520 repower opinions

[onanparts.com 185]

On 2/20/2021 at 8:49 AM, gcole said:

The onan engine does run, it revs to the moon as soon as it fires up. I’m all but sure it’s the flyball spacer for the governor balls slipping. Problem is, I’ve had zero luck locating one to replace and locktite on. The one in it is the plastic one and I’d like to update to the metal one. This is the second onan I’ve owned that has this problem. I’m up in Canada also so a lot of the engines you guys have access to are much more expensive and harder to get ahold of up here  

 

I have several New, not used, long finger OEM Onan Spider/Spacers in stock at this time. A few more might come along soon. We do plan to manufacture them maybe later this year. Nylon/Plastic is most likely. The OEM Nylon ones have held up for decades and thousands of hours before any issues came up. Since the long fingered ones can't turn or rotate they are/were less prone to cracking/breaking. Millions still on the job with no failures, but they getting very long in the tooth....

 

For the record the OEM spiders/spacers were made of Celanese 1503-1 or 1503-2 Nylon or Zytel 70G-33 HSI-L Nylon.

 

Metal spiders are possible too in our future plans but the cost would be much higher than Nylon/Plastic or a comparable material. This has been a long term back burner project....

 

gcole,  PM me if interested in a New OEM spider. I will hold one back a few days to give you a chance to respond. We ship to Canada all the time. :)

 

New spiders are here:

https://onanparts.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=1_23&products_id=848

 

 

 

 

[lynnmor 7,815]

2 hours ago, WVHillbilly520H said:

See this is what gets me sometimes I ask for clarification on a subject I got a cranky "you're overthinking it" and someone else gets the more in depth answer, even though I might have been going at from a different angle 😞.

May I suggest you read what you wrote.  Bringing in two types of Chevy engines, balancers, flywheels, engineering and multiple others things when all we need is a replacement for a simple part.  Yes, I usually don't go to great lengths to discuss such basic things.  I'm sorry that you think that is cranky, but I do try to help without wasting time on things of no consequence.

[WVHillbilly520H 10,376]

15 hours ago, lynnmor said:

May I suggest you read what you wrote.  Bringing in two types of Chevy engines, balancers, flywheels, engineering and multiple others things when all we need is a replacement for a simple part.  Yes, I usually don't go to great lengths to discuss such basic things.  I'm sorry that you think that is cranky, but I do try to help without wasting time on things of no consequence.

I also said I NEVER had an ONAN apart and that was how I was relating to this from MY experiences, and not knowing exactly what was needed and how it all fit and worked together, it was of consequence to me (and possibly other members here that have access to make their own parts if needed) and my understanding of said issue. 

Edited February 22, 2021 by WVHillbilly520H

[onanparts.com 185]

18 hours ago, Skipper said:

If you want to go gas engine, I would look for a low hour kohler v-twin. Much more modern, rock solid, and it will outperform any of the old engines. Something like what you find in a 522Xi or newer. As said, remember to go electric clutch.

 

Several folks here have hit on the cheap "Modern" engines with plastic gears etc. Kohler V-twin is rock solid and will "outperform" any of the old engines? Seriously? Not a chance! Pure BS! I've posted these internal Kohler Vs. Onan pics on many threads and forums, here they are again. Judge for yourself....

 

There are no "bearings" main or cam in a "Modern" Kohler engine. Here is a look inside a "Modern" Kohler V-Twin. The "Aluminum engine block" is the bearing surface for the cam and crank. Unlike the Onan, there are no replaceable bushings, bearings or sleeves etc. None! When worn or damaged, you toss the engine in the scrap pile to be recycled. When the plastic geared aluminum oil pump fails, it most likely will take out or damage those cam and crank bushing surfaces, and the crank and cam too. Since it's a disposable engine, no need to worry about getting parts for it....Pictures are worth a thousand words they say...hopefully folks that choose to "Repower" get some use out of  "The Modern Kohler" or any new disposable engine before it becomes beer can material....

 

Onan industrial engines are and were made to be rebuidable and repairable. They will "outperform & outlast" any "Modern" disposable repower engine.

 

 

 

 

[Skipper 1,789]

4 hours ago, onanparts.com said:

23 hours ago, Skipper said:

If you want to go gas engine, I would look for a low hour kohler v-twin. Much more modern, rock solid, and it will outperform any of the old engines. Something like what you find in a 522Xi or newer. As said, remember to go electric clutch.

 

Several folks here have hit on the cheap "Modern" engines with plastic gears etc. Kohler V-twin is rock solid and will "outperform" any of the old engines? Seriously? Not a chance! Pure BS! I've posted these internal Kohler Vs. Onan pics on many threads and forums, here they are again. Judge for yourself....

 

Here we go again. Yes, I have indeed seen you have this exact same argument before with other people. And I understand that you are protecting the engine you sell parts for, but seriously, yes! 

