Tonyp 285 #1 Posted June 1, 2013 All of a sudden my 310 started running ruff, I know there are gas issues and I am convinced this is the issue. It runs like it is on partial choke then clears. I have Sta-bil in the gas and the gas is fresh ,I am sick of this ! The 310 had been running great then all of a sudden...not...my only conclusion is the gas as that's the only thing that has been changed... Thoughts? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Forest Road 594 #2 Posted June 1, 2013 It's probably time for a carb over haul. How old are your fuel lines? Do you have an inline filter? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WH nut 553 #3 Posted June 1, 2013 Pull the bowl and clean the crud out of it. also remove the high speed jet and clean. Dont forget to check the air filter. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lane Ranger 11,410 #4 Posted June 1, 2013 I like SEAFOAM better than STABIL for gas treatment. Stabil to me seems to be gummier in the fuel. Carb cleaning does help if the bowl is gummed up! 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Save Old Iron 1,571 #5 Posted June 1, 2013 seems easy enough to drain the gas and replace it with gas from another source no need to guess on that part of the troubleshooting 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MalMac 1,332 #6 Posted June 1, 2013 I started having the same problem last year. The first thing I did was change gas. Around here all the gas stations get their gas from the same refinery. They just add whatever additive in it that makes it Shell, Marathon,BP OR Whatever brand. I always buy from a station that does a lot of business that always keeps fresh gas. Now with all that said I now use 94 octane. For me it has helped cure some of the problems. On a side note I did have to do an initial carb clean and put a carb kit in them while I had it a part. I started having the same problem last year. The first thing I did was change gas. Around here all the gas stations get their gas from the same refinery. They just add whatever additive in it that makes it Shell, Marathon,BP OR Whatever brand. I always buy from a station that does a lot of business that always keeps fresh gas. Now with all that said I now use 94 octane. For me it has helped cure some of the problems. On a side note I did have to do an initial carb clean and put a carb kit in them while I had it a part. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tonyp 285 #7 Posted June 3, 2013 Many thanks for the replies...The 10 HP 310 has recently been sorta restored, the gas tank has been flushed and cleaned, , all fuel lines and filter are new.....new plug and filters..the M10 was running great then all of a sudden not...the only variable has been the gas... I will chase a carb kit but these gas issues are getting old...I have been chasing it with my KEYS walk behind as well is the gas really this bad ? I find it odd that every outlet sells gas treatment stuff at counters..someone knows something about this it seems.... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Forest Road 594 #8 Posted June 3, 2013 All it takes is one little piece of debris to screw up a carb. Just drop the bowl pull the needle and spray it with some carb clean. Also is your float properly set? I had an M12 that would spit and sputter on slopes. A slight bend to the float tab was all it took. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Save Old Iron 1,571 #9 Posted June 3, 2013 ..the only variable has been the gas... is the gas really this bad ? Tony, there is another variable beside the gas. Time. Time is a constant variable that is always present in every failure. How many folks have you heard say "Everything was fine up until now". Well Duh, problems work on their timetable, not yours. Preventive maintenance can keep these surprises at bay. In your case, the new gas added to the gas tank may have have been added just at a time a loose a particle of debris rushed forward into the carburetor and forced the all too frequent blame on "bad gas". I keep asking myself why I have never seen or experienced "bad gas". A blessed existence on this earth ? - maybe. I have a car that gets used maybe once a week and gas sits in that tank for weeks and months at at time. Knock on wood, but I have never experienced symptoms which could be blamed on "bad gas". If it's the longer term effects of alcohol dissolving fuel lines, consider that fuel lines that have been on the tractor for 10 - 30 years and are now problems waiting to happen - alcohol content in fuel or not. If its a blocked carb, then consider again, the fuel line may be breaking down and the carb bowl may be building up residue over the last 10 years of use. How many of us pull our carb bowls off every year to check if "this years gas" is badder than "last years gas". During last year's fall tornado warnings, I filled a 15 gallon plastic canister full of gas in full anticipation of being without power for several days and needing all of the 15 gallons. Well sir, I did not use a drop of gas from that container. The canister has been sitting out exposed to all the elements over the last 8 - 9 months . I have been using this unstabilized gas for a few weeks now in 2 of my tractors. No sign of performance issues, no sign of residue in the gas container Maybe the 30 or 40 cents per gallon premium we pay in Ny actually buys us something. Is the winter mixture of gas more stable than summer blends. Who knows. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dsholler 54 #10 Posted June 3, 2013 If it's the longer term effects of alcohol dissolving fuel lines, consider that fuel lines that have been on the tractor for 10 - 30 years and are now problems waiting to happen - alcohol content in fuel or not. If its a blocked carb, then consider again, the fuel line may be breaking down and the carb bowl may be building up residue over the last 10 years of use. How many of us pull our carb bowls off every year to check if "this years gas" is badder than "last years gas". Fuel lines on there 10-30 years? Are you kidding? On the boat, if I do not change the fuel line at least every two years, it starts to get crud into the carb. I go 2-3 on the tractor only because it gets stored inside, but if you have a fuel line that is more than three years old, I would change it. This might be overkill for the tractor, since my suspicion is that the primer bulbs are the main culprits, but given that it is cheap and easy, I would change them often. (Thanks to a member here for the suggestion to use a threaded rod or some other connector to splice the new line to the old one at the tank end, and then pull it through so you don't have to take off the seat pan. ) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MalMac 1,332 #12 Posted June 3, 2013 Rubber gas line is acceptable to deterioration from the alcohol in ethanol and a lot of gas additives. It starts the deterioration from the inside out letting very very tiny particles of rubber pass through the gas. By the time you notice it externally it is too late. Very hard on rubber gaskets and baffles in carbs too. Just one of the little dirty secrets that they don't tell you about ethanol. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tonyp 285 #13 Posted June 3, 2013 ok egg on my face...after taking the front end apart again..I did not change the fuel line from the small fuel pump to the carb..that piece was maybe 2 years old and looked good..from the outside...it looked new so i must have overlooked it when i was putting it all back together a few weeks back...truth is on the last day of putting it all back together i think I was rushing because i was so close to getting it up and running....can't believe I missed it..or overlooked it. It was indeed cracking on the inside ..I removed the bowl and yes there were a few tiny pieces of black rubber... I pulled the needle valves cleaned and sprayed again..added the new short gas line and all is well.... In this case it was NOT the gas...it was me.... I do need to rebuild the carb.. Where may I find the carb kit for the Kohler M10 ? Wife is running the 310 as we speak cutting the grass... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WH nut 553 #14 Posted June 3, 2013 jacks Small Engines kit number 520-213 price 11.85 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Save Old Iron 1,571 #15 Posted June 4, 2013 ok egg on my face...after taking the front end apart again..I did not change the fuel line from the small fuel pump to the carb..that piece was maybe 2 years old and looked good..from the outside...it looked new so i must have overlooked it when i was putting it all back together a few weeks back...truth is on the last day of putting it all back together i think I was rushing because i was so close to getting it up and running....can't believe I missed it..or overlooked it. It was indeed cracking on the inside ..I removed the bowl and yes there were a few tiny pieces of black rubber... I pulled the needle valves cleaned and sprayed again..added the new short gas line and all is well.... In this case it was NOT the gas...it was me.... I do need to rebuild the carb.. Where may I find the carb kit for the Kohler M10 ? Wife is running the 310 as we speak cutting the grass... This is the joy of long distance and blindfolded troubleshooting. Rarely is everything exactly as described and rarely if ever do I believe "all i did was .......". Good troubleshooting. You are now well on your way to having a sound, long term fix in place. One more "new gas sucks" falsehood now placed on the actual culprit. E blend gas is indeed different, it's here to stay, and workable if you understand it's characteristics. We just need to stop grousing and learn to adapt to its use. Perform more frequent gas line changes, replace rubber lines with polyurethane, pay more attention to proper storage conditions of the gas and the machine with the gas in it or not in it. No real use in complaining, get over it, E blends are probably here to stay. Plan your strategy and deal with it. If your outrage is such you need to register your concern worldwide on internet forums, redirect that energy and effort and start petitioning the parts suppliers to begin using E blend resistant gaskets and resistive coatings on parts that can oxidize, flake and collect in fuel delivery passages. . 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tonyp 285 #16 Posted June 4, 2013 well ok..point made... But, the issue is still in front of us,( me) we can petition the politicians all day long about the E gas..and for sure , they are not going to change anything, we can request all the manufacturers to make changes to components to be E gas friendly..and maybe one day they will..but at what cost ? I still need to cut the grass tomorrow...with the gas that is available to buy today... thanks t Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MalMac 1,332 #17 Posted June 5, 2013 Yes unfortunately it's here and we have to work with it. Now for some reason here in my state one of the first ethanol plants just closed and 3 more that we're to start construction were just plain canceled. Just one of the reason plant closed was do to the high cost of corn. The other we're canceled because of the decline in demand. Also a lot of the farmers around here won't even use bio-diesel. The reason we don't use it on are farm is cost. Right now it's more. Go figure. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
