PTO misalignment problems

[porlife00 0]

OK guys long time looker first time poster here looking for some sage advise for my wheel horse project. First off this is a great site and all the information posted on the forum has been very helpful to me.

What im working on is a 1974 wheel horse b-80 that I picked up about a year ago and slowly been piecing back together. When I first found it on craigslist and went to check it out I fell in love with it. Now thats a garden tractor! The issue is it had been abused. The original kohler was now replaced with a 5.5hp b&s, the belt guard was cut in half and the dude was using a stick shoved into the belt to switch gears, and no gas tank or engine pulley. it was pretty much frame and tansaxle.

I replaced the 5.5hp with a b&s vanguard v twin 16hp that I found a good deal on, fabricated a engine mounting plate out of 1/2" x 1" c channel and 3/8" plate, replaced the belt guard, found the one inch drive pulley, gas tank and seat.

Now the issue I am having is getting this pto that I picked up off of ebay to mount up correctly. The pto came off of a wheel horse work horse with a 16hp b&s opposed twin with a 1 inch shaft. The problem is I cant get the yoke to seat far enough in on the top for the bracket that the trunnion attaches to to slide on. All the brackets are b-80 brackets that I have been picking up over time and the engagement linkage is too.

My question is what kind of offset do the yokes have from top to bottom? The one I have looks like its close to an inch difference from where the brackets hold it into place. Also has anyone ran into this problem before and what kind of solution did they come up with? I think if I fabricate a new lower yoke bracket that it might solve my problem but I will have to push the hole out about an inch and not sure if that willl screw with how the bell and clutch plate align.

Thanks for the help in advance

[Don1977 604]

Here is a parts look up from Toro. Add B-80 on the forth line ,hit Submit in the right upper corner, All the B-80 will come up. Select the year and drawing of that tractor will come up. Then select the part of the tractor you want to see. The PTO drawing on the 1974 is not clear, use 1975 year

as the only change is the addition of a brake pad and a two bolt upper brqcket.

https://lookup3.toro...es&xCaller=Toro

The bottom bracket is 1 7/8" from the frame to the center of the hole. Look at the drawing the top is two piece and is adjustible that what pulls it in to contact.

If you have the engine placed right thr top bracket will need two thick washers behind the top bracket.

Here are a couple of pictures It's a C-120 with an 18 Briggs & Stratton V-Twin I had a 16 V-Twin on it before and the 18 was a dierct bolt on.

These are all original Wheel Horse parts. If you need some parts that are missing. PM Kelly I am sure he has them or there may be some else. Don't know of any one close to you.

[porlife00 0]

Ok Don thanks for the reply. Here are some pictures of what im working with. I put two 1/16" washers behind the upper bracket but it still needs to come out almost an inch. I dont know if I mounted the motor correctly I put it on before I acquired the pto assembly. I based my placement off of the belt guard and the clearence I had with the motor. I only have about 3/16" of clearence on the side with the fan shroud before it comes into contact with the hood.

Another question is how many different size pto housings did wheel horse make as well as the hoops or yokes? I noticed that all the hoops are offset from where the top bracket and lower bracket connect to it and just want to know how much of a difference from top to bottom. The one I have looks like its an inch if not more. Any more help would be grealy appreciated!

[TT-(Moderator) 1,127]

:WRS:

I can't tell you exactly which bail you need, but I can tell you there were quite a few different versions.

A quick search at eBay turned up at least a half dozen - and they aren't all the same.

I'm pretty sure I ended up flipping the C-85 bail upside-down when I installed a Vanguard twin on my tractor. I did have my engine mounted on a GT-1142 WorkHorse riser plate though, and they have the lower hole for the bail built right into them.

If all else fails, you could modify your existing part, or fabricate a new one.

[Don1977 604]

From looking at your pictures, your engine is mounted up closer to the frame. My suggestion is to make a new bottom bracket as it's too close to the engine and holding the top out. Remove the bottom bracket and with the PTO out of ingagement measure where the bottom of the loop should be and make a new bracket . I think this will get you fixed up.

If you have any more questions PM me.

[TT-(Moderator) 1,127]

Remove the bottom bracket and with the PTO out of ingagement measure where the bottom of the loop should be and make a new bracket .

Good idea!

You'd think if it was that far off, the main drive belt would be way out of line though. :scratchead:

[Don1977 604]

I cheated on mine. I have a 5/16" spacer behind my drive pulley to keep the clutch from pushing it out of alinement. His drive pulley is all the way back I would guess he had that in line when he mounted the engine.

[WH854 44]

Ok Don thanks for the reply. Here are some pictures of what im working with. I put two 1/16" washers behind the upper bracket but it still needs to come out almost an inch. I dont know if I mounted the motor correctly I put it on before I acquired the pto assembly. I based my placement off of the belt guard and the clearence I had with the motor. I only have about 3/16" of clearence on the side with the fan shroud before it comes into contact with the hood.

