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Posted (edited)

hi guys and gals

im new to this forum and a new owner to a used 1970 wheelhorse electro 12 model # 1-7255

i paid 20$ for it off some guy knew nothing about it nor did i try and see if it ran. what caught my attention was the hydraulic deck lift and i wanted it!!! so i brought it home cleaned everything up to find out mickey mouse had a nest behind the gas tank and a few wires were chewed. i also noticed a few switches and a flasher relay in there. I think someone hacked it all up. and i dont think this tractor had any of them but i want to get rid of the useless garbage and re wire this whole thing the way its suppose to be. ive searched everywhere and cant find a wiring diagram anywhere!!! also maybe someone can tell me what these controls do? i know the big white switch is head lights and obviously the key is ignition and start and the big knob to the left is the choke but thats all i know. the little metal switch is an on/off switch to what i dont know and the one next to it is a 3 position switch in to i dont know. and the white in the top right has a flasher relay connected to it. If someone can tel me what belongs there and what doesnt i think it will make more sence. Like if there doesnt need to be a fuse in the circuit like the 69 charger diagram ive been seeing then ill re wire it accordingly. But then i see brake lights in a diagram its all a mess! I dont know what belongs and what doesnt

 

im also missing misc. parts like the mule drive which i know, boogey wheels and im missing a cover that goes ontop of where the shifter would go if it was a 3-4 speed. can anyone tell me what the plate is called so i can try and find it on ebay?

 

thanks for your help i will answer any questions oupload any pictures you want to help better your response

 

by the way!!!! this has a foot throttle conversion before anyone says anything about the trottle missing. it does have the electric pto. and i know the fuse holder is broken.

 

 

IMG_5356.JPG.69b1ab1fc4ced7b63011d6cc00751f26.JPGIMG_5357.JPG.b68c32e96687681a727c3f80fdd5e1bb.JPGIMG_5366.JPG.6f9273af2bd6058affdb8a187058b72a.JPGIMG_5358.JPG.446cd0d7771d8a14c0455901560acb5f.JPG

Edited by 1.big.l
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Here is the '69.  Could be the same as a '70.

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Welcome to the forum.

 

The 1970 Electro 12 originally had breakerless magneto ignition and it appears your engine has been replaced with one using battery ignition so we need to do some searching for an appropriate wiring diagram.

 

See if you can find the identification letters on the back of the ignition switch for each terminal. The Kohler spec number on the engine would also help to determine what charging system you have.

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:WRS:       Don't mean to be harsh, but all of that wiring needs to go in the dumpster! Take a look at this 1985 wiring diagram and you will have the basics worked out. If you eliminate the seat and pedal interlock switches and hour meter/volt meter which your unit never had and add a 20 amp fuse off the accessory terminal of the key switch followed by a switch to the PTO it should get you in business.

 

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Posted (edited)

g_west - ill get it after work today. whats breaerless magneto ignition? i know it has points on the front of the engine and i get spark up to the coil but not to the plug. i dont know if that helped any.

 

ed kendel- thanks. ive been debating on goig by that circuit

 

953 nut - your not being harsh , 100% agree with you, its all hacked and mickey mouse was in there!!! i forgot to mention i cant go by that diagram because theres no starter solenoid on my machine

 

Is this the correct layout for my dash by the way if so... looks like i have a few things to move and throw away.

 

imageproxy.php?img=&key=233175c88be08e9bIMG_5368.PNG.9ae989520dba5ebae0d05cf2c3d0ccb1.PNG

Edited by 1.big.l
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I don't own that model, but it looks about like the one you have.

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21 minutes ago, 953 nut said:

:WRS:       Don't mean to be harsh, but all of that wiring needs to go in the dumpster! Take a look at this 1985 wiring diagram and you will have the basics worked out. If you eliminate the seat and pedal interlock switches and hour meter/volt meter which your unit never had and add a 20 amp fuse off the accessory terminal of the key switch followed by a switch to the PTO it should get you in business.

 

I'll be harsh... Its dumpster wiring. Pull it out and start over. Nothing to loose and everything to gain.

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im going to deff. upload more pictures later after work

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Posted (edited)

The breakerless ignition was an early version of an electronic ignition.  When it failed it was frequently replaced by a battery/coil system.  However you also had to change out the ignition switch as the breakerless system used a magneto ignition switch.  Gray was a common color for what Kohler called service (replacement engines).  i wonder if your engine is a replacement not just an ignition change. I have 4 charger/electrors all 4 have different ignition (and thus) wiring systems.  (Magneto, Breakerless, Battery coil, Techy Solid state) but they are great tractors!!!  No matter what system you have the wiring is not that complex to just start over.

