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64s

Voltage Regulator

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64s

Hi, Is there any use to hang onto "bad" voltage regulators? Can they be repaired - economically, or do they become modern art or landfill material?

:omg:

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iicap

Good question, never heard of repairng a voltage reg. If it's a ribbed one made of aluminum or pot metal they are epoxy sealed in the back and your not going into repair it. If it's a 3 wire reg on top of a starter/ gen combo there are adjustments that can be made and i wouldn't throw one of those away unless i new it was burned out.

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64s

Thanks, and sorry I wasn't clear. I'm talking about the three pole regulators that sit on top of the starter/generators. It looks fine (nothing looks burnt or broken) but according to what I've found on online - its no good. The s/g starts fine but the generator light stays lit thru-out all throttle ranges. I was told to ground the F terminal and see if there is a rpm drop to test it. Is that correct, and is there another way to test it? Thanks.

:omg:

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iicap

64s, Your making me think now :omg: If the generator is not putting out, the regulator cannot do it's job. Others may comment, but here goes. You need a prob type test light. Engine and key off, aligator clip of tester to a good ground, neg batt term is best. Touch probe to the arm (A) term of gen, there should be no light, then to field term (F) of gen, should be no light. Start the engine, let run a minute then rev up to at least 1/2 throttle. Put the probe on the (A) term of generator and the light should light up fairly bright and might flicker a bit. if this is so then the generator is putting out and we need to look at the regulator as a problem.

If it doesn't light up then the generator isn't putting out. when you were told to ground the field (F) the generator would have put out its maximum, the engine would labor some and if your amp gauge was working properly, it would go way over to the charge side. So lets have you test what I've said and see how you make out and we'll go from there into fixing gen or testing reg.

Don't know your capabilites or if you have a test light/probe, or if your familiar with a digital volt/ohm tester Both are items cool to have when working on our horse's or anything automotive. Looking forward to your return comments

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64s

Richard, I appreciate you walking me thru this. With key off and probe grounded to neg battery post, touched probe to A arm and then F arm -- A side lit up tester, F did not. With engine running -- A side still bright and now F lit dimly.

I will pull up a schematic to make sure its wried correctly -- this machine is fairly new to me but this is the first time I ever tried to get it running. Also, there are three poles but only two units (coils). One pole is wired directly to the lighter - I'm assuming constant power. Thanks again for any input, George

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iicap

Ok 64s, here we go, I'm happy to try and walk you thru this, it's fun for me. A & F terms should not have lit with key off. You do have wiring that is hooked up wrong or the cutout relay of the voltage reg is stuck closed ( it's one of the coils in the reg). If you look at the 3 terms on the regulator they are the F or field term, the A or arm(ature) term, and the B or bat(tery) term. If the reg is mounted right on top of the starter/gen, the wires will be short and not in a harness. The F on the gen goes to the F on the reg, the A on gen goes to A on reg. the F wire is usually a lighter gauge wire then the A, also the wire terms at the gen may have different size eyes. This next line applies if the regulator if is mounted remotely away from the gen on the tractor somewhere There may be a third wire which could/should be a ground wire ( if there) this wire will just go to a screw on the gen housing near the F & A studs and the other end of wire will attach to one of the reg mounting bolts. If you have those hooked up correctly there is one more wire on the reg, being the Bat wire. This wire is hot or will light up a test light all the time so long as there is a battery in the tractor. Without seeing a schematic of the tractor I would guess the Bat wire will go to one of the terms on the ammeter. Lets see how you find the wiring and that it matches up as I've described. One more thing because it's a starter/gen, I've described the charging circuit, it also has to start the engine and some of the wiring may do double duty and bring current to it to crank the engine. I'm not to versed on finding schematics on the computer, if you can post it

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iicap

Hey Buzz, thanks gonna look at that schematic now

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iicap

Quick update after looking at schematic the A/armature term wire on gen may go to the GEN term of regulator if it's marked GEN instead of Arm

Again check out wiring and correct as needed and we may not have to go deeper. Also at the end of the schematic there is a paragraph about polarizing the gen after all wires are hooked up (correctly), polarize as described, if not sure on doing it let me know, actually take a jumper wire with bare ends and momentarily touch the BAT and GEN terms together on the regulator, in this case momentarily means for a second. There will be a spark/arc but your not hurting anything

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64s

Thanks Guys, I got in a little late and quickly skimmed the Delco article. I also checked the cutout relay and found it closed (all of the other wiring is correct). I pryed it opened and the generator light went out, so I'm assuming its bad. The service manual said you can bend the relay tabs - so I'll give that a shot also. First I'll check to make sure all connections are good and evrything else is OK. I won't be able to do this tonight, or tomorrow night, but I'll keep you posted on Saturday. Thanks again, George

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oldandred

Thanks Guys, I got in a little late and quickly skimmed the Delco article. I also checked the cutout relay and found it closed (all of the other wiring is correct). I pryed it opened and the generator light went out, so I'm assuming its bad. The service manual said you can bend the relay tabs - so I'll give that a shot also. First I'll check to make sure all connections are good and evrything else is OK. I won't be able to do this tonight, or tomorrow night, but I'll keep you posted on Saturday. Thanks again, George

O no here we go again with the tabs by any chance did you ever live in Florida ?

:omg::drool: :drool:

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iicap

Old and red maybe you can elaborate so the rest of us can have a goosd laugh too

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iicap

64s, cut out relays need to be adjusted with a volt meter, they need to close when the gen puts out a certain voltage and open when the voltage drops as the engine comes to idle or shuts off, those specs may be in the service manual that Buzz called attention too.Iif you going to adj make sure the contacts of the cutout relay are not burnt or pitted, you might try cleaning the contacts with a point file before adjusting. Good luck.

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64s

Richard, I don't know the "Florida Joke" either but the relays do have a prevision for adjustment (maybe "bend" was the wrong word). Anyways I did make time to check all contacts, put it all back together, polarize it and fire it up. Again the relay didn't move to generate. I just decided to call it quits and replace it with another one - and now it all works as it should.

This brings me back to my original question - is there any reason to hang on to the regulator or is it just trash. I'm not a tree hugger by any means, but don't want to get rid of something if there is any value - even if its only educational. I did learn alot about the specifics of the s/g system. In the past I only knew generally what it does, but when everything works fine I didn't give it another thought.

Thanks for your help, George

Buzz, Thanks for the relay info. Priceless in my opinion!!

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iicap

Chuck it George, having another and it works fine now,couldn't ask for a better test tool than that reg that works. Thank you for making me knock some of the dust of this od brain. Did you see the dates on the info sheet Buzz put us onto, 1953. Glad it's working, Richard

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hounddoghundzsa

MTF has this in their reference library, Delco-Remy Regulator Service manual/bulletin. Might be helpful.

http://www.mytractorforum.com/images/refer...tor_service.pdf

Buzz, do you also have a link for the starter - generators? I've got one that has a loose internal connection. I was planning on cracking it open this weekend to see if I can resoder the connections.

Thanks!

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