1972 kohler 10 suddenly needs choke to run

[ohiofarmer 3,157]

 I guess I need a push in the right direction. The engine starts and idles just as it always has, but after a time mowing, the tractor acted like it was not getting enough fuel. I changed the fuel filter because it looked pretty ugly inside. Even after changing. I had to run it on about 75% choke to finish mowing.  A troubleshooting tree would be much appreciated from the experienced guys on this forum. i am guessing that a little piece of dirt may be in the carbs, but need to do the easy stuff first.

 

 I have had the machine for about 30 hours on the engine and it has run very well so far.

[tunahead72 2,340]

A few easy things to check, all fuel-related because that's my best guess right now...

 

Unscrew the main fuel needle completely and make sure it's really clean.  Spray it with a little carb cleaner and wipe it down with a clean rag.  If there are any holes along the shaft, make sure they're all clear, you can poke a tiny wire through them or use a single bristle from a wire brush.

 

Unscrew the bolt on the bottom of the carb bowl and remove the bowl, make sure there's no junk inside, and clean it thoroughly.

 

And finally, when the engine starts acting up, try loosening the cap on the fuel tank and see if runs better.

 

[daveoman1966 3,610]

I have had the same issue with my Bronco 14.  Solution:... take  the carb off and THOROUGHLY clean it.  In doing that, put in a new needle - seat valve.  You can buy a Stens kit for under $10 bux or Kohler MAY have them.Kits include needle seat valve, gaskets, etc.

Edited July 26, 2016 by daveoman1966

[953 nut 51,657]

I think @tunahead72 nailed it with his last suggestion. The problem as described is time related and fuel related. If the fuel cap vent is not working properly a vacuum will be developed in the fuel tank as the level goes down, after a while the pump can't overcome the vacuum and deliver enough fuel.     A fouled carburetor issue wouldn't be time related.

[russellmc301 600]

thanks i have a 1276 that thats the problem also.

[ohiofarmer 3,157]

 I am fairly certain that the fuel cap is not the issue in that fuel leaks a bit and it is has been apart and clean. It has been so hot that shop work is a torture even at night. I have a "luxury" section of the shop that has wood floors and is insulated and can be easily heated in the winter. It looks like it is time to upgrade with an air conditioner.

 

 Taking off a bowl these days means having a new bowl gasket at hand. You put a new one in and it swells in size as soon as the ethanol gas hits it and no way can you use it again.. I was able to resize one by putting it in a baggie with flour and sitting the baggie outside in the sun one day when the parts store was closed.

 

 i think you guys have me on the right track. It may be a bit, but I will keep you posted..

 

 As far as the time related issue, i should have stated that it happened after mowing for a time, but the problem has persisted even after it has cooled down and fuel was added. Plugged fuel caps are a very common problem with old motorcycles so I am familiar with that.

Edited July 26, 2016 by ohiofarmer

[rmaynard 14,893]

If choking helps, that means that you are running too lean. Check the throttle shaft. If it can be moved side to side, even a little bit, you are pulling air into the carb around the shaft. A new throttle shaft bushing kit might solve your problem.

[stevasaurus 22,229]

I would just like to ad...if your filter was that bad...there is a screen in your gas tank also that could be limiting the amount of gas that runs through the line.  I had the same thing happen, and it turned out to be a spider clogging the hole in the valve in the tank.    This machine also had set for some time, and it took a few weeks for the problem to surface. 

Edited July 26, 2016 by stevasaurus

[953 nut 51,657]

4 hours ago, ohiofarmer said:

ethanol gas

Do your wheel horse a big favor, put it on an ethanol free diet! Go to buyrealgas.com and locate a gas station near you that sells ethanol free gas. It costs a bit more but eliminates a bunch of problems in fuel system.

[ohiofarmer 3,157]

10 hours ago, 953 nut said:

Do your wheel horse a big favor, put it on an ethanol free diet! Go to buyrealgas.com and locate a gas station near you that sells ethanol free gas. It costs a bit more but eliminates a bunch of problems in fuel system.

 In Ohio, the only places listed are marinas and about a hundred miles away.

[tunahead72 2,340]

Try Pure-Gas.org, they list a lot more stations selling ethanol-free gas.  I see Schafer Oil in Russia, an unmanned station selling 90 octane unbranded, about 30 minutes from you.  There's also 95 Customs in Troy selling 110 and 116 octane Gulf, but those octane numbers seem excessive for lawn mowers and motorcycles.

