Bad coil or what?

[tvr383 0]

Hi,

Recently my engine (K-582) just died after some short runs experimenting with a deck I'm trying to adapt to my 18-auto. Just like if it lacks fuel.It would restart but not right after I would need to wait few minutes.

Also If I try to restart it would smoke only on one side.

This is a recent acquisition of a tractor that sat for a long time so I don't know if it ran well in a recent past.

Something that attracks my attention is I recently hook up an original kohler coil but the thing had cracks to it and I patched it up with some gasket maker( locktite )brand...maybe I should throw this out and get a new one.

I had cleaned up the carb and fuel pump (impulsion type) I had checked and saw good fuel delivery at the carb inlet and used the kohler on-line manual for the K-482 and 582 to set the carb but mostlikely it is not best tuned.

Any suggestions?

thanks.

[dgoyette 12]

Did you check for spark? What condition are the coil wires and plugs in? Points set to .20?

[tvr383 0]

Did you check for spark? What condition are the coil wires and plugs in? Points set to .20?

To me it sounds as a bad coil and a friend mechanic just confirms me that a n engine that dyes while running and needs time to restart is generally sign of a malfunctionning coil so I will get a new one.

Apparently NAPA sells it nobody would have NAPA's part number for it?

thanks.

[dgoyette 12]

I don't know the napa number but if you give them the Kohler number they can cross reference easily. KOHLER= 277375-S.

Expect about $129.00 from Napa.

Let us know how it works out. Before you order make sure the (I) wire on the ignition switch is not loose. That was an issue I had with. It would vibrate enough to kill the engine but then would restart because it was still on well enough to re-establish the contact. Maybe not the issue but worth a look before spending that kind of cash on a new coil.

[oldandred 15]

also could be a bad condenser it will do the same thing

just looked in the napa small parts book and they dont show one

for the twin kohler

[CasualObserver 3,410]

Kirk Engines sells a non-OEM dual coil for opposed twin Kohlers and Onans for only $60... and a lot of other specialty parts. Dave Kirk, the guy who owns/runs it is a Cub collector, so his stuff is more popular and well known in that circle... and most everything he makes is yellow.

p.s.... I just looked at the web page, and for some reason the text didn't show up... if you have that problem, just click your mouse and drag it down, when you highlight the whole page, you can read it.

Page is visible from Internet explorer just fine, but not Firefox...?? :ychain:

[tvr383 0]

Kirk Engines sells a non-OEM dual coil for opposed twin Kohlers and Onans for only $60... and a lot of other specialty parts. Dave Kirk, the guy who owns/runs it is a Cub collector, so his stuff is more popular and well known in that circle... and most everything he makes is yellow.

p.s.... I just looked at the web page, and for some reason the text didn't show up... if you have that problem, just click your mouse and drag it down, when you highlight the whole page, you can read it.

thank you I,ve just ordered these ...a coil in Canada is 223.00 canadian dollars!!

[Red Iron 1]

Here's a trick to be sure I have juice going to coil. I wire a small light

bulb to the positive side of coil and ground other end to ground. This way, you have a visual "voltmeter" to be sure of power is reaching the coil when it "dies".

The light bulb can be any one of those sidemarker lamps (164, 194) if you

have a socket. Otherwise, "mini'jumper wires (with alligator clips) will easily

hold one of these bulbs since they have "pins" rather than a twist-in style.

Simply, if the light stays on when engine dies, then take the ground wire from bulb and attach it to the points side and try again. The light will flicker quite a bit, but

if it keeps flickering, you know your points are functioning, tho maybe not set.

I have replaced one on my old 1054, to find out my coil was not the correct version, (automotive style are actually 9-10v), not straight 12v. The automotive coil will run much hotter and soon burn-out.

Good luck :scratchead:

[tvr383 0]

Here's a trick to be sure I have juice going to coil. I wire a small light

bulb to the positive side of coil and ground other end to ground. This way, you have a visual "voltmeter" to be sure of power is reaching the coil when it "dies".

The light bulb can be any one of those sidemarker lamps (164, 194) if you

have a socket. Otherwise, "mini'jumper wires (with alligator clips) will easily

hold one of these bulbs since they have "pins" rather than a twist-in style.

Simply, if the light stays on when engine dies, then take the ground wire from bulb and attach it to the points side and try again. The light will flicker quite a bit, but

if it keeps flickering, you know your points are functioning, tho maybe not set.

I have replaced one on my old 1054, to find out my coil was not the correct version, (automotive style are actually 9-10v), not straight 12v. The automotive coil will run much hotter and soon burn-out.

Good luck

Interesting about reading a positive and negative side on the coil...the one I have actually on my K-582 twin cylinder Kohler,wich is the original Kohler coil for this engine,was not showing any markings as for what is positive and negative...so I just plug it in has it came...maybe the original markings erased with time?

Juice to the coil is one but because of my coil being cracked through at different places I tend to think its the bad one..I've patched it up but a patched coil doesn't inspire me!Also what makes me thinking its coil affair ,after it had died,after a few minutes cooling,sometimes it would restart with only one cylinder working..like the coil sending juice only one side.

But replacing a 36 years old coil and ignition wires surely shouldn't hurt!

thanks.

[dgoyette 12]

No mine wasn't marked either, and neither was the replacement one I got. Interesting the Kohler manunal says if polarity is indicated on the coil than it must be hooked up that way. But then notes that if no polarity is noted it can be hooked up either way.

