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upstate yank

1973 no name 16 horse wiring issues

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i want to thank everyone that did reply to my question about the wiring and the picture i sent ;thanks so much 

sorry the one word was a type error 'it happens when we don't wear our glasses old age you know 

Edited by upstate yank
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:think:....Huh ???

Not exactly sure what that's suppose to mean - far as I could tell the question was answered. The mess of the wiring in that post meant the thing really needed to be re-wired from scratch, far too many potential issues and the diagram provided would help with that. No reason to route the coil power through a safety switch or otherwise, the normal interrupt circuit is the starting relay trigger wire and safety switches on most small engine equipment. Not sure if that was intended as sarcasm or what - post counts mean nothing as not everyone knows electrical parts/systems.

 

Sarge

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Is this rant about the previous owner and the weather the one you are referring to? I have read it a couple of times and don't see an answerable question. On previous occasions you have asked questions and received answers, ask a direct question and we will continue to provide information. We are a very friendly, helpful group and welcome honest feedback if we go astray, but you seem to be having a bad day, hope it gets better.

 

"well guys here i am again ;i was wondering if the safety pedal switch are the same on either a standard or automatic as i am rewiring this horse as it seems someone spliced an extension cord from the plus side of the coil  than to the key switch ;than to the back where the seat switch is which there is no switch there ;what a mess really ;so during the rewiring i think having the switch working it might help to start this oldie 'it has been darn cold here and freezing rain so i can't get outside to work on it ;boy i wish for spring as the walls keep getting closer ; as you can see in the picture how is this going to start the motor or am i missing something here ;

sad news as yesterday i hit the 68 mark but heck that is just a number in life ;have a great day everyone enjoy your toys as i do"

5a821defba742_Bobswiringdiagram.jpg.f3e1041400b74faa8813d5bb123841ce.jpg

Edited by 953 nut
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5 hours ago, Sarge said:

:think:....Huh ???

Not exactly sure what that's suppose to mean - far as I could tell the question was answered. The mess of the wiring in that post meant the thing really needed to be re-wired from scratch, far too many potential issues and the diagram provided would help with that. No reason to route the coil power through a safety switch or otherwise, the normal interrupt circuit is the starting relay trigger wire and safety switches on most small engine equipment. Not sure if that was intended as sarcasm or what - post counts mean nothing as not everyone knows electrical parts/systems.

 

Sarge

it didn't mean anything and thanks for the diagram ;i just wanted to ask one question about the switch as again the seller used an extension cord and the 2 wires that are tied in one comes for the plus side of the coil and the other goes to the key switch ;as you can see in the picture i thought if i had the pedal switch thinking that maybe one of those wires were for the switch as i have checked the evil bay and one seller told me the one  he has will not  work on the automatic so i did searching and  found out it will work on either so to make sure yes i did post the question here to see if the seller was right or wrong ;really that is all i asked ;but again if some think i am rude sorry as i am not ;

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Edited by nylyon
Language removed, please no personal attacks or colorful language.
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Not a problem, as it was worded it just appeared a bit sarcastic . That's part of the issue with computers/internet stuff - grammar , spelling and such can cause mixed reactions - it's not easy to put your point across and around here we all have had some bad problems from previous owner's and their meddling with these tractors . That's enough to to irritate the Pope, lol. I've probably spent more time fixing all the small wiring issues or having to re-wire a tractor just see if the engine was worth saving or in good condition - then find out it's either in need of a rebuild or just plain scrap from damage. Incorrect wiring on these things can cause some spectacular fires, battery explosions and burning out expensive regulators and other parts - some are NLA too. Many times you need to just ask a different way - or keep it as simple as possible. If no one understands the question they may make that comment or at least ask what in the world you're trying to figure out - that was my first take from that post and I was very short on time that day - so I said nothing. There will always be times you can ask a specific question on a specific model and not get an answer right away or even no answer at all - it is slightly possible you've ran into something we've never seen or just don't know, rare, but it can happen. But, the members here will try to help - sometimes just reply to your own thread to keep it back up at the top and it will get more attention. Some of us disappear for awhile , I myself work construction and in the work season there are times I won't be on here for a month - just working too many hours already and this forum takes up too much time I don't have once in awhile.

 

With what you've shown in the pictures I'd start by re-wiring the thing correctly - if you are missing safety switches and want to keep them the part numbers are in the manual or we can help figure out what is needed and if they are available. Many of those safety switches are no longer available and I'd say at least half of us just leave them out of the wiring. That part is up to you and factors such as who will use the tractor are a big decision - kids especially. None of mine have any switches left but I'm the only one that ever operates these things, as an example. Your question about someone selling a safety switch sounds like it's off a different model - there are some that fit various models but most are quite specific to a particular tractor - need to know your exact model number or our folks here can figure that out by pictures and the parts on it if the tag is gone. Once you have the exact model of tractor we have a whole section of files dedicated to manuals for them, some are not the exact year you may need but people here can easily tell you any differences to watch out for - the knowledge base here is staggering and we're always here to help - a very friendly place and some occasional ribbing too...it's all good.

