Toro Hydro Filter

[BrianK 58]

Anyone know who makes Toro's hydro filters? I called toro and they don't know. The question has seemed to have stumped Google as well. Would like some specs too...micron rating, gpm, absence of bypass valve etc. I read somewhere, someone thought the toro 79-5270 (mine) had a bypass valve.

[pfrederi 17,122]

I picked up a Electro 12 awhile back that had an original Red Wheel Horse filter 5990 (Doesn't speak well of the POs maintenance.)  Here are some pictures .

 

I do not know who makes the toro filters and I would imagine over time they have changed suppliers.  they also look to the lowest bidder I would guess. Consider how long they are using one filter 79-5270 to replace two older numbers on on different systems (Sundstrand/Eaton) some with ATF some with motor oil.  Part of that is probably about simplifying their supply chain.

[squonk 38,844]

That filter that Paul cut open is nothing like the Black newer Toro filter I cut open a few years back. It actually looks like it was a decent filter. I was disappointed with the Toro one. Use a Napa 1410

[varosd 1,185]

wasn't there a Baldwin filter for WH thread some years back/  might have been for the Eaton tranny filter

[squonk 38,844]

2 minutes ago, varosd said:

wasn't there a Baldwin filter for WH thread some years back/  might have been for the Eaton tranny filter

Baldwin BT8301 or BT8486

[WVHillbilly520H 10,369]

Baldwin BT8486 on and extra came with the last 520(with bagger) I bought, says automatic transmission filter on the box , but the hydro was/is quiet and responsive, Jeff.

[BrianK 58]

Interesting, fellas.  

 

8 hours ago, pfrederi said:

I picked up a Electro 12 awhile back that had an original Red Wheel Horse filter 5990 (Doesn't speak well of the POs maintenance.)  Here are some pictures .

 

I do not know who makes the toro filters and I would imagine over time they have changed suppliers.  they also look to the lowest bidder I would guess. Consider how long they are using one filter 79-5270 to replace two older numbers on on different systems (Sundstrand/Eaton) some with ATF some with motor oil.  Part of that is probably about simplifying their supply chain.

 

 

I agree. Over the years who knows how many times they've switched because of money, some engineer, penny pinching bean counter or otherwise. I can't imagine having the original filter on that Electro...good lord, I would have melt down.

 

4 hours ago, squonk said:

That filter that Paul cut open is nothing like the Black newer Toro filter I cut open a few years back. It actually looks like it was a decent filter. I was disappointed with the Toro one. Use a Napa 1410

 

See...this is what im afraid of. After my rebuild I put on a Napa/Wix filter. I have nothing but good to say about them, been using them on all my engines for 15 plus years. I don't know Toro, it scares me.  In fact, I called them today and they couldn't tell me who made it for them. The guy couldn't even tell me the specs on the filter. WTH? Gave me a number to an authorized dealer....yea OK, ill call THEM, sure. I have a Toro one on now, but I don't like not knowing. I went through a lot of work on that pump and motor to just throw on a filter made by friggin FRAM or some other disgraceful puke of a company that stuffs their filters with paper towels.  Not sure if you can tell its bothering me or not haha.

 

 

1 hour ago, WVHillbilly520H said:

Baldwin BT8486 on and extra came with the last 520(with bagger) I bought, says automatic transmission filter on the box , but the hydro was/is quiet and responsive, Jeff.

 

 

 

Hmm, even differences in the design of the two filters you posted.  I went to Baldwin's website for a cross-reference and they don't have an equivalent filter for the Toro 79-5270. Looks like they have some quality products FWIW.

[JoeM 7,606]

Filter people are like snake oil salesman. They all promote the best but will not tell you what's the ingredients. When I managed a maintenance program for a large mining company, I was lucky enough to draw the short straw and get assigned to a sourcing team for filters. What an education. As we interviewed and researched "the best filters", It become very clear our choices we limited. The heart of the filter is the quality of the media, as it turned up, there we only about two manufactures of media. That is were all the filter manufactures got their media. Of course, there were specifications for the media, but mostly that was pretty much dictated by micron and number of pleats. (dirt holding capacity). Of the dozen or so managers on the team, housing quality or failures with all manufactures were not evident. It was amazing how many of us were using different manufactures filters, all with good results.

Most of what we learned was the filter manufacture had contributed less to equipment failure then a poor maintenance schedule. As pfredri pointed out, the PO maintenance schedule was the crime. 

On the WH 1100 trans, If I remember correctly, that filter supplies all the oil to the hydro, so flow characteristics are most important.

If you run in a very dusty, dirty conditions, change outs should be come more frequent. If not, I follow the OEM guidelines.

Oil sampling was abut the only way to test filter performance and a key ingredient in the change cycle. Not going to sample WH oil, but if you want to, I guess you can!

When choosing, I pretty much go back to using OEM filters because I know whomever they (OEM) buy their filters from, the filter are manufactured to specification.

The other good choice would be like Mike said, NAPA/Wix, they make an honest effort to duplicate OEM specs. (Might even find out these guys supply TORO?)

