8 HP Kohler engine towing weight question

[FLtractor 56]

Afternoon,

 

anyone happen to know how much roughly  my 856 can tow safely with its 1 cylinder 8 HP Kohler engine? 

[ebinmaine 72,728]

The amount of weight you can pull is going to be shockingly high.

 

Your concern is actually going to be the amount of weight you can STOP.

 

I've never seen an actual rating.

Terrain is a huge issue. Traction is of course another.

 

 

[ri702bill 9,454]

Another thing is the mechanical advantage of either a 6 or 8 speed over a 4 speed. Low Range is a 4:1 reduction and is HUGE getting a load to move. Your 856 has the 4 speed - go easy...

[ebinmaine 72,728]

13 minutes ago, FLtractor said:

Afternoon,

 

anyone happen to know how much roughly  my 856 can tow safely with its 1 cylinder 8 HP Kohler engine? 

 

 

What prompts the question? What are you thinking of trying to move?

[Handy Don 14,082]

6 minutes ago, ebinmaine said:

What prompts the question? What are you thinking of trying to move?

SO many factors come into play when towing with a tractor means there is no simple answer other than “it depends..."

[lynnmor 7,825]

From a 520H Owners Manual:

I may have gone ten times that, but that is not my recommendation.

[ebinmaine 72,728]

And that's from a 520H  which is a substantially heavier, longer, wider, more powerful tractor.

[FLtractor 56]

2 hours ago, ebinmaine said:

 

 

What prompts the question? What are you thinking of trying to move?

came across a wooden horse pulled wagon with 2 bench seats for probably up to 6 people… would 856 be able to safely slowly on flat ground be able to tow that? If adapted for tractor tow use and or a wagon with seating made to tow.. Can’t post a picture dispite several attempts to resize smaller. 

 

[squonk 43,843]

Check the frame too. Look at my "something loose in the caboose thread" 

[ebinmaine 72,728]

1 hour ago, FLtractor said:

 

 

If you're on a smart phone you can do a screen shot then post that.  

 

 

As far as hauling humans.....

I personally would ONLY do that for kids that are relatives with their parents close to hand.  

The liability risk is too high.  

 

I would also ONLY do so on level flat hard ground.  ANY tilt would potentially be a serious issue.  

[kpinnc 14,651]

11 hours ago, ebinmaine said:

Your concern is actually going to be the amount of weight you can STOP.

 

 

 Agreed. 

 

I assume you're asking about your 856, and the engine isn't the limiting factor.

 

That transmission is capable of pulling thousands of static pounds. But the axles can only support a few hundred pounds, and the brake in most cases barely can stop the empty weight of the tractor. 

 

In short, you can tow a full size truck on flat ground, but it will run you over on the slightest incline. 

 

And using the gears to hold a heavy load from getting away is a terrible idea just because of the type of differential you have. If one wheel slips, it's all over. 

 

Florida may not have a whole lot of hills, but it doesn't take a steep grade to get away from you. 

 

 

[953 nut 60,083]

16 hours ago, FLtractor said:

came across a wooden horse pulled wagon with 2 bench seats for probably up to 6 people… would 856 be able to safely slowly on flat ground be able to tow that? If adapted for tractor tow use and or a wagon with seating made to tow.. 

My guess would be about 1,000 to 1,500 pounds for the wagon and ad another 1,000 pounds for six people. Will an 856 get it moving, YES. Can an 856 safely stop it once it is moving, NO.

          Never tow anything that weighs more than 50% of the tow vehicle's weight.

[adsm08 3,266]

22 hours ago, 953 nut said:

Never tow anything that weighs more than 50% of the tow vehicle's weight

 

Oops.

[ebinmaine 72,728]

22 hours ago, 953 nut said:

Never tow anything that weighs more than 50% of the tow vehicle's weight.

 

That definitely depends on the vehicle and how it's set up.  

 A good example of this would be Trina's 2012 Honda Pilot. 

It weighs between 4,200 lb and 4,400 lb depending where you look.

 As it is set up currently, it has a factory tow rating of 4,500 lb given the right circumstances.

 

In this particular TRACTOR case I think half the towing machine's empty static weight is fairly accurate.

[953 nut 60,083]

38 minutes ago, ebinmaine said:

That definitely depends on the vehicle and how it's set up. 

Obviously if trailer brakes and a weight distributing hitch are used with an auto/truck being the tow vehicle the 50% thought wouldn't apply. 

[ebinmaine 72,728]

8 minutes ago, 953 nut said:

Obviously if trailer brakes and a weight distributing hitch are used with an auto/truck being the tow vehicle the 50% thought wouldn't apply. 

 

 

Yessir.  

 

Just wanted to keep clarification for future readers.  

 

 

[Lee1977 7,215]

It it's a typical horse wagon with tall iron tired wheels it's going to be hard to stop once moving. The tall wheels makes it easer to pull but also harder to stop.

Your 856 is a tractor with clutch and brake on a single peddle. it's out of gear when applying the brake. Wheel Horses don't have a lot of stopping power.

 

Edited July 5 by Lee1977

[squonk 43,843]

It's called MO MENT UM! 

[SylvanLakeWH 28,443]

This comes up frequently. 
 

Pulling in low 1 or 1 it will pull a lot... stopping, as mentioned-not so much.

 

Something else is where's the weight? If it's above the rear axle you add to the problem...

 

I pulled my train fully loaded with kids and occasionally adults. Easily over 1000 lbs. Hitches all below or at axle height, Dead flat paved street only... First gear. Never any issues...

 

 

[squonk 43,843]

6 minutes ago, SylvanLakeWH said:

This comes up frequently. 
 

Pulling in low 1 or 1 it will pull a lot... stopping, as mentioned-not so much.

 

Something else is where's the weight? If it's above the rear axle you add to the problem...

 

I pulled my train fully loaded with kids and occasionally adults. Easily over 1000 lbs. Hitches all below or at axle height, Dead flat paved street only... First gear. Never any issues...

 

 

 

Electric motor braking on that? 

[SylvanLakeWH 28,443]

41 minutes ago, squonk said:

Electric motor braking on that? 

Interesting you ask that... the tractor, brakes, transmission etc is exactly the same as a C Black Hood. I never "tested" the concept... but I'm thinking no...? Not thinking the drive belt would hold? I pulled it with both my C-105 and the E-141's and noted no braking difference...

 

 

I no longer have the E-141's or the train...

[953 nut 60,083]

1 hour ago, squonk said:

Electric motor braking on that? 

I can't speak about the C models of electric  but the A-60 motor restricts the speed when going down hill. My driveway is rather steep and I use first gear going down and up. I have never turned off the switch while going down (nor am I stupid enough to try it) to see if the counter EMF is causing the controlled descent speed.

[Lee1977 7,215]

The electric motor is still turned by the belt so even with out forward power there has to be some resistance.

[Handy Don 14,082]

 

24 minutes ago, 953 nut said:

the A-60 motor restricts the speed

Does the A-60 have a belt in the drive train or is it all chain and gears? Big difference between belt and chain.

 

2 hours ago, Lee1977 said:

856 is a tractor with clutch and brake on a single pedal

Very aware of this on my 854. Braking relies on constant good traction for BOTH rear wheels and (the very unreliable anyway) engine/drive train braking is off the table at that point. 

[SylvanLakeWH 28,443]

1 hour ago, Handy Don said:

Does the A-60 have a belt in the drive train or is it all chain and gears? Big difference between belt and chain

They have both. Belt from motor to trans. Chain from trans to axle.