20 replies to this topic

[wheelhoss]

Im having problems with my 418-a. I can't get it to starte with the key switch but to kill it I can use the key switch.

[wheelhoss]

Any help its driving me crazy please

[Save Old Iron]

Hoss,

a bit more information will be needed to assist you.

Does the engine crank normally but not start ?

Does it crank over slowly and not start ?

Starter relay clicks but no starter action ?

Does the starter relay click at all ?

Your issue should fall in one of the above categories .....

[wheelhoss]

I get nothing when I turn the key. Nothing happens. I can start the engine by crossing the selnode

[rmaynard]

Do you have a multi-meter that you can check the voltage at the solenoid when you turn the key to 'start'?

[wheelhoss]

Yes I do

[Save Old Iron]

No need for a multimeter yet. In this case, measuring 12 volts at the starter relay trigger terminal can actually fool you with inaccurate information.

With the tractor OUT OF GEAR (Neutral on hydro's), BRAKES ON (use 'em if you got 'em) and IGNITION SWITCH OFF,

TEMPORARILY jumper a test lead as outlined in the diagram below.







If the starter relay is functional and well grounded, the engine will crank but not start.

If the starter relay is defective or improperly grounded, the engine will not crank. If you have a 4 terminal starter switch, check the ground wire is properly connected and intact.


2nd step is to try the same procedure outlined above but with the ignition switch ON - TRACTOR OUT OF GEAR (Neutral on hydro) AND BRAKES ON.

If the engine CRANKS, STARTS AND RUNS, with the starter relay already confirmed to be functional, both the electrical and mechanical functions of the starter safety switches (PTO switch / Neutral safety switch / possible "safety relay") will need to be looked at next.


All this can be done with a single jumper wire !

[rmaynard]

wheelhoss, on 22 February 2012 - 12:53 AM, said:

Yes I do

Good. With the meter hooked up to the small wire on the solenoid, check to see if there is 12 volts when you turn the key to START. If you have 12 volts, then I would suspect that the solenoid is bad. If you don't have 12 volts, then trace the wire back to the switch. Along it's path you should have a PTO safety switch, and a Neutral safety switch, both of which have to be closed to complete the circuit.

If you need a wiring diagram, let me know and I will post one in the files section.

[wheelhoss]

Ok thanks. I will try it later tonight.

[Actonhorse]

This is good, I'm having the exact problem with a C-100 and will try this later today.

[shootinok]

perfect timing for this string!

[Actonhorse]

Okay, not to hijack the thread but I did try the jumper wire, nothing either way and did check for 12 volts and nothing there either. I have traced the wires and jumped the two safeties to check and still nothing... I am going to try switching out the starter relay this afternoon and see if that will help.

[rmaynard]

Check to be sure that you have a good ground where the negative cable connects from the battery to the frame, also where the solenoid attaches to the engine.

[Actonhorse]

This process has caused me some head scratching. I changed out the starter relay with a different one I had lying around and now with the key on or off if I jump the battery side of the relay to the trigger terminal the engine would turn but not start. I checked the voltage at the + side of the coil and there was nothing... I have run a jumper wire to bypass the PTO and neutral safety switches to eliminate them as a cause. Now, here is the interesting part. When I run a jumper wire from the + of the battery to the + terminal of the coil the key switch will turn over the engine and it starts (and runs pretty good for not running for years!). If I disconnect the wire from the coil, the key switch won't do anythig... If anyone has any ideas, I'm open to suggestions!

[Martin]

Actonhorse, on 19 March 2012 - 06:59 PM, said:

This process has caused me some head scratching. I changed out the starter relay with a different one I had lying around and now with the key on or off if I jump the battery side of the relay to the trigger terminal the engine would turn but not start. I checked the voltage at the + side of the coil and there was nothing... I have run a jumper wire to bypass the PTO and neutral safety switches to eliminate them as a cause. Now, here is the interesting part. When I run a jumper wire from the + of the battery to the + terminal of the coil the key switch will turn over the engine and it starts (and runs pretty good for not running for years!). If I disconnect the wire from the coil, the key switch won't do anythig... If anyone has any ideas, I'm open to suggestions!

jumping bat side of solenoid to trigger, ignition off, engine turns but doesnt start........ok, thats good.......
when you have starter and ignition working ok when you are jumping bat + to coil +, do you have the coil wire from switch IGN to coil + still connected? if so your switch isnt getting voltage through the bat terminal at the switch. the jumped coil wire you are using is getting power to the coil and also power is going back thru the tractor coil+ to IGN wire and the switch is powering the starter pole thru the IGN and not bat.
either you are not getting power to the switch or the switch bat pole is bad.
just one more thing, do you have power to the ignition switch from the solenoid? is this wire connected to the same pole as the bat cable + ?

[Actonhorse]

Yes, I do have the wire from the coil + to the switch connected. I see what you are saying... the jumper wire is back feeding the ignition switch through the coil wire. That makes sense to me.
Yes, I also do have power at the switch from the positive pole of the solenoid. Are you suggesting that the key switch is bad? I do have another one I could try. Does it have to be mounted in the dash plate to work or can I just unplug it and plug the other one in to try it?

[Martin]

no, you should be able to just swap the wires to the other switch without swapping switches in the dash. be careful that you dont short the wires while the other switch is loose though.....

[Martin]

wheelhoss, on 22 February 2012 - 06:44 PM, said:

Ok thanks. I will try it later tonight.

wheelhoss,
i hope this is helping you out as well,
sorry for hijacking your thread...........

[Actonhorse]

I agree, I hope this is helping you as well wheelhoss. I know i always learn alot from other's problems!

Martin, you asked me if I had power going to the key switch from the solenoid. THat triggered it for me...l had been looking at it backwards and thinking that the keyswitch as "sending" power to the solenoid, not the other way around! After your question, I went out to the garage, and realized that power has to run through the anmeter to the key switch and then it hit me that the anmeter was probably bad and sure enough, I jumped the terminals on the anmeter, took off all of the other jumpers, turned the key and it started right up! Thanks alot all for the help, this is one amazing forum!
Now that it is running, I guess I have to add it to my signature! Oh yeah and the B-60 I picked up last week... I think I need an intervention!

[Martin]

thats great that you worked it out.
i only have older horses and never even thought that you might have an ammeter in there as well.........

[Actonhorse]

Again, thanks for the help, I have been watching your 1057 build, you are doing an amazing job. I have a 1067 and it is still my favourite tractor!