New Member, New to Wheel Horse & Now I Own a 656

[BradKahler 28]

I recently got the bug to get an older lawn tractor so I started watching FB Marketplace.  After dealing with a lot of scammers I finally came across a 1966 656 Wheel Horse that showed up Friday and was only 27 miles from me.  This one turned out to not be a scam and after looking at it I decided to go ahead and buy it.  I'm the third owner, the 2nd owner bought it from an estate sale of the original owner.  He sat on it for about four years and then decided he didn't have time and now it's my turn.  

 

What I've discovered so far is the engine seems to be good, although there is a good chance I'll have to replace the carburetor.  The rear axle seals are weeping a bit and the pull starter needs a new spring at a minimum.  I'm not sure what my plans are just yet.  I'm waffling on doing a quick rebuild so I can use it or do a full blown tear down and rebuild.  It still has the original (although rotted) Wheel Horse tires on it and other than the mower deck the tractor is structurally sound.  I would like to rebuild the mower deck and am currently thinking that the top section could be cut out and a new panel welded in place.  I need to ponder that for a while.  

 

Brad

[ri702bill 10,166]

Brad - Welcome!

Nice score there. You may just be better off locating another 36" gear drive deck shell. You can post  for one in the "Wanted" classifieds.

A quirky feature of the later 1960's short frame tractors is the flip up seat / pan. The issue is that this can happen at the wrong time if the pan latch is not secure. Let out the clutch & you get pitched off the back!!  It all looks mighty complete and original....

[BradKahler 28]

Thanks!

 

I will definitely keep my open for a replacement deck.  I'm not holding my breath and will attempt to repair the original if all else fails.  Actually the deck isn't a high priority, I do all my mowing right now with a Scag mower.  I noticed the latch mechanism for the seat pan is frozen, as are several other items that I'll be dealing with.  I personally can't see myself chasing a mower at my age (69) so thanks for  the warning 

 

Since I need to replace all of the tires I'm contemplating replacing the tires with look alike tractor tires and not the more typical lawn type tires.  I'm not sure if that's practical or not though.

[Ed Kennell 43,238]

to the 

 

Nice find.  She looks complete and unmolested.      If those tires hold air, a tire paint could make them look good.

[Handy Don 14,792]

1 hour ago, BradKahler said:

Since I need to replace all of the tires I'm contemplating replacing the tires with look alike tractor tires and not the more typical lawn type tires.  I'm not sure if that's practical or not though.

Welcome.

 

What she’s wearing now is the kind she came with so they might be “original."

If you look at the many “tire” posts on this site, you’ll discover a wide variety of tire preferences. For example, I personally prefer the Firestone and Silvertown “All Purpose” 6-12’s on the rear and the now-Carlisle “Sawtooth” on the front--these were “factory” in the early 60’s. Bottom line: it’s your tractor so it oughta reflect your goals. 

 

I agree with @ri702bill that repairing a deck shell as damaged as that one will be a lot of work and may not even be successful. Transferring the usable parts likely will be easier (start now dosing fasteners with penetrant 😁). My 36” gear deck is built from the best parts from three decks. Also, assuming you decide to actually run it as a mower, you’ll be looking for blades with a little more life in them. 

 

Keep us posted--with pictures!

[ri702bill 10,166]

Rear tires usually fall into 3 categories for this style / vintage tractor. Turf tires, the afore mentioned Town & Country "Snow" tire and Vbar Ag tires. Similar for front tires - The sawtooth style, Tri-ribbed style and Ag tires. Your tractor, your choice...

Newcomers to the tire puzzle are ATV tires.....

Tire physical sizes vary greatly from one manufacturer to the next - all with the same markings on the sidewall!! Import tires tend to run on the smaller end...

[Achto 29,964]

[BradKahler 28]

3 hours ago, Ed Kennell said:

to the 

 

Nice find.  She looks complete and unmolested.      If those tires hold air, a tire paint could make them look good.

 

Thanks.  I was surprised how straight the sheet metal is and how complete it is.  The tires look ok from a distance but up close they are full of cracks.  One of the rear tires actually had water seeping out of the cracks, which concerns me on what condition the rim might be in.  I wish they were in better condition, I thought it was kinda cool to have the original tires from 1966.

 

 

[BradKahler 28]

2 hours ago, Handy Don said:

Welcome.

 

What she’s wearing now is the kind she came with so they might be “original."

