stevasaurus 23,381 #1 Posted Wednesday at 07:13 PM Well, it looks like a depth of new cap bearings discussion is in order. So be it. To be fair to @TonyToro Jr. , I suggest we start a new topic and not ruin his thread. The cap bearing issue is common to all of the Wheel Horse manual and auto transmissions, and since there seems to be no resourse from Wheel Horse clearifying the issue, it will be up to us and our common since and experience to determine the correct depth of placement of the "Cap Bearing". Gentlemen, let's have the discussion we can all be proud of that effects all of us who have re-built one of these excellent transmissions. Link to original thread. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stevasaurus 23,381 #2 Posted Wednesday at 07:41 PM All right, I'll start. I believe the cap bearing should be tapped or pressed into the hole in the casting from the outside to a point where the bearing is flush with the outside of the casting. Here is a couple of pictures...Burrly1's #5007 transmissions. The 1st thing to admit...this is a nice look. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
squonk 44,298 #3 Posted Wednesday at 09:32 PM (edited) Un-molested bearing on my 857 trans.As I know it has never been apart. The bearing edge is about a 1/16" in from the case edge. Same as the 2 transmissions I worked on. Al little closer to the edge is probably better than too far in. Edited Wednesday at 10:04 PM by squonk 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ri702bill 9,797 #4 Posted Wednesday at 09:47 PM Installing a component flush is fairly straightforward. Installing to a depth beyond flush or shy of flush would best be done with a stepped driver... 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
squonk 44,298 #5 Posted Wednesday at 10:15 PM Here is a picture of the other side of the 857 trans. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ebinmaine 73,948 #6 Posted Wednesday at 10:26 PM I don't have pics handy but I'm sure I've seen capped bearings just a scosche past flush. Could be 1/16". Could be 1/32". I've definitely installed them flush. I've used sockets to drive them. Also used actual correct sized drivers. Both worked equally well given carefully chosen tools. 50 minutes ago, squonk said: closer to the edge is probably better than too far in. Seconded. My impression of the cap portion is to retain the oil, not set the bearing depth. IF that's correct then a little loose-osity to the outer side shouldn't be an issue. 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JoeM 8,634 #7 Posted Thursday at 12:22 AM last two i did were set flush on inside I figured the inside is machined to a tolerance ?? before pic 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kpinnc 15,165 #8 Posted Thursday at 12:34 AM 2 hours ago, squonk said: The bearing edge is about a 1/16" in from the case edge. Same with all 8 of mine. Just recessed enough to notice. Not sure what the endplay should be (or if it is even specified) but I've always put them at the same depth on rebuilds. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WHX?? 52,419 #9 Posted Thursday at 01:26 AM I thought it should be flush to the inside so whatever shaft rides on it would have the most bearing surface. On the other hand better oiling if flush to the outside? There would definitely be a space between the the inner race and shaft. Anything in the manual? I suppose one of us could go look ... 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WHX?? 52,419 #10 Posted Thursday at 01:40 AM (edited) A 5060 original never been opened. First one I ever had apart other than a three piece. I took them pics so i would know how the replacements should be in. Last pic looks to be an open one tho. Edited Thursday at 01:42 AM by WHX?? 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
oliver2-44 10,879 #11 Posted Thursday at 02:58 AM (edited) 5 hours ago, ri702bill said: Installing a component flush is fairly straightforward. Installing to a depth beyond flush or shy of flush would best be done with a stepped driver... I think the main question is flush to the outside or flush to the inside. So a stepped driver would not be required. I checked, and looks like I’ve done them both ways on a couple of 3 speeds I’ve done. So much for my consistency. I’ll try to check 2 unmolested 8 speeds I currently have on tractors at the house Edited Thursday at 02:59 AM by oliver2-44 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Racinbob 12,117 #12 Posted Thursday at 10:01 AM The 5060 I currently have on the bench has them slightly recessed from the outside of the case and I didn't change those. I've always set them flush with the outside of the case and never had any issues and really never gave it a thought. So.....the manual? A quick scan and I found one blub on it but I'm sure there is more. Page 39 #16: "When replacing bearings they should be pressed in so that they are flush with the inside of the case" Based on what the cap bearings are carrying I really don't think it matters. Like Eric said, a properly sized socket works as well as anything. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
squonk 44,298 #13 Posted Thursday at 10:27 AM So in other words. it looks like it doesn't really matter. It works flush inside, flush outside and recessed. 1 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
squonk 44,298 #14 Posted Thursday at 11:10 AM 1 hour ago, Racinbob said: The 5060 I currently have on the bench has them slightly recessed from the outside of the case "When replacing bearings they should be pressed in so that they are flush with the inside of the case" Here's a question. When they are flush on the inside are they recessed on the outside like in my pics? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Racinbob 12,117 #15 Posted Thursday at 11:36 AM 24 minutes ago, squonk said: Here's a question. When they are flush on the inside are they recessed on the outside like in my pics? I don't know for sure but I'd guess yes. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Racinbob 12,117 #16 Posted Thursday at 11:40 AM (edited) 1 hour ago, squonk said: So in other words. it looks like it doesn't really matter. It works flush inside, flush outside and recessed. The shaft isn't dependent on the cap bearings to hold their position so that little bit doesn't matter. Being flush on the inside will give a little more bearing contact on the shaft but again, not enough to matter. Quite simply that statement is 100% correct. The bearings aren't quite as tall as the case thickness at the bearing point. If the bearing is installed anywhere within that case thickness it's fine. Edited Thursday at 11:49 AM by Racinbob 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stevasaurus 23,381 #17 Posted Thursday at 08:33 PM I'll add this at this point. All of the manual Wheel Horse transmissions use 3 cap bearings (the 3,4,6 &8 speeds)...and they all have a depth of 3/4" on the package. I happen to have a #5053 3 speed tore down in the garage, and guess what? All of the holes that would have cap bearings (the castings) measure 3/4" inside to outside. The cap bearings that I pulled out actually measure a depth of 11/16". That tells me, we are haggeling about where you want to hide that 1/16". Looks like it does not really matter wether you set them flush with the inside or the outside. For me, I like the look of the bearings set flush to the outside of the casting. The one thing you don't want is that cap bearing set too deep that the shaft it holds is riding in the end of the cap it self. I think I will agree that the factory set them flush to the inside. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Handy Don 14,414 #18 Posted Thursday at 08:43 PM (edited) Having been inside exactly one WH transaxle, I am but a weak voice in this thread. I will note that the machined surfaces, the ones likely to a specific tolerance, are all on the inside. Any variability in the casting will affect the outside. Edited Thursday at 08:57 PM by Handy Don 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites