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sshell

D-160 or GT 14

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sshell

I have the chance to get a GT-14 or a D-160 from my uncle. FREE B) The only thing is he said I could have the one I want but he wants the other. Not to look a gift horse in the mouth but I cant make up my mind B) Both run good and are in good shape. Sorry I have no pics and wont have any till I pick it up, But I do know they both have decks and he takes great care of them. I just cant make up my mind. any thoughts? :whistle:

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wh500special

I think it mostly depends on what you plan to do with them. Will they be "users" or show tractors?

The D's were the biggest guns WH made and were offered in several flavors that varied (mostly) in what engine you got; starting in 1973. 16, 18, and 20 HP versions were available. The earliest 16's had single cylinder Kohlers while the later ones used an Onan twin cylinder. Either engine has enough oomph to get the job done, but I think the Kohler was more durablewhile the Onan was smoother, quieter, and more pleasant to operate. Really a wash and not much of a deciding factor...

The D's were WH's first foray into the "estate" tractor market. Today we might call them the first sub-compact utility tractors (SCUT). They all have hydro transmissions, hydraulic lift, and can interchange implements within the series (not with the D250 however). Also a 3pt hitch and PTO were optionally available and required for the rear tiller and rear mounted finish mowers. They are a bit cumbersome to manuever and have some limitations, but they are a capable large GT (Garden Tractor).

The GT14, on the other hand, was WH's first attempt at a "big" garden tractor. It is older than the D series (and was discontinued at the time the D's made their debut), and were all configured about the same throughout the various model years. 14 horse one lunger, hydro transmission, hydraulic lift, big rear tires...A 3pt hitch was available here (required for the tiller), but is primarilly for non-powered implements due to no PTO shaft (the tiller is belt driven from the transmission input shaft).

If you're looking for something with the most versatility, choose the D. It has larger, easier to find implements available. While implements for the D-series are unique to that series, they are much easier to find that some of the GT-14 specific items that will only work on the GT14 (namely the tiller, but I think the deck is slightly different as are the blade and blower). The D's were produced longer and in more variations than the GT14, so there seems to be more stuff available for them (though not nearly as much as for the C-series tractors).

If you want a showpiece, I think I'd go for the GT14. It is a little more compact, simplier, and more in line with everything else WH made. And, it plays a "significance" role too as one of the first big GT's to hit the market or the model lineup. Even though it looks like many of the other Wheel Horses, it is a unique tractor.

Tough choice! For me, it would be the GT14 - but only because I don't need another tractor to use!

Steve

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WheelHorse_of_course

Please correct me if I am wrong, but wasn't the D series made for WH by someone else on an OEM basis? Or was that the D250 only? B)

If that is indeed true I guess that would push me to the GT14.

Hard choice indeed, but I would gladly trade places with you... B) :whistle:

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refracman

lets take the "I personally" out of it and look at the mechanical aspect of it

gt14

Wheel Horse

large size

Kohler engine

durable drive train

3pt

Cons

special parts,

no pto

shifter hard to work

older model(lots of hrs)

special tiller

not a lot of used parts

D's (160,180,200)

Pros

Wheel Horse

large size

16 -20 hp

live pto (although only wh attachments work)

3 pt

plenty of used parts

Cons

bad steering design ( steering colume, spindles)

hydro ( undersized for size of tractor)

weak differential ( under engineered for size)

parking brake design (could shear off in trans)

older model (lots of hrs)

The D was not Wheel Horse's best designed tractor only because some of the parts were taken from the smaller tractors and not designed specificly for the D thus were prone to fail. When first debued they were in the shop more than in the field. By 1975 some of the problems were resolved. They redesigned the spindles, differential bolts,and parking brake ( hydro bypass). The issue of the hydro being undersized and the poor steering colume was never addressed.