If you look at the many “tire” posts on this site, you’ll discover a wide variety of tire preferences. For example, I personally prefer the Firestone and Silvertown “All Purpose” 6-12’s on the rear and the now-Carlisle “Sawtooth” on the front--these were “factory” in the early 60’s. Bottom line: it’s your tractor so it oughta reflect your goals. 

 

I would not be surprised if they were the original tires.  I think the tractor sat outside, outside unfortunately,  more than it was used. I'm going to have to do some research on the difference between Ag and sawtooth tires.   This is my first real venture into the older lawn tractor market.  

 

2 hours ago, Handy Don said:

I agree with @ri702bill that repairing a deck shell as damaged as that one will be a lot of work and may not even be successful. Transferring the usable parts likely will be easier (start now dosing fasteners with penetrant 😁). My 36” gear deck is built from the best parts from three decks. Also, assuming you decide to actually run it as a mower, you’ll be looking for blades with a little more life in them. 

 

Keep us posted--with pictures!

 

I was really surprised by the fact that the deck was so rusted but the rest of the tractor has just surface rust.  I've been watching FB and ebay for the last few weeks when I first started looking for Wheel Horse specifically and have only seen a few mower decks and none close enough to me to even consider them.  

 

 

[BradKahler 28]

44 minutes ago, ri702bill said:

Rear tires usually fall into 3 categories for this style / vintage tractor. Turf tires, the afore mentioned Town & Country "Snow" tire and Vbar Ag tires. Similar for front tires - The sawtooth style, Tri-ribbed style and Ag tires. Your tractor, your choice...

Newcomers to the tire puzzle are ATV tires.....

Tire physical sizes vary greatly from one manufacturer to the next - all with the same markings on the sidewall!! Import tires tend to run on the smaller end...

 

Good info.  The current rear tires are 23x8.5-12.  Am I correct in assuming a 6-12 Ag tire will fit on the same rim?

 

Whatever tires I by will be Carlisle or some other American made tire.  I've tried Chinese tires on my Cushman's and they are total crap and have switched them all over to Carlisle tires.

[Handy Don 14,792]

5 minutes ago, BradKahler said:

difference between Ag and sawtooth tires. 

6-12 will not fit on the 8.5 inch rims you have. They need 6 inch rims. Rim widths are measured from bead to bead, not to the outer lips of the rim. 

 

Ag (sometimes called V-bar or lugged) come in MANY different patterns.

 

Sawtooth (it refers to the shape of the groove in the tread. WH used these on the fronts only.

 

ATV tires are a whole other ballgame!

Edited Sunday at 11:12 PM by Handy Don

[BradKahler 28]

Just now, Handy Don said:

Ag (sometimes called V-bar or lugged) come in MANY different patterns.

 

Sawtooth (it refers to the shape of the groove in the tread. WH used these on the fronts only.

 

ATV tires are a whole other ballgame!

 

My fronts are the Sawtooth style.  Looking at the top picture, I'm kinda leaning towards the one on the left.  Fortunately  I have a few weeks to think about it

 

Thanks!

[Handy Don 14,792]

8 minutes ago, BradKahler said:

Looking at the top picture, I'm kinda leaning towards the one on the left. 

Those are just some examples--a picture I copied off the internet. Not all patterns are available your size. For “ag tires” one consideration is how close to continuous ground contact the ribs make--affects the smoothness of the ride!

You’ll be looking using your rear tire size 23-8.5x12. Notionally this is 23” in overall diameter, 8.5” rim width, 12” rim diameter. Notionally.

That said, pay heed to lots of posts here on different brands and sizes and patterns. Manufacturer labeled sizes are, to be charitable, aspirational and not to be confused with being accurate--even for sorta-US brands like Carlisle. 

Edited Sunday at 11:21 PM by Handy Don

[ri702bill 10,166]

47 minutes ago, Handy Don said:

6-12 will not fit on the 8.5 inch rims you have. They need 6 inch rims

I'm thinking that somewhere in its almost 60 year life, a set of C series tires & rims got a new home on the 656.

Here's a photo comparison back to back. My C81 and my 854 8 speed dressed for winter...

 

 

[953 nut 62,432]

7 hours ago, BradKahler said:

I'm not sure what my plans are just yet.  I'm waffling on doing a quick rebuild so I can use it or do a full blown tear down and rebuild.

It is your tractor and your decision but considering the nice condition it is in I would just get it running and enjoy it. A little 000 steel wool and WD-40 will rejuvenate the paint while preserving the patina.

1 hour ago, BradKahler said:

One of the rear tires actually had water seeping out of the cracks,

Could be the previous owner liquid filled the tires for added traction.

