ebinmaine 63,186 #1 Posted December 13, 2023 We knew when we bought it that part of the process of putting the C121 for my parents back together is going to be repairing or replacing the cross piece that holds the front axle. BBT AKA Trina and I have been talking about whether we should REPAIR the existing 121 frame or SWAP it for something else. We have one on hand from a 1986 417 A. Both are hydros. Both should have the same setup for holding the side steps in place. I don't know what transmission is in the C121. The 417 is an Eaton 1100. Any thoughts on why that WON'T work? @Qball @PWL216 @OldWorkHorse 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ed Kennell 35,814 #2 Posted December 13, 2023 27 minutes ago, ebinmaine said: I don't know what transmission is in the C121 The C should have the 90-1172 Sundstrand. The 417A should have the Eaton 1100. 1 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lee1977 6,219 #3 Posted December 13, 2023 (edited) The frame on both is superseded to the same number. If it's just a frame swap should bolt right up. If using more you will have to campare the parts. The top section of the hood stand will have to change. Bottom section looks to be the same, you will have to check. Edited December 13, 2023 by Lee1977 3 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ri702bill 7,341 #4 Posted December 13, 2023 (edited) 1 hour ago, ebinmaine said: We knew when we bought it that part of the process of putting the C121 for my parents back together is going to be repairing or replacing the cross piece that holds the front axle. Got-um pictures of the area of concern??? A suitable repair may be rather straightforward... or not. Bill Edited December 13, 2023 by ri702bill Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Pullstart 59,736 #5 Posted December 13, 2023 30 minutes ago, ri702bill said: Got-um pictures of the area of concern??? A suitable repair may be rather straightforward... or not. Bill Simple. If it don’t fit, grind it. If it is too loose, weld it! 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ebinmaine 63,186 #6 Posted December 13, 2023 34 minutes ago, ri702bill said: Got-um pictures of the area of concern??? A suitable repair may be rather straightforward... or not. Bill 3 minutes ago, Pullstart said: Simple. If it don’t fit, grind it. If it is too loose, weld it! I can get pictures later today. The section of frame that holds the fore and aft axle pin in place is wrinkled. It's certainly repairable but... We have this other frame here that does NOT need repair. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PWL216 411 #7 Posted December 13, 2023 If you already have a frame, I would do the swap. And while doing the swap remove the engine cradle (even tho it has new solid engine mounts) and remount the engine with spacers. 1 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ri702bill 7,341 #8 Posted December 13, 2023 (edited) 2 hours ago, Pullstart said: Simple. If it don’t fit, grind it. If it is too loose, weld it! Sounds familiar. Back in the late 70's and early 80's, my FIL and I used to flip used cars at his garage - he did the mechanical work needed, I did the body work. My favorite tee shirt said "Cut it to length, beat it to fit, paint it to match" There was't hardly a 3 day Holiday weekend from May to September where I did not transform his repair business into a mini Earl Schribe paint shop... Miss those good times... and him more so. Bill Edited December 13, 2023 by ri702bill 2 1 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ebinmaine 63,186 #9 Posted December 13, 2023 4 minutes ago, PWL216 said: If you already have a frame, I would do the swap. And while doing the swap remove the engine cradle (even tho it has new solid engine mounts) and remount the engine with spacers. Forgive me if this sounds like a silly question but I'm not familiar with these cradled engines. Do you mean to replace the solids with the flexible spacers? Or are you talking about something different? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PWL216 411 #10 Posted December 13, 2023 58 minutes ago, ebinmaine said: Forgive me if this sounds like a silly question but I'm not familiar with these cradled engines. Do you mean to replace the solids with the flexible spacers? Or are you talking about something different? Hi Eric. I’m suggesting to remove the cradle entirely and use a solid mount spacer. I’ll try and find a picture… 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lee1977 6,219 #11 Posted December 13, 2023 Wheel Horse 3D has designed some more rigid spacers, I would go that route, just replace the rubber ones with his first design. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ed Kennell 35,814 #12 Posted December 13, 2023 LOW RIDER - Page 2 - Restorations, Modifications, & Customizations - RedSquare Wheel Horse Forum Page 2 of this build shows how I changed a C-141 to a solid mount. 2 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ebinmaine 63,186 #13 Posted December 13, 2023 8 minutes ago, Lee1977 said: Wheel Horse 3D has designed some more rigid spacers, I would go that route, just replace the rubber ones with his first design. It already has a set of Kerber's solid mounts. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lee1977 6,219 #14 Posted December 13, 2023 Just now, ebinmaine said: It already has a set of Kerber's solid mounts. Your in good shape then. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
oliver2-44 8,852 #15 Posted December 13, 2023 (edited) Swap the frame. Keep the cradle since you already have solid kebler mounts. Otherwise your playing with spacers to get the engine to the correct height. If the height is off, the belt guard wont line up. Even though it came with the Sundstrand transmission, I would consider swapping to the Eaton 1100 if you have a known good one. The Eaton should bolt up to to the frame. I don't know how much is involved in changes to the hydro linkage between the two. I'm interested to learn that my self but, I have no problem with you going first) Edited December 13, 2023 by oliver2-44 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ri702bill 7,341 #16 Posted December 13, 2023 1 hour ago, oliver2-44 said: I have no problem with you going first) Reminds me of the old joke about "Civil" Engineers... You go first.. No, you go ahead.... No, you go, I insist.... Just trying to be civil........ 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ed Kennell 35,814 #17 Posted December 13, 2023 1 hour ago, oliver2-44 said: I don't know how much is involved in changes to the hydro linkage between the two Why not put the C engine in the 417....good frame, better hydro, and correct linkage. 1 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ebinmaine 63,186 #18 Posted December 13, 2023 1 minute ago, Ed Kennell said: Why not put the C engine in the 417....good frame, better hydro, and correct linkage. 417 is an incomplete Parts tractor and the transmission is not mine 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ebinmaine 63,186 #19 Posted December 13, 2023 37 minutes ago, Ed Kennell said: Why not put the C engine in the 417....good frame, better hydro, and correct linkage. And for clarity... The C121 is in FAR BETTER condition than anything on the 417A. This particular 417 was rode hard n put away wet. And dusty. Filthy. Also worn out. It ran and drove. But the linkage was .... Looooooose. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
squonk 38,946 #20 Posted December 13, 2023 5 hours ago, ri702bill said: Sounds familiar. Back in the late 70's and early 80's, my FIL and I used to flip used cars at his garage - he did the mechanical work needed, I did the body work. My favorite tee shirt said "Cut it to length, beat it to fit, paint it to match" There was't hardly a 3 day Holiday weekend from May to September where I did not transform his repair business into a mini Earl Schribe paint shop... Miss those good times... and him more so. Bill "Measure with a ruler, mark it with chalk and cut it with a torch! 1 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