Another question is how many different size pto housings did wheel horse make as well as the hoops or yokes? I noticed that all the hoops are offset from where the top bracket and lower bracket connect to it and just want to know how much of a difference from top to bottom. The one I have looks like its an inch if not more. Any more help would be grealy appreciated!

Not trying to Hi-jack this thread,but that top bracket on the hoop is on wrong i think,should be flipped over right or wrong !

Chas

[Don1977 604]

Ok Don thanks for the reply. Here are some pictures of what im working with. I put two 1/16" washers behind the upper bracket but it still needs to come out almost an inch. I dont know if I mounted the motor correctly I put it on before I acquired the pto assembly. I based my placement off of the belt guard and the clearence I had with the motor. I only have about 3/16" of clearence on the side with the fan shroud before it comes into contact with the hood.

Another question is how many different size pto housings did wheel horse make as well as the hoops or yokes? I noticed that all the hoops are offset from where the top bracket and lower bracket connect to it and just want to know how much of a difference from top to bottom. The one I have looks like its an inch if not more. Any more help would be grealy appreciated!

Not trying to Hi-jack this thread,but that top bracket on the hoop is on wrong i think,should be flipped over right or wrong !

Chas

It's on right that the only way it will work.

[WH854 44]

Well on my C's they are on different look at his pictures.

Chas

[WH854 44]

Well on my C's they are on different look at his pictures.

Chas

:angry-banghead: Chas you are blind.

Chas

[Don1977 604]

There are a few other things that may need to be changed. First changing spark plugs, I took a hole saw to the gas tank tray, and have to remove the tank to change the back plug. As the tank has gas in it I do not have a picture of that.

I turned the battery around and driller new holes on the other side for the battery tie down.

I rotated up the solenoid switch as far as posible on the starter.

I had to strighten the dip stick tube a little and also put more bend in the bracket with a 1/2" long spacer behind it to clear my gas tank.

I built my exaust, it's just built out of 3/4" electrical tubing and 2" auto exaust pipe.

Here you can see it's a tight fit on a C-Series with the gas tank under the hood.

I also put a little more bend in the gas tank tray as the tank was wearing off the aluminum valve cover on the old 16 V-twin I had on before.

I also added a oil puessure gage and and a oil pressuer light.

[porlife00 0]

ok guys thanks for the help and advise. I was concidering making a whole new lower bracket but when I put the upper bracket into its correct position and had the hoop on it kicks out so far and binds on the bell housing. The hoop is what looks mesed up to me. I dont know if it is over sprung or if they made them like that for the particular model I got the pto from but there is an 1 1/8" difference from the top to the bottom. I will attach a picture so you guys can see what i am talking about. I put a square under the frame and aligned the lower bracket with the upper bracket while it was in the intended position and the upper mounting hole for the hoop isnt that far off from the bottom. maybe a 1/4" or so. I cant find a good picture on the net of one but every hoop I see doesnt look like there is a huge difference from top to bottom. If anyone has a idea or a hoop for sale that is closer please let me know.

[Don1977 604]

That's just the wrong one. I checked mine it lines up on both ends. You need one off a C-Series with a !0,12, or 16 HP K-Series Kohler. You still may need to shim out both top and bottom brackets to get it to work right,

[can whlvr 991]

could you cut off the top of the hoop and add an inch or so and weld the piece back on?

[porlife00 0]

Ok got it finally working well to the best of my knowledge. I ended up cutting and adding to the top of the pto hoop to make the top and bottom align and be able to ingage. The hoop was made out of 9/16" material so finding a donor piece of bar stock was fun. I eventially found a 9/16" lag bolt to use and it worke out perfect.

Question is how much presssure or how hard does the pto bell need to compress to the clutch plate for it to work properly? I have to do some modifacations to my exhaust sense I made it before I got the pto assembly and naturally it doesnt fit.

Also when the pto disengages while running does the momentum push the bell housing far enough away? or when I disengage it while not running should there be a certain gap between the plate and housing? And what distance should I put the bell housing brake?

Lots of questions first horse and learning as im going.

Thanks for the help

[can whlvr 991]

thats great to hear you fabbed her up,thats one of the graet things about these machines,fairly straight forward to improvise,im not sure on the exact spacing for the brake,i just put it till it just barely touches when disengaged,they dont stop the pto for ever as the brake wears ,maybe if you adjust the spacing alot,

[WH854 44]

Maybe this link will help

http://www.wheelhors...to-adjustments/

Chas

[diamondred 63]

Hopefully this thread is still open for discussion. I have a question: will the Vanguard engine be ok with the crankshaft end pressure from the PTO?  The Vanguard engine does not have a bearing on the flywheel side to support the pressure like a Kohler.