I know I'm in for it here B) but this is first hand from a WH sales/ service freind who sold the first 18 Auto here in Toledo. The guy he sold it to traded in a GT14. The D has long been retired but that peticular GT14 is still in service and has been mowing,pushing snow and garden plowing ever since. ( his BIL has it)

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Jim_M

Please correct me if I am wrong, but wasn't the D series made for WH by someone else on an OEM basis?

That was only the D 250, the smaller D's were made by Wheel Horse.

I have 2 D series tractors and one GT-14. I prefer the D series tractors for the fact the you can find more attachments for them and the attachments are easier to change.

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wh500special

lets take the "I personally" out of it and look at the mechanical aspect of it

D's (160,180,200)

Pros

Wheel Horse

large size

16 -20 hp

live pto (although only wh attachments work)

3 pt

plenty of used parts

Cons

bad steering design ( steering colume, spindles)

hydro ( undersized for size of tractor)

weak differential ( under engineered for size)

parking brake design (could shear off in trans)

older model (lots of hrs)

The D was not Wheel Horse's best designed tractor only because some...

I know I'm in for it here B)

Wow Steve, you're looking to take some ribbing aren't you? :whistle:

Usually it seems like I am the one pointing out that the king has no clothes...

I have to say I agree with the cons on the D-auto tractors 100%. They definately do have their shortcomings and I have seen my fair share of sheard spindles, broken transaxle cases, and sloppy steering too.

Nail on the head my friend!

Strangely though, I still prefer the D as a "user" tractor though due to the greater availability of implements. But I will admit that these were not WH's best engineering effort. I've had good luck with all of mine (I've had one of each at some point), but always feared the day of major repairs...

Had the choice been b/t a D-series and a C-series, no question I would take the C as a more dependable, longer lived tractor.

Wonderful post!

Steve

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linen beige

Sorry, but I gotta add to the debate. The 1963 model 953 was Wheel horse's first foray into the estate/ commercial market (unless you count the RS models.), followed by the 1054 and 1054A. The GT-14 was the natural progression of this model and the trend to go hydro. The D series was in turn the next step in the upsizing.

I have a 1980 model D-160, with the Onan twin. Parts and attachments for the tractor itself are relatively easy to find as compared to the GT-14, but parts for the Onan engine are getting very difficult to come up with and are increasingly exspensive.

I would not mind adding a GT-14 to my collection because of it's uniqueness. But I would likely not pick one as a user tractor due to the relative rarity of parts and especially attachments.

You are indeed between a rock and a hard spot in making a choice here. But the most important thing to consider is what you plan to do with your tractor. If your primary plan is to putter around the neighborhood and take it to shows the GT-14 is a hands down winner. If you plan to use it for true tractor stuff then the D would be my choice.

One thing to consider is the power plants. The GT has a Kohler. The D may have either a Kohler or an Onan. The Kohler is easy to find parts for and to say they are durable is an understatement. The Onan's are becoming museum peices without the parts support that Kohler has, although if need be it can be replaced with a newer engine.

It sounds like you and your uncle are very close. Why not share a couple days of working the 'Horses with him? That would give you a chance to compare their abilities head to head, and would make some memories for you both.

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Teddy da Bear

I would take the D-160. But that is only because I have a Gt-14.

Personally I would not just take it. I would offer him some money.....especially if they are well cared for tractors.

And I will also add to the controversy....lol

You guys are forgetting a tractor that came before the D series. It was the prototype for it......the "18 Auto".

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wh500special

Sorry, but I gotta add to the debate. The 1963 model 953 was Wheel horse's first foray into the estate/ commercial market (unless you count the RS models.),

Jim,

Yeah, you're right about the 953/1054 being the first in the line of Big Guys. I didn't technically forget them, but I did leave them out of the discussion for the following rationalization...

i think the GT14 caught on much better than the 953/1054 models and it was certainly marketed as a larger, more capable machine. Sort of an early "compact utility" instead of just a large garden tractor. Even the brochures of its day suggested it was a bigger machine to fill special niches.

