GAJoe 813 #26 Posted November 23, 2022 1 hour ago, ebinmaine said: I meant to post this earlier. I have an 8-speed under the bench that I need to get into and go through in a similar manner to yours. To break open the case, I use a wood chisel that's sharpened right up nicely and tap the gasket all the way around the outside. Usually a couple times around and it'll start separating and lifting the case. Do NOT lift one side very much further than the other because the shafts ride in both halves of the case. Knowing I need to get this done anyways it's no trouble at all to make a video showing you exactly what I mean.. Lemme know if it would help. Yes that would be very helpful having never broken a transmission case apart before. It'll help the BP stay normal also. Also, beings that your into one and might be able to compare, I just checked the movement on that input shaft regarding the movement in and out (sorry that I don't know the proper term) that allowed the pully to wear against the case and with a little 6" machinist pocket ruler I'm getting 3/64th's travel. Is that acceptable? 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ebinmaine 63,140 #27 Posted November 23, 2022 5 minutes ago, GAJoe said: Yes that would be very helpful having never broken a transmission case apart before. It'll help the BP stay normal also. Also, beings that your into one and might be able to compare, I just checked the movement on that input shaft regarding the movement in and out (sorry that I don't know the proper term) that allowed the pully to wear against the case and with a little 6" machinist pocket ruler I'm getting 3/64th's travel. Is that acceptable? So that's less than .050. Seems reasonable to me although I don't have an actual spec. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stevasaurus 22,230 #28 Posted November 23, 2022 I suspect your issue with the input shaft is a loose pulley the got sucked in and ground down. It is not your input shaft moving in and out that is the issue. If it does move, it is only minimal and is designed to do that. I think your pulley was not tight and moved in to grind the edge of it. You need to make sure the pulley is secured with the Allen Set Screw...maybe even file a flat spot for the screw to set in. I know some have shimmed the input shaft to decrease the in and out, but that is not your issue. They do that to make 3rd gear tighter. Your issue is a pulley not setting on the shaft where it should be. I think I saw a lip on the pulley in one of your pictures. If that is so, grind it smooth and when you put it back together check the pulley alignment and tighten it up and then keep an eye on it. It is not internal. 3 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ebinmaine 63,140 #29 Posted November 23, 2022 8 minutes ago, stevasaurus said: even file a flat spot for the screw I'd agree with that and also advise replacing that set screw as well as the ones in the hubs. Steve if I make that video tonight is there anything particular you feel I should focus on? 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stevasaurus 22,230 #30 Posted November 23, 2022 (edited) Eric, the one thing I did not do is show how to change out a seal from the outside. I also did not show how to drop a trans out of a horse, or how to open it. Those things seem to be what gets to be the issues for the members getting started. Replacing a seal would be excellent video. My videos are all about re-building the transmission. Edited November 23, 2022 by stevasaurus 2 1 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ebinmaine 63,140 #31 Posted November 23, 2022 1 minute ago, stevasaurus said: Eric, the one thing I did not do is show how to change out a seal from the outside. I also did not show how to drop a trans out of a horse, or how to open it. Those things seem to be what gets to be the issues for the members getting started. Replacing a seal would be excellent video. Okay I'll make a separate video for that. Maybe set aside an awl and a small screwdriver. I don't have a seal puller but I guess folks would get the point. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stevasaurus 22,230 #32 Posted November 23, 2022 (edited) If you have an ice pick...heat and bend a 90 in the end to reach in and pull out. I never did like taking a drill to the seal and using a sheet metal screw to grab the seal. It is only 1/8" to play with...you could damage the bearing if you have not ever seen or done a seal exchange before. They pull out with an ice pick bent at the end. Show a new seal and how thick it is so a new guy can see how much to dig in. What do you think??? Edited November 23, 2022 by stevasaurus 3 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ebinmaine 63,140 #33 Posted November 23, 2022 1 minute ago, stevasaurus said: ice pick bent at the end I only have a dental pick but I'll reference it too. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stevasaurus 22,230 #34 Posted November 23, 2022 You don't have an ice pick??? You could heat and bend a 4 penny nail and do it. Improvise, you do not have to buy a tool from TSC. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stevasaurus 22,230 #35 Posted November 23, 2022 Drilling makes shavings...who knows where they go?? You do not need a drill to get out a 1/8" seal. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ebinmaine 63,140 #36 Posted November 23, 2022 4 minutes ago, stevasaurus said: You don't have an ice pick??? You could heat and bend a 4 penny nail and do it. Improvise, you do not have to buy a tool from TSC. Yeah but.. Buddy. ... It's a new tool.... No no. I'm all set. I use a particular ¼ wide flat screwdriver 🪛🪛🪛 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stevasaurus 22,230 #37 Posted November 23, 2022 (edited) You could bend the end of that and use it as leverage?? A little tweaker screwdriver would work. Edited November 23, 2022 by stevasaurus 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ebinmaine 63,140 #38 Posted November 23, 2022 1 minute ago, stevasaurus said: You could bend the end of that and use it as leverage?? A little tweaker screwdriver would work. No need to bend it. I use it as a piercing mechanism then also to pry. I have used smaller screwdrivers as well. They work ok on the ⅝ and ¾ shaft seals. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stevasaurus 22,230 #39 Posted November 23, 2022 There ya go Eric. Show that in your video...excellent. Just from experience...don't edit mistakes...it is good to see the pitfalls. It is a learning experience. 1 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ebinmaine 63,140 #40 Posted November 23, 2022 2 hours ago, ebinmaine said: Okay I'll make a separate video for that. Maybe set aside an AWL and a small screwdriver. I don't have a seal puller but I guess folks would GET THE POINT. I realized a little bit ago that I'd layed out a nice pun there. You're welcome. 1 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ebinmaine 63,140 #41 Posted November 23, 2022 Videos are done. I'll upload them this evening. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GAJoe 813 #42 Posted November 24, 2022 (edited) Thanks Eric I'll watch tomorrow. I have scheduled with my good friend Shawn to go to his shop on Saturday morning to open it up. Hopfully I'll have the hubs off. I tried tonight but didn't have success. I gave it liberal soaking with Kroil a couple times yesterday. Today I hit it with more kroil and I fabb'ed up my hub puller and then gave it try. Not movin'. (See the pictures; the T-bars are not clamped tight on the shaft. I ground out third circle on the edges on the shaft side to get that web closer to the shaft. Also the hardened steel bar that the hardened steel jacking bold goes through is inside the horizontal unistrut. It wasn't long enough to reach around the hub.) I got out the heat gun (didn't want to ignite the Kroil.) and warmed it up slowly. I didnt get it terribly hot. I tried pulling one more good time until I saw the unistrut begin to bend as I heated. The hub still hasn't moved. I reheated up both hubs hotter than before and left the set screw holes pointing up. I sprayed more Kroil into the keyways and filled the set screw hole up with Kroil. I did a little tapping to see if the Kroil will penetrate a little better. I'll try again in the morning one more time with the unistrut. before trying a beefier puller. I hope those hot hubs allows some better Kroil penetration. We'll see; and I'll let you know. Edited November 24, 2022 by GAJoe 3 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GAJoe 813 #43 Posted November 24, 2022 (edited) I just checked and the Kroil is not in the set screw hols facing up so the heat either evaporated it or gave it a place to go. How much $ are new hubs and where to get them? Just in case I have to cut them off as in the video. Edited November 24, 2022 by GAJoe 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GAJoe 813 #44 Posted November 24, 2022 You guys have a great Thanksgiving! Thanks again for all the help. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ebinmaine 63,140 #45 Posted November 24, 2022 Kroil is EXCELLENT. Keep using that. The unistrut... Great idea but very likely not strong enough. The puller you have set up from the back of the hub should work just fine. See about replacing the unistrut with 2 more pieces of the much thicker metal. Heat is your friend. You won't over heat anything in there with a propane torch and should actually be using something hotter if possible. You can heat the hub right to red then wait maybe 5 minutes? Spray the kroil in while still quite toasty. As the oil is cooling the pieces it's also penetrating further in to more expanded areas. Heat. Oil. Repeat. Repeat. Repeat. etc... Again..... Do NOT use a hammer no matter how long it takes. ALL parts are available for these 8 speed transmissions. Hubs in good used form are $40-ish give or take, each. New aftermarket ones are also available for just over 100 bucks. I believe once you strengthen your puller your hubs will be removable and usable. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Horse Newbie 6,859 #47 Posted November 24, 2022 (edited) 1 hour ago, ebinmaine said: Do NOT use a hammer Why can’t you use a hammer ?… break hub, damage transmission internals, or both ? Now I know you would not want to wail on it- I’m talking about a little persuasion … Edited November 24, 2022 by Horse Newbie 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pfrederi 17,147 #48 Posted November 24, 2022 Both !! 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ebinmaine 63,140 #49 Posted November 24, 2022 5 minutes ago, Horse Newbie said: Why can’t you use a hammer ?… break hub, damage transmission internals, or both ? Now I know you would not want to wail on it- I’m talking about a little persuasion … 3 minutes ago, pfrederi said: Both !! It's definitely both. Yes. The most susceptible part is the axle lock ring inside the differential. "A little persuasion" is a good term but unfortunately is grossly incorrectly interpreted by some (including myself) so it's best to say NO hammer. 1 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Horse Newbie 6,859 #50 Posted November 24, 2022 But Eric, you just used a hammer… on your video… well I made a rookie mistake when I was removing my hubs on the 1984 Work Horse transmission last spring then… what would be a symptom if I damaged an axle lock ring (pre-your video) ? 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