Edited by pfrederi

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52 minutes ago, pfrederi said:

The breakerless ignition was an early version of an electronic ignition.  When it failed it was frequently replaced by a battery/coil system.  However you also had to change out the ignition switch as the breakerless system used a magneto ignition switch.  Gray was a common color for what Kohler called service (replacement engines).  i wonder if your engine is a replacement not just an ignition change. I have 4 charger/electrors all 4 have different ignition (and thus) wiring systems.  (Magneto, Breakerless, Battery coil, Techy Solid state) but they are great tractors!!!  No matter what system you have the wiring is not that complex to just start over.

 

Yea but either way i need to know what belongs in there and what doesnt.

3 hours ago, gwest_ca said:

Welcome to the forum.

 

The 1970 Electro 12 originally had breakerless magneto ignition and it appears your engine has been replaced with one using battery ignition so we need to do some searching for an appropriate wiring diagram.

 

See if you can find the identification letters on the back of the ignition switch for each terminal. The Kohler spec number on the engine would also help to determine what charging system you have.

 

You asked what motor i had here it is.

 

IMG_3038.JPG

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It is a service engine 15 amp charging system breaker ignition

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4 minutes ago, pfrederi said:

It is a service engine 15 amp charging system breaker ignition

 

Okkkkkkkkk..... i dont know what that means to me for getting a wiring diagram for this thing hahahaha 

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Posted (edited)

There is no wiring diagram specifically for an Electro 12 with a battery ignition system.  You are going to have to improvise. This diagram from a slightly newer tractor should get you close.  You will not have the safey switch and maybe no ammeter.

 

wire.JPG

Edited by pfrederi

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46 minutes ago, pfrederi said:

There is no wiring diagram specifically for an Electro 12 with a battery ignition system.  You are going to have to improvise. This diagram from a slightly newer tractor should get you close.  You will not have the safey switch and maybe no ammeter.

 

wire.JPG

 

Do i need to add a starter solenoid? I dont have one on there right now

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1 minute ago, 1.big.l said:

 

Do i need to add a starter solenoid? I dont have one on there right now

Unless the key switch is rated at 70 amps you will need a solenoid.

Here is a generic diagram for you to look at. You could add  the electric clutch by adding another fuse and switch to the accessory terminal on the key switch.

593ac4c9c4fbc_batteryignitiontractor-wiring.jpg.a0a74cf504ed5f77fe10a7326156126e.jpg

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9 minutes ago, 953 nut said:

Unless the key switch is rated at 70 amps you will need a solenoid.

Here is a generic diagram for you to look at. You could add  the electric clutch by adding another fuse and switch to the accessory terminal on the key switch.

593ac4c9c4fbc_batteryignitiontractor-wiring.jpg.a0a74cf504ed5f77fe10a7326156126e.jpg

There we go. Thats what i like. Now i got a few diagrams to work with. I can make this work now. Basically im retrofitting a newer style motor with an old school wiring system. I did something like this on an 80' jeep cj7. But went the other way. Went from points to electronic ignition. Thanks you everyone i will reply when it is finished what ive done to resolve this issue. Im pretty good with wiring. I can figure out how this going to get wired now. I will report any issues along the way.

but for the most part sounds like its a full custom wiring job. It makes me beat my self in the head a little bit but thats the fun of electrical

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10 hours ago, gwest_ca said:

Welcome to the forum.

 

The 1970 Electro 12 originally had breakerless magneto ignition and it appears your engine has been replaced with one using battery ignition so we need to do some searching for an appropriate wiring diagram.

 

See if you can find the identification letters on the back of the ignition switch for each terminal. The Kohler spec number on the engine would also help to determine what charging system you have.

 

Heres the back side of my key switch

IMG_3089.JPG

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If you were cranking the starter over without a solenoid for very long that switch would be emitting magic smoke!

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11 minutes ago, 953 nut said:

If you were cranking the starter over without a solenoid for very long that switch would be emitting magic smoke!

Soooo i need a solenoid?..... because uhhhhh i did have that magic smoke hahahaimage.jpg.acc3bfbe167990d109551359da5ce76e.jpg

ive cleaned everything up and starting new now!!

