematic for old (wet) tanks, 2-stroke engines, and in engines that were running a little lean anyway. Marine applications that tend to take in water regularly are also plagued by it. And rubbers that aren't compatible or have long ago leached out their plasticizers also fall prey.

But, in general, it works at a 10% level. I'm not crazy about increasing the level any higher since manufacturers have typically only tested to 10% and don't know what happen well enough at higher loadings.

Adding anything else to the tank to counter the ethanol or hope for some special cure is not - in my mind - money being well spent. It is really hard to beat the multibillion dollar petroleum industry at their own game.

Steve

[smoreau 658]

from the information that I got from a class I took last year with several other loccal auto techs we learned that e85 is 85% ethonal and 15% gasoline. ethenal is basicly alcohal and it will mix with water and become deluted. it will still burn but not as well. this is why I added more to that # then making it less. Yes I have seen the garden hose run to the under ground tanks but it was about 1 1/2 years ago. The company that I work for also ownes a marathon gas station and this information comes from the company that checks the pumps (Mercer) I am not saying that 10% or 15% fuels are bad, but the older vehicals that aren't compatible is what this is about.

[hodge 6]

Fortunately, Southern States has ethanol-free gas.

It is a catch-22, though. Small engines call for 91 octane (chainsaws and weedeaters, etc.), but it has ethanol. The enthanol-free gas that I have access to is 87. So, which is better? I err on the cautious side and run the ethanol-free gas.

Southern States also has 48 cetane diesel, which is the highest in my area.

[treepatrol 0]

:banghead: What Iam using right now is Startron

http://www.fuel-testers.com/is_gas_additiv...h_e10_list.html

It has no achohol in it its enzymes.

There is a list in my link that shows which ones are more alcohol additives.

[6wheeler 586]

I think this a great thread and I learned alot. I use the Berrymans treatment only once in the spring in the initial tank full and nothing after that. Yes it is true that gasolines have detergent in them to help clean fuel systems. But, I like to do this. I seem to get some buildup in the bottom of the carb and this cleans it out(just may be my thing though). My tractors usually sit from about the middle of November til the end of April so after 5 months I think they need it. As far as off road fuels go, In Mn. the off road fuels have a red colored dye in them (Diesel and Gasoline) and they can stick a test strip in them and if it is in a vehicle that shouldn't have it, the fines are huge. But, as I am a fan of Bio-fuels I would rather support our farmers than Ahab the Arab.....