That's my story anyway...

Mike,

As soon as I re-read my post I knew somebody was going to bring up the 18-Automatic B) !!! Good eyes :whistle: .

I have an 18-Auto sitting in the garage, but I have always lumped them in with the D-auto series of tractors and don't grant them special status. I do the same with all the other '73 identity crisis models too. Fundamentally little separates the 73's from the later letter series, so I just throw them all together.

You mention prototypes...I actually had a chance a couple of years ago to buy an original prototype 18-Auto/D-series from a lady in LaPaz, IN (not far from Mike) which is just a little south of the factory in South Bend. It was actually in decent shape and it was certainly interesting from a collector standpoint.

The serial plate was hand-stamped with a model number for the D180 (from memory I think it was 1-0612) but the serial number was printed "USED". The tractor had some unique factory features, like the hood scoop that was needed to clear the air filter. And the notched frame to accomodate the 18 Kohler which I guess was a little bigger than they thought it was going to be. Also had a transmission cooler with fan plumbed to the rear fender and some holes here and there punched in the sheet metal where I guess stuff was mounted during evaluation.

I asked the Toro guys at one of the WH shows what they thought of this and they verified that WH did occasionally assign a model number to prototypes and sell them. They discontinued the practice since there was often enough unique parts on them to make servicing difficult by the local dealers and they had numerous complaints to that end.

In retrospect, I shouldn't have passed it up. But no sense crying about it now and she wanted more than I thought it was worth. Win some, lose some.

Steve

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DMESS

So Steve, that means the "874" prototype is out there SOMEWHERE! B)

I've nothing to add to the GT-14 vs. D discussion......other than I'd take the "big C" over both. :whistle:

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refracman

As allways everyone is entitled to a opinion.

Let me tell a little story here you mite of heard it before but here it goes anyhow.

After the engine went in my C120 I sold it and bought the 417xt.(should of got the 520 lxi) Well i put the blade off the 120 on it and it was hitttin the trans. So i fugure this aint no good.and it has a aluminum trans.

So I go and borrow my brother GT14 put my little 42 plow on it WOW this thing will move mountians!. It was then I spy a D200 with a homemade loader on at a auction. I go over to Carls and ask him (since i am still a rookie) do i go for the D?.

He said buy the loader and forget about them Ds. nothin but headaches and ifins it had a loader its wore out. Get a GT14 and slap it on and forget about it!

So i buy the loader and its definitly homemade and but its all there. Now to find a GT14, none to found around here. So i start lookin on the web. Found one in Conn. and go get it, put got the loader on it with some mods to it. (see pic one) After i broke the front axel. I figure its time to make it fit right. Cut it all apart and rebuilt it and make a subframe for it. This all happened in late 03 with the rebiuld in spring 04.(pic 2) I have moved 400 to 500 ton of fill with it since. And its still going strong.

So i would say get the GT14. Dang things are like a Timex. Takes a licking and keeps on tickin!

xtgt.jpg

100_0151.jpg

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sshell

Thanks for all the input. I always use my Horses, thats how I justify them to my wife B) , but I am planning on going up to my uncles this fall and will test them both out and make my decision then. As far as it goes I will trade work, helping shingle the barn, for the tractor. My uncle would never take money from me even if I try, but is happy to accept help. i am leaning towrds the GT-14 but love the way the D looks, tough looking horse.

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WheelHorse_of_course

That was only the D 250, the smaller D's were made by Wheel Horse.

I have 2 D series tractors and one GT-14. I prefer the D series tractors for the fact the you can find more attachments for them and the attachments are easier to change.

Thanks for clearing that up.

Still suspect I'd go with the GT14, but B)

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Stigian

I think if i had to chose, id go for both B):whistle:

Ok ok, i know B)

Id go for the D, on the gounds of i quite fancy a bigger WH B)

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