 

I'm not saying a Kohler command V-twin is the best engine ever build, just that they (despite your effort to prove otherwise), usually have a long and trouble free life, use less gas the more modern they get, and certainly less than the older opposite twins did. Parts are readily available and fairly cheap. They seem to always just run good. In fact I have newer had one thru the shop that ran less than stellar, and if you do a simple Google search, it don't raise flags with heaps of common problems etc. either. Plus the power they deliver is absolutely sweet too. So yeah, for a second hand low hour gas engine swap, I would surely go for that, all things considered.

 

I apologies for using the fraise "rock solid". All engines can go boom, or have parts fail, so that's obviously wrong. But I hope we can agree, that some do it more than others...............  

 

I'm not saying an Onan is a bad engine. Nor that it shouldn't be rebuilt if that's the sensible choice for OP. Just trying to go by the facts, and less by the religious craze. Onan undeniably has it's problems too, especially in garden tractor applications, and that IS a well documented fact.

 

I am not going to contribute further to this, as you put it so nicely, BS! 

[Skipper 1,789]

For those who asked about info on the diesel, + pics, videos etc.:

 

 

  

 

 

[littleredrider 409]

I wish I was in a better situation, I’d love to have that V-twin diesel in my 520-8. I need to get the one lunger diesel going to push some snow....

[bc.gold 3,406]

13 hours ago, onanparts.com said:

 

Several folks here have hit on the cheap "Modern" engines with plastic gears etc. Kohler V-twin is rock solid and will "outperform" any of the old engines? Seriously? Not a chance! Pure BS! I've posted these internal Kohler Vs. Onan pics on many threads and forums, here they are again. Judge for yourself....

 

There are no "bearings" main or cam in a "Modern" Kohler engine. Here is a look inside a "Modern" Kohler V-Twin. The "Aluminum engine block" is the bearing surface for the cam and crank. Unlike the Onan, there are no replaceable bushings, bearings or sleeves etc. None! When worn or damaged, you toss the engine in the scrap pile to be recycled. When the plastic geared aluminum oil pump fails, it most likely will take out or damage those cam and crank bushing surfaces, and the crank and cam too. Since it's a disposable engine, no need to worry about getting parts for it....Pictures are worth a thousand words they say...hopefully folks that choose to "Repower" get some use out of  "The Modern Kohler" or any new disposable engine before it becomes beer can material....

 

Onan industrial engines are and were made to be rebuidable and repairable. They will "outperform & outlast" any "Modern" disposable repower engine.

 

 

 

 

 

I totally agree with you you on Onan's durability in fact I've been so impressed with 50 year old engine blocks that I have dismantled finding no ridge at the top of the cylinder bore.

 

I have considered sending a cast sample for an XRF analysis to reveal the chemistry used in the casting alloy, did Onan add nickle or chrome to the foundry recipe.

 

If you have an Onan engine I would go to great extent to refresh it, rather than replace it with another brand of engine, most of the guys here are hobbyists having some man cave time or some fun out in the woods or attending a yearly show n tell gathering telling tall tails or swapping parts.

 

Being the purest I am when it came to my Allis Chalmers 720 I soon learned finding used Onan engines and parts would take me many miles into several different Provinces. After two long years mission accomplished.

 

Would I do this again - NO, I would have installed a Kohlor the most popular engine used on grain augers on the prairies and it would have been much easier and more economical to have found a good used engine.

[gcole 36]

20 hours ago, onanparts.com said:

 

I have several New, not used, long finger OEM Onan Spider/Spacers in stock at this time. A few more might come along soon. We do plan to manufacture them maybe later this year. Nylon/Plastic is most likely. The OEM Nylon ones have held up for decades and thousands of hours before any issues came up. Since the long fingered ones can't turn or rotate they are/were less prone to cracking/breaking. Millions still on the job with no failures, but they getting very long in the tooth....

 

For the record the OEM spiders/spacers were made of Celanese 1503-1 or 1503-2 Nylon or Zytel 70G-33 HSI-L Nylon.

 

Metal spiders are possible too in our future plans but the cost would be much higher than Nylon/Plastic or a comparable material. This has been a long term back burner project....

 

gcole,  PM me if interested in a New OEM spider. I will hold one back a few days to give you a chance to respond. We ship to Canada all the time.

 

New spiders are here:

https://onanparts.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=1_23&products_id=848

 

 

 

 

I messaged you! If I can fix the onan up and make it reliable without costing an arm and a leg I’m for it 

[bc.gold 3,406]

48 minutes ago, gcole said:

I messaged you! If I can fix the onan up and make it reliable without costing an arm and a leg I’m for it 

 

As long as it's an OEM plastic part I see no problem with it, might make installation easier by soaking the part in hot water first.

 

I went to two different Colony's both have laser cutters and both said their not accurate enough to cut the spider, I have no further plans to move forward with this project.

[Red-Bovine 334]

Yes, I repowered our 520H back in 2013. I used a Honda GX630 and kit I got from Repower in Oregon. They supplied everything I needed. The only exception was I needed to modify the bracket on the engine for the clutch lever. It's been working like a champ and my husband loves it. I think the pictures are still on the forum somewhere. I got sick of repairing loose valve seats. Plenty of members willing to buy the used Onan.

