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gratefulydeadman

k161 rebuild questions

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gratefulydeadman

hey guys, i just purchased a 1961 701 w/k161 on it. the motor has a broken rod in it. Now ive been told that this year motor didnt have the compression relief system that the later kohlers had. thus the reason it had the double belt system from the generator to start it. do i have to order any speacial parts for this motor or is it ok to just order a regular rebuild kit for it? i am getting the cylinder bored +.10 and getting a -.10 crank for it. I found a complete rebuild kit on ebay and it comes with a +.10 piston and a -.10 crank for $115/delivered. is that a good price? thanks... ralph

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TT

You really shouldn't buy individual internal parts or a "kit" until measurements are taken and/or machine work is done.

It's an early small-bore K-161, so make sure you get the right parts - and I honestly don't know if you can even buy a "kit" for your specific engine.

Later K-161 engines didn't have ACR either, so as long as the camshaft is in good condition, reinstall it and forget about it. :D

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wheelhorse656

You really shouldn't buy individual internal parts or a "kit" until measurements are taken and/or machine work is done.

It's an early small-bore K-161, so make sure you get the right parts - and I honestly don't know if you can even buy a "kit" for your specific engine.

Later K-161 engines didn't have ACR either, so as long as the camshaft is in good condition, reinstall it and forget about it. :D

Most machine shops wont do machine work though until they have a piston and rod to go by with mesurements.

At least mine wont.

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TT

I use nothing but OEM parts and the standard sizes are in the book. If your machinist can't add or subtract .010", .020", or .030", then you're in trouble. :hide:

If you use aftermarket parts, you're on your own.

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wheelhorse656

hey guys, i just purchased a 1961 701 w/k161 on it. the motor has a broken rod in it. Now ive been told that this year motor didnt have the compression relief system that the later kohlers had. thus the reason it had the double belt system from the generator to start it. do i have to order any speacial parts for this motor or is it ok to just order a regular rebuild kit for it? i am getting the cylinder bored +.10 and getting a -.10 crank for it. I found a complete rebuild kit on ebay and it comes with a +.10 piston and a -.10 crank for $115/delivered. is that a good price? thanks... ralph

instead of buying a new set of valves i would saggest just having the old reground and the seats as well. but this will only work if the valves are in tolerance. Ok i would also say if your bearings are ok then you should just need this kit. but if you need the bearing and the valves he also sells those. I hope this link helps!

http://www.ebay.com/...=item58911268f1.

Here is a link to a the manul for the k161. The parts i found are for the k181 but he sells the kits for the k181 and k161 they take some of the same rebuilding parts.

http://www.kohlereng...pdf/tp_2379.pdf

Hope this helps you out!

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wheelhorse656

I use nothing but OEM parts and the standard sizes are in the book. If your machinist can't add or subtract .010", .020", or .030", then you're in trouble. :hide:

If you use aftermarket parts, you're on your own.

My machinest said that he goes by piston size because he has had oem pistons very by up to .03 and he said all it takes is that amount to cuase somthing to go out of clearence if your not carful. I buy most of my kits for engines from this guy and i have around 100 hours on one of his kits and im still runing good and smooth. I would probly go oem if i have the extra $150 to spend on the kit. But i trust this guy and my machinest . he does most of the engines that get rebuilt in my area and he is highly respectible.

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TT

OK. Apparently I've been doing it wrong for 30 years. :scratchead:

Is this the same guy that told you a K-161 and a K-181 take the same rebuild kit?

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wheelhorse656

OK. Apparently I've been doing it wrong for 30 years. :scratchead:

Is this the same guy that told you a K-161 and a K-181 take the same rebuild kit?

I edited my post because i dident relize that i let come off that they are the same kit but they do take some the same rebuilding parts. dident say you have been doing wrong for 30 years either. 99% of your machine shopes wont bore out an engine unless they mic. the piston out first how you do it is your own bissness.

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buckrancher

I always mic the piston first before boring out a cylinder and you need to know what style of piston you are using as the point where you mic the dia. can be at a differant point on the piston skirt

and the kohler repair manual tells to mic the piston before you bore the cylinder ( piston dia. + cylinder clearance dim.= bore dia.)

Brian

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TT

@Brian ~ This is from Ralph's other topic on this same tractor:

well i started work on the 701 today. Got some before pictures taken and pulled the motor. Im tearing the motor down tomorrow and soaking the pieces. Then off to the machine shop to get bored +.10. I already ordered the rebuild kit with +.10 piston and -.10 crank.

He's got a 50 year old engine and had not even tore it down yet when he ordered a .010" / .010" kit. How many of these have you been in that have already had machine work done? How many have had a scratched cylinder wall that you weren't sure how far out you had to go before it "cleaned up" - if it even would?

If the kit is for the "big-bore" K-161, will a small-bore 161 block even take being bored .0725"? :confusion-shrug:

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wheelhorse656

Terry, he said he found a kit not that he bought a kit. I garentee he know's you have to tare an engine appart before you buy a kit. Brian is right, its right in the kohler manul should ALWAYS mic your piston before bore boring the block. ( piston dia. + cylinder clearance dim.= bore dia.) I have never heard of a repuatble machine shop boring an engine block before mesuring the piston then adding the clearance to get the proper bore size.

most machinest who have been in trade for many years develop and eye for blocks my machines said on one of my engines you should on have to go +.010 and gusse what +.010 did the trick. another he said +.030 and +.030 did the trick. Every engine block he has done for me and grandpa he has been right on how far to go over. and it always cleens up right!

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buckrancher

I agree that the engine must be tore down and the cylinder bore checked (with a bore gage) for dia. ,taper, and out of round before ever buying anything

as you have no idea what has been done before you got it

Brian

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TT

Thank you, Brian....

That's the point I was trying to make. :handgestures-thumbup:

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wheelhorse656

I agree that the engine must be tore down and the cylinder bore checked (with a bore gage) for dia. ,taper, and out of round before ever buying anything

as you have no idea what has been done before you got it

Brian

Agreed brian! I do this before i order my parts. if thiers a taper in the cylander that cant be bore out whats the point in buying a kit. Just a wast of money.

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gratefulydeadman

ok.. where to start? so today i got to tearing down the k161. what a disater... well i knew that it had thrown a rod before teardown, but i didnt realize the rod was in 7 pieces. upon rmoving the piston. i was turning the crank when i noticed that when the rod broke it cracked the camshaft. so i am sorry to announce that i think im just gonna try and find another k161 for my 701.. thanks for all the help guys. does anyone know anybody in the harrisburg area with a spare??? thanks ralph

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TT

Check with Dave Brown:

http://www.davestractorworldonline.com/

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hummod

Do you ever travel to the northern tier area (Sayre)? I have one from a parts 701 that I am not

planning to use.

Larry

Sayre, PA

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gratefulydeadman

i have been known to travel from time to time. what would u be looking to get for it? what shape is it in?

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hummod

I wish I could be sure of the condition. I just removed it from the tractor and put it

on the shelf. I needed the fuel pump and I took the carburetor off it. I can put

the carb back on and a fuel pump. It just needs a diaphram. I do know there are

no broken rods or broken cam. If you are still interested I can come up with a price.

I am usually pretty cheap. I think we can still send Personal Messages.

Larry

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