 

I went through this same exercise looking filters for my SRT dodge and the results once again were confusing. (I did have a spare hemi engine filter and screwed it on a Eaton 1100, ran good).

As it ended up, my service intervals we so frequent, the filter manufacture became less of an issue.

I found this pic and it pretty much shows the difference of three high quality filters, acceptable for the application.

Choices Choices

 

[Sarge 3,462]

I really like the Wix , at least they are known quality in both company and materials and supply a wide variety of OEM parts to different brands . I do agree with not trusting Toro so much any more due to their business model direction of profit over product , like nearly everyone else ....which makes sourcing parts for our tractors very difficult as they age . Same goes with so much other stuff , old names are gone or bought up to be used to drive profits and screw the quality aspect , disgusting .

Many of my friends don't understand why I spend so much time on the hunt for NOS parts and supplies - but nothing of mine ever fails due to crap modern parts , either .

 

Sarge

[shallowwatersailor 3,213]

I finally gave up on the Toro filter after fighting to get them off when it was time to change. Also after Mike (squonk) endorsing them.The Wix/NAPA/Baldwin are known to be a quality filter  - and have detents on the end so that a filter wrench can grab it. Purolator has the large nut on the end but I believe not as good as a filter.

[JoeM 7,606]

So many times we see products change / cheapen up for the sake of making money. Most of my experience in this area was persons ruling a world they don't live in. I am sure Toro engineering would rather see the company make slightly less money in place of being known for failures. On the other hand, purchasing and accounting, (the folks that don't live in the real world), most are very naïve to where the rubber meets the road.

One memory that stands out was the great oil and lubrication sourcing switch-a-rue. Over the years we migrated to new and better oils working with our supplier at the ground level. I received an email from purchasing saying within 30 days we were switching vendors, due to cost savings, and there should be no problems. The vendor reviewed the items we use and all the new products would be an exact match. Not true. After about six weeks we began to see temperature increases in critical gear case trends. Investigation shown the new gear oils were a semi synthetic and the previous oil was a full synthetic. Not to mention, all the containers used were black. Our old vendor color coded the lids to reduce using the wrong oils. When it washed out, the cost was actually higher for the correct oils and can identification.

Yeah baby now that is saving money!

[BrianK 58]

For closure's sake;

 

I called Toro 2 more times. Two different people. I did actually call 2 different dealers. One wouldn't answer. The other, as suspected, didn't know. In fact he said he has NO info on the filter at all and doesn't get any spec sheets from toro. He called me back a couple hours later, took the time to search online, toros site and just regular ole google, came up with nothing but "gurus online in the forums going to the Napa/Wix filter" haha. 

 

The second time I called toro I got specific with them, and requested to talk with an engineer, or email, or something...ANYTHING. I'm in their system 3 times now, name and number with a case file and what really grinds my gears is she recommended I call a different dealer. Really? She said they're not "set up to patch people through to engineers, nor do they have the engineers info...no extension or anything. 😡

 

So that in and of itself is enough BS and smoke up my cheerio to make me switch to Napa Gold/Wix permanently. Customer service is big with me and if all you're going to do is give your customers numbers to service centers, you can go pound sand because you're not getting my money. Swapped the toro for a Napa Gold 1410/Wix 5140 (same exact filter, I spec'd both out) and cut open the toro.  Excuse my shavings, I was in a hurry and didn't care. 

 

Compared to a Wix that @squonk cut open a few years ago;  

I need to be fair here and say the Toro filter looks to be of somewhat ok quality. Coil spring on top, filter media is epoxied in place, and the filter is clamped at the seam instead of glued like a lot of brands. I don't know what the "flutes" are for in the bottom retaining ring. Having said that, I don't know if I care for the rubber/silicone gasket. I don't know why it's there...hell, NO ONE KNOWS. One thing I do know, however, is that some companies use this as a bypass "valve". There is no anti-drainback valve on these filters that's typically found on engine oil filters but in some cases they use it as one in the same...similar to this one...

 

Usually the bypass is metal and in the top of the filter but there's a ton of different designs and we're talking about hydraulic, so....Whatever is in the toro may not be traditional but no one definitively knows what it's for...and the pop tarts at toro don't even know what a bypass valve is. Regardless, I don't like it. Obviously people have been using the toro and have been fine...or have they? No way to tell for sure, too many variables. Oh, and I contacted Baldwin, gave them the the toro number and they replied with "we do not have a cross reference for that number and we cannot guarantee and exact match/replacement. Take that for what it's worth. Anyway, judge for yourselves but IMHO the differences favor the Wix. 

Edited March 24, 2017 by BrianK
Grammar

[squonk 38,844]

1 thing I also noticed is that the Wix/Napa filter weighed more than a Toro. These were brand new when weighed. This was also a few years ago both manufacturers may have made changes in the filters since.

[MalMac 1,328]

Check out Hastings filters also, they and Baldwin are the same company. They are more or less what you would call the top

of your line filters. They are a very old company and have been around forever. We use Hastings on all are big farm equipment. Now whether they are still made here in the States I do not know. I always go under the assumption that we don't make anything here anymore. They are a top notch filter though.