 

Biggest problem most run into is either a previous owner has been into the wiring, stuff is worn out/broken or due to age has lost frame grounds - sometimes all of those at once. A re-wire and the use of better grounds will go a long way to make them reliable, charge the battery correctly and start the engine as it should. Grounds between the engine/frame are really important - otherwise a starter can actually use something else as a ground path - like a choke cable or pto parts, which is not good and cannot deliver the amps needed. A few simple tools, maybe a soldering iron and some shrink boot, a few colors of wire and time spent studying how it should be wired according to diagrams in the manual makes it fairly simple. How wires are routed - that question can be answered by the forum - someone here will have that same model tractor and are almost always willing to get a photo , just takes some patience since not all of us are retired and such or just don't have a lot of free time. @gwest_ca is the resident guru on manuals - make a post about what model and he comes from nowhere to give a list of what covers everything on the machine, sort of a magical guru is my description..

 

One thing I'd suggest - it's not a lecture or something you have to do,  but just some advice .

 

This place has a limit on photo uploads due to the cost of hosting space and all that stuff - it is quite expensive to run a site like this with so much information and storage capability.  Becoming a simple supporter either on a yearly basis or whatever you decide goes a long way to help that , and it helps you in the process. As a supporter you have unlimited upload of photos - that goes a very long way in getting answers since many people are not mechanically inclined nor ever worked much on machines like these or their systems or Wheel Horse specifically.  Just a few photos goes a long way - folks here can spot things you wouldn't believe and offer help at identifying parts/machines/accessories quickly. You will notice we like pictures of what you're working on as it can identify issues you may not clearly see - these members here are really good at that part. Another thing - adding more members is what we want - it increases the knowledge base and keeps this hobby alive. Many here are getting a bit, uh, old and passing it along to younger generations is a good thing, plus it keeps these machines out of the scrap yard as many models are getting increasingly rare and valuable - same with their parts and we're getting more and more member vendors helping with that. We have folks making parts that haven't been available in many years - that benefit alone is worth being a supporter here as it makes it easier to restore or just put an old machine back into service.

 

 

 

Enough rambling - Welcome aboard and enjoy the forum if it hasn't been said before, we're a big dysfunctional family here..lol.

 

Sarge

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Just tyi - being a '73 no-name model (16 Automatic) means nearly ever part is the same as '74 and later C models - if you didn't know it would be confusing. I have a 16 Auto here myself and love it - most of it was re-wired when I redid the tractor for a brother in law. It's back here now as he got a zero turn, understandable for his property and I'm glad the Horse came home - it's one of the highest sought models by our members here. Other than the hydro direction control handle there is almost no difference between this model and a '74 C-160 and I converted mine away from that handle being between your legs to the older/newer style - I hated it . When I redid this one I deleted the safety switches as every one of them was shot or rotted out from age/wear. It was a choice and that's up to you. Your coil needs power off the ignition terminal on the key switch directly first . The safety switches are wired between the start position on the key switch and the starter solenoid mounted on the engine tin. That's basically all there is to it . You would be well served to inspect the key switch and make sure it's the correct one for the tractor - can't ever assume that over the course of 45yrs it hasn't been changed or is bad. There are simple tests you can do to test one and almost all are labeled on the back of the switch. Folks here can identify them with one good clear picture and go from there. As I said , start with the manual or use Bob's colored diagrams for the C series and the basic system, then go from there and ask any questions you come across.

 

If the safety switch you were asking about was for a non-automatic it's due to the way they are mounted, the contact arm or similar. Some are still available, look in the manual at the parts list and get the part number then search it out on the 'net - may or may not be available new. We also have several used parts vendors here as well that are very helpful and reasonable. Ebay can be a problem as many of these parts are either junk or they have no idea what the part is - so take their listings with a grain of salt.


Sarge

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thanks so much for the advise from everyone; the thing is i was able to get it to run but  only  adding  a wire from the plus side of the coil to the plus side of the battery and after a little bit of gas in the carb the old girl took off but due to linkage not being adjusted correctly  boy did the motor race so i had to be fast and shut it down as i would had a  motor in pieces but heck at least it ran even for a short term 'and then i did figure out the wiring that the previous owner did with that extension cord '  'but due to all of the negative replies from other groups stating this horse is not a no name  and others said it was ; or have a smart mouth from this group' state  the problem then why didn't he explain it   other then to be a smart ass know it all of nothing;so i sold it for double plus then what i gave ;so i will take the lost of a 100 bucks and find another one  yes i will say i am not the best when it comes to electrical even though years have passed when i did this for a hobby but after time and age we seem to forget simple things .my worst mistake was selling the herd  i had and going over the road for close to 40 years as i had a family that depended  on me to have a roof over there heads and meals on the table where the 6 horses i had couldn't do it ;so now after retiring and at the age of 68 i would so much like to get back in to it 'as it is now   really my favorite  is my charger 10 automatic and the b-80 'again if i did sound rude that was not my intent ;and i am truly sorry as i did get quite upset of the one person  from this group  and a few  other groups  who had a smart remark  'again i am deeply sorry' i will continue to read the posts but will never again ask any questions 

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