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Appears you have this switch

You can get a 5-wire connector body for this switch that will make your life simpler later. 

https://www.bantasaw.com/catalog/viewproduct.asp?i=&p=3054

Also available with wires attached

https://www.bantasaw.com/catalog/viewproduct.asp?i=205&p=1326

These are supplied by Stens but many others including Napa have them.

 

Kohler made your 1528040174 serial in 1985.

 

Garry

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Posted (edited)

so this is the wiring diagram ive decided to go off of. the only thing im going to do to modify it is, off the key acessory have 2 wires come out of it. then they'll go to 2 inline 15amp fuses. 1 will go to the headlight switch the to my head lights and tail lights, the other will go to my electric pto switch. at least if the lights blow i can still cut grass or plow snow or whatever im doing. so i went out bought 2 inline 15 amp fuses and then a 30 amp fuse for the starter solenoid. i still need to go get a 4 post solenoid. in the event that someone or myself is wrong for having a 70 amp key, at least i know that ill blow a fuse to the starter before i burn my key up if we're wrong. i was going to run the lighter off acessory as well then to another fuse but i dont think i want to put it in. i wouldnt need it unless im charging my phone while driving.

 

again ill post up progress pictures along the way.

 

thank you to 953 nut for supplying the diagram and ideas n explanation this is the most simplistic you can get with wiring this.

 

IMG_5413.JPG.fe535a202207c9a50731274a33746e17.JPG

Edited by 1.big.l
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13 minutes ago, 1.big.l said:

so this is the wiring diagram ive decided to go off of. the only thing im going to do to modify it is, off the key acessory have 2 wires come out of it. then they'll go to 2 inline 15amp fuses. 1 will go to the headlight switch the to my head lights and tail lights, the other will go to my electric pto switch. at least if the lights blow i can still cut grass or plow snow or whatever im doing. so i went out bought 2 inline 15 amp fuses and then a 30 amp fuse for the starter solenoid. i still need to go get a 4 post solenoid. in the event that someone or myself is wrong for having a 70 amp key, at least i know that ill blow a fuse to the starter before i burn my key up if we're wrong. i was going to run the lighter off acessory as well then to another fuse but i dont think i want to put it in. i wouldnt need it unless im charging my phone while driving.

 

again ill post up progress pictures along the way.

 

thank you to 953 nut for supplying the diagram and ideas n explanation this is the most simplistic you can get with wiring this.

 

IMG_5413.JPG.fe535a202207c9a50731274a33746e17.JPG

 

Is there a ballast resistor in the ignition circuit?  12 volts is fine for the start circuit. After started either the coil is one with a built in voltage dropping resistor or an external ballast must be used in order to keep from burning/pitting the points.

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If you use the proper Kohler ignition coil or a 12 volt VW coil they have a built in resistor.

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You do not need a 4 post solenoid. The fourth post a small one usually labeled "I" is not a ground it provides an ignition feed not needed on Wheel horses.  Doesn't hurt to have it you just do not use the I terminal.  Might make sourcing easier if you can go 3 or 4 terminal.  Either way make sure the mounting bracket for the solenoid is securely grounded.

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I just took the last few hours to get this done but i wanted to share what it looks like now that i re-did everything....

 

Before...

IMG_3077.JPG.fef65cfb227b0e7a4939daa282bed0fb.JPG

 

What i pulled out...

 

IMG_3140.JPG.cbf722d2f79a7c7eb50db0b96a92db27.JPG

 

after...!!!!

IMG_3138.JPG.41c1245eebd059832f6423a5fc8c26ed.JPGIMG_3139.JPG.1a290f5e162a849a1b04ad9d3cc6a085.JPG

 

I got it to turn over! I got the lights working and i got power to the pto switch!! The pto bearing is blown out (thats why theres no fuse in it. I was going to use the inline glass fuse but i dont like the considerinng there fragile. I went to a car show yesterday and a guy had these inline fuse holders for $2 a piece and i bought the solenoid from advanced auto for $10+tax.

i mounted the solenoid behind the dash in a place where you wont be able to see it so unless you pull the tank you wont set it anyway. Thanks everyone for the help. I have another problem where i dont get spark to the plug. But i have friends that can help with that part. Im so happy with the outcome of the job. I hope everyone is happy with my work. I may have to modify a few things but at least the stuff work!

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