 

You can also try StarTron enzyme fuel treatment.  I've been using it in all my small engines and my motorcycle for the last couple of years, and it seems to work.  I just started my bike a couple of weeks ago after it had been sitting for about 10 months, with about half a tank of gas with StarTron in it.  It would have started right up if I'd remembered to open the fuel valve.  Once I did that, and then charged the battery because I ran it down trying to start the engine with no fuel, it did start right up and has been running well since then.

[ohiofarmer 3,157]

I found the ethanol free station in Russia. About a dollar per gallon higher and i certainly will buy some to test it out and will certainly use it for the last of the season with StaBil added to it

 

After reading all of your suggestions, it looks advisable to examine the fuel shutoff valve first and then maybe the fuel pump second. That shutoff valve takes a sharp turn in a hurry and I did not see a filter present. I found a deal on an electro 12 and waiting for a call back that may or may not come..

[rmaynard 14,893]

I've got an ethanol-free station about 20 miles from me, and the price is about $1.00 higher as well, but it has been well worth my time and money to use the stuff.

[Lagersolut 613]

1 hour ago, rmaynard said:

I've got an ethanol-free station about 20 miles from me, and the price is about $1.00 higher as well, but it has been well worth my time and money to use the stuff.

 

You hitting that little tire shop north of Littlestown on RT 194 ?  I've never taken the trip there - Hakes in Dover PA is about 50 cents /gallon over the regular stations and he's selling a lot - he did have crabbers coming all the way from Baltimore and filling skid tanks with the stuff.

 

 

[ohiofarmer 3,157]

Well, the hunt is on. The guy texted me quite a few times and I guess he figured i was legit. He finally called me with the location. $250 for an electro 12 kohler with deck. Taking the trailer tomorrow.

 

 I really do not know much about the electro  I am not expecting it to run after sitting, but maybe i should at least take a battery and see if the motor turns over and the electric clutch works??

[rmaynard 14,893]

Sounds like a good plan. Always nice to drive it onto the trailer rather than push it.

[953 nut 51,657]

Ad a can of spray carburetor cleaner to your arsenal, may help getting it running.    

[rmaynard 14,893]

3 hours ago, Lagersolut said:

You hitting that little tire shop north of Littlestown on RT 194 ?

Yup, Breighner's is the place. Dover is a bit too far for me. However, when I go to Olde Tyme Days, I always go with empty gas cans and fill them at Hakes Store. Won't be at OTD's this year though.

[ohiofarmer 3,157]

I got the Tractor! It is a 1968 12 Horsepower with the woodgrain side decals. I guess the reason he priced it the way he did was that a Wheelhorse collector friend of his offered him 200 for it and the owner thought at least 250. I asked him if his friend goes to the big show in PA and he said yes.So possibly his friend is a member here? BTW, the tractor was North of Bellefountaine OH which turned out to be eighty miles away.

 

The good stuff would be how nice the deck metal still is. The deck is oily due to some hydraulic leaks, but the paint is 95% there with no rust bubbling at all. The tins on the tractor are very straight with no dents and just one grill bar is slightly pushed in.Just light patina rust with little or no pitting of the sheet metal. The OEM muffler is gone, but a substitute is there.No one has [obviously] worked on the motor or removed the sheet metal.I am pretty confident that this machine ran when parked just by talking to the guy. He had no issues with me taking my time and really looking it over. I really do not know how i will like the automatic transmission, but we will just have to wait and see.Tires are all up and holding air and the owner reported one front tire needed to be pumped up occasionally.

 

 The engine did not turn over with the key, so i suspect dirty switch contacts or solenoid failure... We bypassed all that and the starter turns it over just fine. There are obvious leaks to the rear wheels probably from the axle seals or oil accumulating in the toolbox at the rear. She needs a good de-greasing so i can figure things out a bit.My quick plan is just to hear it fire up a bit and that will happen by using jump wires to heat up the coil and also the starter motor and also using a slave tank to add fresh gas. Some penetrating oil or a bit of marvel mystery oil down the sparkplug hole while degreasing would not be a bad idea either.