I too went with how it was originally hooked up. Neg on left pos on right (view from seat). If you have the polarity reversed the manual says it would require 8,000 volts to fire.

[tvr383 0]

No mine wasn't marked either, and neither was the replacement one I got. Interesting the Kohler manunal says if polarity is indicated on the coil than it must be hooked up that way. But then notes that if no polarity is noted it can be hooked up either way.

I too went with how it was originally hooked up. Neg on left pos on right (view from seat). If you have the polarity reversed the manual says it would require 8,000 volts to fire.

Thanks I will check if mine is wired this way...8,000 volts sounds a lot but I wonder what kind of voltage comes out after the condenser?

[Red Iron 1]

I did not mean to say the coils actually have a (+) or (-) markings next to

the stud terminals. I was refering to the "power" lead feeding the coil itself being

positive and the wire going to the points & condensor being negative.

I would think a cracked housing is from overheating of a coil (too high

voltage from Volt Regulator) or even points staying closed too long.

If the case is cracked around the spark plug post, I'd get rid of it pronto.

The 8-10k volts like to find the easiest way to ground, even going thru the

coil mount strap. Carbon tracks are hard to see and clean off.

Try looking at the coil while engine is running in a dark area, any "leaking"

spark will become obvious, especially between the Plug post to point's

stud terminal. Better to go outside after dark, not in a closed garage since

we all know exhaust fumes are nasty!

The condensor should not show any voltage, it's there to keep the points

from arcing by leaking the leftover energy to ground, it's an "electrical"

sponge, like water, it will eventually "drip off". Condensors do go bad, easy

to check with an OHMs meter. How??? Set meter to read "High Ohms", clip

the black lead of meter to case (or mounting strap of condensor), red lead of

meter to the wire of condensor, good reading starts "high" and drops

steadily (as condensor absorbs meter's voltage), but not all the way to "Zero".

If it goes to "Zero" right away it's no good either. If meter doesn't show anything,

it's no good either too. Hoefully this helps you and everyone else!

[tvr383 0]

I did not mean to say the coils actually have a (+) or (-) markings next to

the stud terminals. I was refering to the "power" lead feeding the coil itself being

positive and the wire going to the points & condensor being negative.

I would think a cracked housing is from overheating of a coil (too high

voltage from Volt Regulator) or even points staying closed too long.

If the case is cracked around the spark plug post, I'd get rid of it pronto.

The 8-10k volts like to find the easiest way to ground, even going thru the

coil mount strap. Carbon tracks are hard to see and clean off.

Try looking at the coil while engine is running in a dark area, any "leaking"

spark will become obvious, especially between the Plug post to point's

stud terminal. Better to go outside after dark, not in a closed garage since

we all know exhaust fumes are nasty!

The condensor should not show any voltage, it's there to keep the points

from arcing by leaking the leftover energy to ground, it's an "electrical"

sponge, like water, it will eventually "drip off". Condensors do go bad, easy

to check with an OHMs meter. How??? Set meter to read "High Ohms", clip

the black lead of meter to case (or mounting strap of condensor), red lead of

meter to the wire of condensor, good reading starts "high" and drops

steadily (as condensor absorbs meter's voltage), but not all the way to "Zero".

If it goes to "Zero" right away it's no good either. If meter doesn't show anything,

it's no good either too. Hoefully this helps you and everyone else!

Red Iron thank you.

Yourexplanations are simple to understand and will be usefull.I am not very knowledgeable when electrics comes in...I prefer wrenchings ! But too many times I need to check electrics so it is time for me to get a good meter..wich I will do!

I ham waiting from Kirk engines one of these Ignition point saver Kit wich is a new 2 cyl. coil plus a small electronic box that,if I understood well, takes off the load from the points.Altough not a breakerless ignition system,this should make a better ignition system at the end..so the traditional condenser is to be replaced.I'll be left with the points though.

thank you for the help.

Ron.

[WheelHorse_of_course 99]

Here's a trick to be sure I have juice going to coil. I wire a small light

bulb to the positive side of coil and ground other end to ground. This way, you have a visual "voltmeter" to be sure of power is reaching the coil when it "dies".

The light bulb can be any one of those sidemarker lamps (164, 194) if you

have a socket. Otherwise, "mini'jumper wires (with alligator clips) will easily

hold one of these bulbs since they have "pins" rather than a twist-in style.

Simply, if the light stays on when engine dies, then take the ground wire from bulb and attach it to the points side and try again. The light will flicker quite a bit, but

if it keeps flickering, you know your points are functioning, tho maybe not set.

I have replaced one on my old 1054, to find out my coil was not the correct version, (automotive style are actually 9-10v), not straight 12v. The automotive coil will run much hotter and soon burn-out.

Good luck

Simultaneously you could put an in-line tester with the coil-sparkplug lead.

Another symptom of the ~9 volt auto coil is that your points will burn rapidly.

[tvr383 0]

No mine wasn't marked either, and neither was the replacement one I got. Interesting the Kohler manunal says if polarity is indicated on the coil than it must be hooked up that way. But then notes that if no polarity is noted it can be hooked up either way.

I too went with how it was originally hooked up. Neg on left pos on right (view from seat). If you have the polarity reversed the manual says it would require 8,000 volts to fire.

Just received an e-mail from Kirk engines from who I ordered a replacement coil for the twin Kohler confirming that his coil has well identified positive and negative sides.I'll let you know if it goes as you said neg. on left side from seated driver.

Ron.