[Handy Don 14,792]

In thinking about it, I believe @ri702bill is correct. It would have been 6-12’s from the factory with tires like (or very similar to) the ones on the right in Bill's picture. 

[BradKahler 28]

2 hours ago, Handy Don said:

Those are just some examples--a picture I copied off the internet. Not all patterns are available your size. For “ag tires” one consideration is how close to continuous ground contact the ribs make--affects the smoothness of the ride!

 

You just jogged my memory.  Years ago I had a Case 530 backhoe with Ag tires and the ride was horrible!   I may need to reconsider my tire thinking.

 

2 hours ago, Handy Don said:

You’ll be looking using your rear tire size 23-8.5x12. Notionally this is 23” in overall diameter, 8.5” rim width, 12” rim diameter. Notionally.

That said, pay heed to lots of posts here on different brands and sizes and patterns. Manufacturer labeled sizes are, to be charitable, aspirational and not to be confused with being accurate--even for sorta-US brands like Carlisle. 

 

Thanks 

[BradKahler 28]

1 hour ago, ri702bill said:

I'm thinking that somewhere in its almost 60 year life, a set of C series tires & rims got a new home on the 656.

Here's a photo comparison back to back. My C81 and my 854 8 speed dressed for winter...

 

 

 

Now isn't that interesting.  I guess I really need to rethink this whole tire situation.   Thanks for spotting that.

[BradKahler 28]

12 hours ago, 953 nut said:

It is your tractor and your decision but considering the nice condition it is in I would just get it running and enjoy it. A little 000 steel wool and WD-40 will rejuvenate the paint while preserving the patina.

 

Steel wool and WD40 is what I've been leaning towards but the rusty condition of the rims is what concerns me the most.  I worried that freshly painted rims would look out of place.

 

Quote

Could be the previous owner liquid filled the tires for added traction.

 

I'll find out tomorrow as I'm planning on removing all of tires from the rims.

Edited yesterday at 12:41 PM by BradKahler

[ri702bill 10,166]

10 hours ago, 953 nut said:

11 hours ago, BradKahler said:

One of the rear tires actually had water seeping out of the cracks,

Could be the previous owner liquid filled the tires for added traction.

That could open a can of worms!! Up north, we never use plain water to load a tire - it freezes & expands in addition to rotting the rim from the inside out....(the old farmer trick of using calcium did the same as far as damaging the rim.)

My picture of the 854 & the C81 - both have loaded tires, using inner tubes and winter windshield antifreeze juice.

You just may find yourself needing another pair of rims....

[BradKahler 28]

5 hours ago, ri702bill said:

That could open a can of worms!! Up north, we never use plain water to load a tire - it freezes & expands in addition to rotting the rim from the inside out....(the old farmer trick of using calcium did the same as far as damaging the rim.)

My picture of the 854 & the C81 - both have loaded tires, using inner tubes and winter windshield antifreeze juice.

You just may find yourself needing another pair of rims....

 

I just finished removing the tires from rims, front and rear.  I'm happy to report the rear wheels are clean inside.  The back sides are clean as well, only the outer faces are dirty/rusty.  I think they are more dirty that rusty.  I'm going to try a little scrubbing to see what happens.  

 

 

The front rims are a different story.  They are rusty which doesn't bother me to much, but both rims are bent on the outer rims.  I'm not sure if I want to deal with trying to straighten them or just find replacements.  

 

 

 

 

[Ed Kennell 43,238]

Those fronts don't look that bad.   

[Bar Nuthin 1,554]

14 hours ago, BradKahler said:

I worried that freshly painted rims would look out of place.

 

Actually, patina tractors look pretty good with new shoes!

 

[BradKahler 28]

1 hour ago, Bar Nuthin said:

 

Actually, patina tractors look pretty good with new shoes!

 

 

Kinda like a hobo that was given a pair of new shoes... 

 

 

[BradKahler 28]

The one attachment that I would really like to have for the tractor is a mid mount grader blade.  From my searches so far it would appear that mid mounted blades are pretty rare.  I found some posts where people have made their own blades and I think that's the approach I will likely take, unless an original blade setup just happens to fall in my lap 

 

From the posts I've read it looks like an MA-1 quick attach system is used for the blade.  Is the mechanism circled in red an MA-1 quick attach?  I found these instructions for the MA-1 here in one of the forums.  I'm fairly comfortable that I can fabricate all of the necessary parts and I think I've found a blade locally that might work.  Should be a fun little project.  

Blade_Grader_Mid-mounted_40in_1968_7-1111__A-5251_-1.pdf