Thoughs of those who have used the twin vanguard engines for repower?

[TravelinJavelin 620]

hey i'm always trying to gain knowledge here on red square so those of you that have used the v-twin vanguard engines are you happy with them after using? same good torque? anything you would've done different? always thinking just incase if I can't get my hands on a another kohlor engine.

Edited December 23, 2013 by Sparky

[MalMac 1,328]

I personally do not have any experience with them on a Wheel Horse. I do have one a ZTR machine I have and have had no problems with it at all. It has performed admirably. I have a buddy that has re-powered two 520's with them and is happy with the Vanguard and has no complaints.

[TT-(Moderator) 1,127]

I am thrilled with the 18hp Vanguard I installed on my '83 GT-1848 ~ so far.

My concern with the Vanguard twin is the lack of flywheel side main bearing (ball or tapered roller) and the lateral pressure exerted by the mechanical PTO clutch.

The only thing I had to fabricate was the exhaust headpipes - everything else is off-the-shelf Wheel Horse.

 

[Fordiesel69 214]

I am thrilled with the 18hp Vanguard I installed on my '83 GT-1848 ~ so far.

My concern with the Vanguard twin is the lack of flywheel side main bearing (ball or tapered roller) and the lateral pressure exerted by the mechanical PTO clutch.

The only thing I had to fabricate was the exhaust headpipes - everything else is off-the-shelf Wheel Horse.

 

 

 

What failed on the original 18HP L-head?  Just curious.

[Don1977 604]

I ran a 16 HP Vanguard on my C-120 for 20 years. I broke the corner off the engine when I went off a bank. Had it welded never got it to stop leaking oil. It opened up a crack dumped the oil. I have an 18 HP vanguard on it now with a solid 3/8" plate under it.

It's a tight fit in a C-120. The later models have a lot more room. I checked out a Honda wasn't enough room on a C-120.

 

 

 

[TT-(Moderator) 1,127]

What failed on the original 18HP L-head?  Just curious.

It's not completely dead, but it has quite a bit of wear.

The biggest problem is a worn keyway in the crank gear.

The valve guides need replaced and it should be ringed at the very least.

I couldn't have fixed it for the $ I have in the Vanguard.

[leeave96 487]

Small engine wearhouse sells a kit with a 23 HP vanguard for he Wheelhorse. I think they use to offer a Honda, don't know why the switch. I would think the vanguard would be a good engine.

[TravelinJavelin 620]

is there a noticible power difference from the original kohler or for say if you had a k341 for instance?

[dodgemike 52]

I have a C 121 with a great running

K301. But this makes me go Hmmm. Always wanted to put a

FEL on my tractor. The extra power

Certainly could not hurt!

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[Hydro 130]

Small engine wearhouse sells a kit with a 23 HP vanguard for he Wheelhorse. I think they use to offer a Honda, don't know why the switch. I would think the vanguard would be a good engine.

I'm pretty sure those kits are only for the Onan engine replacement.  I've looked into them a couple of times.  Not to say you could not switch out a Kohler but the mounting plate and wiring are intended for the Onan engine.  When you check out their site they don't show anything for the Kohler.   Guess they never wear out ...well almost never

Edited December 27, 2013 by Hydro

[leeave96 487]

 

Small engine wearhouse sells a kit with a 23 HP vanguard for he Wheelhorse. I think they use to offer a Honda, don't know why the switch. I would think the vanguard would be a good engine.

I'm pretty sure those kits are only for the Onan engine replacement.  I've looked into them a couple of times.  Not to say you could not switch out a Kohler but the mounting plate and wiring are intended for the Onan engine.  When you check out their site they don't show anything for the Kohler.   Guess they never wear out ...well almost never

 

 

Agree.

 

My thinking is that one of the life lines to these old iron tractors - specifically the Wheelhorse and Simplicity Sovereign tractors is that you can retrofit with a new engine.  I think that would be very hard to do on my IH Cub Cadets with single cylinder engines as they have a different oil pan/mounting arrangement than the Wheelhorse or Simplicity and would be hard to do - I think.

 

I'm thinking that if one were to swap out a Kohler single cylinder for a Briggs Vanguard twin, just knowing it can be done with a 520H (and they have a kit for the 416H too), makes me think it's at least do-able.

[TT-(Moderator) 1,127]

It can definitely be done as shown by Don and his C-120 above.

Mine went on a C-85 first - mainly to see if my $75 engine was a boat anchor or not.

 

 

Setting mine up so the crank centerline is in the same location as a single-cylinder proved to be the easiest, but required using the corresponding (and readily available) drive belt guard. I would have liked to have kept my original matching belt guard but they make paint every day, right? 

Putting a big block (tall deck / 25-35hp) Vanguard on a WH might be a little more involved, but I'm sure it would be a blast!

[Don1977 604]

I put the crank center line in the same location also. I raised the Vanguard 7/8" to get the right height with two 1/2" x 2" flat bars and a 3/8" plate under the engine. I also used the standard C-120 belts and belt guard unmodified. I also have two washers behind each bolt on the PTO bracket as I modified the original engine mounting holes. I also used a spacer behind the PTO in the crank shaft. I did drill two new holes in the battery box and turned the battery around to move the battery post to the rear. I also sawed a 2" hole in the gas tank tray and have to remove the gas tank to change the rear spark plug. Rotated the solenoid switch up as far as possible on the starter to clear the battery. As I have said before it's a tight fit on a C-120. I needed the pressure oil system as my yard is far from level. By back yard slopes 16' in 200'  with a few 35 degree slopes thrown in. The front is some what better with slopes on the upper and lower sides.

 

[LAWRENCE JEWETT 4]

Small engine wearhouse sells a kit with a 23 HP vanguard for he Wheelhorse. I think they use to offer a Honda, don't know why the switch. I would think the vanguard would be a good engine.

I believe that Small Engine Warehouse probably switched to the Briggs because of problems with the Honda. The Honda did not have a bearing on the fan side of the crank and could not handle the horizontal loads from the clutch.  I bought a Honda from them and it seized on me.  Honda Motors indicated that the engine was not intended for horizontal loads like the WH application. SEW took the engine back and rebuilt it and installed a thrust washer on the fan side. It has been fine since then.  I am very careful to keep the clutch set on the light side, but that is sometimes tough when snowblowing.

[546cowboy 301]

I had a Wheel Horse 656 that I bought from a guy just because it had a Vanguard 18 hp. in it and there were no modifications to the tractor other than the belt guard. It fit under the hood and the battery had moved between the frame under the seat. So I don't see why they wouldn't work on pretty much any Wheel Horse.

 

I have had many B&S Vanguard engines both vertical and horizontal shafts, I have never had any problems with any of them. Well I do have one now that has a problem with the coil grounding wire harness that I have had to work around and shutting it off is a problem. It is in my Woods Zero Turn and since I have had it, it has mowed 4 acres for 5 summers and it was not even close to being new when I got it.

[Tim Bergfeld 55]

They switched to the Briggs because the early Honda they used had overheating issues. Then when honda brought out a new motor they had to totally reconfigure it to solve the over heating problem and it would have been a nightmare to reconfigure the kit to work with it. So that is the story they told me

[oaktown1987 82]

Originality

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