 

Red

[WVHillbilly520H 10,376]

9 minutes ago, bcgold said:

 

I went to two different Colony's both have laser cutters and both said their not accurate enough to cut the spider, I have no further plans to move forward with this project.

That's is why I suggested Wire EDM, Cuts metallic parts with precision, the down side is fixturing the part to machine.

[onanparts.com 185]

For anyone that is curious, here are some close up detailed pics comparing the outdated "not modern" rebuidable all metal Onan oil pump and a "Modern" Kohler OHV V-Twin non-rebuildable plastic and aluminum oil pump....:)

 

 

[onanparts.com 185]

10 hours ago, bcgold said:

Being the purest I am when it came to my Allis Chalmers 720 I soon learned finding used Onan engines and parts would take me many miles into several different Provinces. After two long years mission accomplished.

 

Just wondering, what parts took you so long to get your hands on?

10 hours ago, bcgold said:

 

 

 

 

 

[bc.gold 3,406]

13 hours ago, onanparts.com said:

 

Just wondering, what parts took you so long to get your hands on?

 

 

 

 

 

I had wanted to avoid the newer Onan engines that no longer used replaceable connecting rod bearing shells which were available for the CCK series in many common under size.

 

If you needed to have the crankshaft ground on the later engines,  you had no alternative but to purchase expensive undersized connecting rods made from aluminum.

 

The picture at the bottom are a pair of CCK rods made from forged steel..

 

Secondly Onan went with aluminum engine blocks, the older CCK series is all cast iron and you may have noticed all of the older Kohler engines are also made from cast

 

 

 

Edited February 23, 2021 by bcgold

[gcole 36]

Well thanks to onanparts we have the parts coming to hopefully fix the onan up! Worth trying to get it back into service 

[onanparts.com 185]

7 hours ago, gcole said:

Well thanks to onanparts we have the parts coming to hopefully fix the onan up! Worth trying to get it back into service 

You're welcome! On the way tomorrow. Keep in mind though the severe weather all across the US is causing significant delivery delays/slowdowns everywhere. It's getting better, but all the shipping companies are playing catch up right now..

 

 

[onanparts.com 185]

22 hours ago, bcgold said:

 

I had wanted to avoid the newer Onan engines that no longer used replaceable connecting rod bearing shells which were available for the CCK series in many common under size.

 

If you needed to have the crankshaft ground on the later engines,  you had no alternative but to purchase expensive undersized connecting rods made from aluminum.

 

The picture at the bottom are a pair of CCK rods made from forged steel..

 

Secondly Onan went with aluminum engine blocks, the older CCK series is all cast iron and you may have noticed all of the older Kohler engines are also made from cast iron.

Those pics are all aluminum rods, early and later...I think you were looking for these 114-0203 forged steel con rods..they were also used on the later 24HP big block Onan engines too. :)

 

 

[bc.gold 3,406]

2 hours ago, onanparts.com said:

Those pics are all aluminum rods, early and later...I think you were looking for these 114-0203 forged steel con rods..they were also used on the later 24HP big block Onan engines too.

 

 

 

I'll post pictures of a couple of connecting rods tomorrow from a CCK series engine I'm parting out.

 

 

Edited February 24, 2021 by bcgold

[onanparts.com 185]

1 hour ago, bcgold said:

 

I'll post pictures of a couple of connecting rods tomorrow from a CCK series engine I'm parting out.

 

 

 

 

 

[tom2p 2,394]

On 2/21/2021 at 12:00 PM, lynnmor said:

 

 just look at those that swap to a Chinese engine at the first sign of trouble.

some owners don't have the ability or time or space to perform the repairs (2/3 my problem lol)

and another issue is the lack of quality service / repair businesses for small engines - it can be a challenge to find a good lawn and garden dealer let alone a dealer that has a good repair service 

 

so a governor issue or lost valve seat - a relatively small issue for a good repair shop - is a show stopper for others 

our house has original tile roof - around 70 years old now 

 

searched for months for someone to do relativity small repairs (and later replace copper around chimney) - most of the roofing businesses I called wanted to replace the entire roof (with shingles)

 

Edited February 24, 2021 by tom2p

[Jeff-C175 7,206]

12 hours ago, tom2p said:

most of the roofing businesses I called

 

...never returned my call.  And I HAVE shingle roof!

 

Sadly, good service of any kind is becoming increasingly difficult to find!

[bc.gold 3,406]

The Onan on my Alis Chalmers 720 is over revving and we all know what that means, I have my work cut out for me.

 

[lynnmor 7,815]

2 hours ago, bcgold said:

 we all know what that means, I have my work cut out for me.

 

You have two balls missing?

 

The "work" is finding a suitable replacement.  Is that a groove in the cup where the balls ride?  My dad frequently ran his Onan very slow and that is what I believe knackered the cup in his engine, my theory is that there was not enough centrifugal force to keep the balls firmly against the cup.  I modified things to prevent the slow running much to his objection.