 

 I should be able to do a few things before work in the morning, but it is gonna be hard to go to work tomorrow without hearing this Kohler run. WHA--- must resist----Must resist---

Edited July 29, 2016 by ohiofarmer

[pfrederi 17,147]

8 hours ago, ohiofarmer said:

I got the Tractor! It is a 1968 12 Horsepower with the woodgrain side decals. I guess the reason he priced it the way he did was that a Wheelhorse collector friend of his offered him 200 for it and the owner thought at least 250. I asked him if his friend goes to the big show in PA and he said yes.So possibly his friend is a member here? BTW, the tractor was North of Bellefountaine OH which turned out to be eighty miles away.

 

The good stuff would be how nice the deck metal still is. The deck is oily due to some hydraulic leaks, but the paint is 95% there with no rust bubbling at all. The tins on the tractor are very straight with no dents and just one grill bar is slightly pushed in.Just light patina rust with little or no pitting of the sheet metal. The OEM muffler is gone, but a substitute is there.No one has [obviously] worked on the motor or removed the sheet metal.I am pretty confident that this machine ran when parked just by talking to the guy. He had no issues with me taking my time and really looking it over. I really do not know how i will like the automatic transmission, but we will just have to wait and see.Tires are all up and holding air and the owner reported one front tire needed to be pumped up occasionally.

 

 The engine did not turn over with the key, so i suspect dirty switch contacts or solenoid failure... We bypassed all that and the starter turns it over just fine. There are obvious leaks to the rear wheels probably from the axle seals or oil accumulating in the toolbox at the rear. She needs a good de-greasing so i can figure things out a bit.My quick plan is just to hear it fire up a bit and that will happen by using jump wires to heat up the coil and also the starter motor and also using a slave tank to add fresh gas. Some penetrating oil or a bit of marvel mystery oil down the sparkplug hole while degreasing would not be a bad idea either.

 

 I should be able to do a few things before work in the morning, but it is gonna be hard to go to work tomorrow without hearing this Kohler run. WHA--- must resist----Must resist---

 

 

Electros came with different ignition systems.  If yours is a breakerless system you will fry it and it is expensive.

[ohiofarmer 3,157]

10 hours ago, pfrederi said:

 

 

Electros came with different ignition systems.  If yours is a breakerless system you will fry it and it is expensive.

 Thanks for the warning. The tractor is torn down with all the "tins" removed and cleaned up, so I will follow your advice and test the ignition key and solenoid instead of jumping directly to the coil. I have even removed the fuel tank for easy access to the dash switches, so they can all be cleaned up and tested. Getting in too big a hurry can be costly

10 hours ago, pfrederi said:

 

 

Electros came with different ignition systems.  If yours is a breakerless system you will fry it and it is expensive.

 

[ohiofarmer 3,157]

 well, I got the original tractor to run without the choke. I removed the fuel tank and blew backwards through the fuel shut off, and then removed the carb bowl and it had very little dirt. It still ran as before. Then I turned the fuel setting screw out a quarter turn and then back in and that is all it took to fix the problem. I mowed until dark tonight and that Kohler 10 pulled like a boss..I was mowing grass a little long that was full of Dutch clover.

 

 

 Well, at least now I know that the fuel system is clean even though i did a lot of extra work.

[moe1965 718]

Boat fuel is ethanol free I use it in all my two stroke engines as well

[rjcap 13]

On July 26, 2016 at 0:43 AM, tunahead72 said:

A few easy things to check, all fuel-related because that's my best guess right now...

 

Unscrew the main fuel needle completely and make sure it's really clean.  Spray it with a little carb cleaner and wipe it down with a clean rag.  If there are any holes along the shaft, make sure they're all clear, you can poke a tiny wire through them or use a single bristle from a wire brush.

 

Unscrew the bolt on the bottom of the carb bowl and remove the bowl, make sure there's no junk inside, and clean it thoroughly.

 

And finally, when the engine starts acting up, try loosening the cap on the fuel tank and see if runs better.

 

I was having the very same trouble with my C-125 that ohiofarmer was having with his machine. The only thing I did in addition to your suggestions was to replace the kohler air filter. I was negligent in replacing it to begin with. Removed the main needle and cleaned it, sprayed a little carb cleaner down the hole too. Loosened the gas cap a bit and was able to cut the 3 acre river lot with no more difficulty.  I will tighten the gas cap on the next cut to see if that is really an issue or not.

[Tonyp 278]

On 7/26/2016 at 0:21 PM, 953 nut said:

Do your wheel horse a big favor, put it on an ethanol free diet! Go to buyrealgas.com and locate a gas station near you that sells ethanol free gas. It costs a bit more but eliminates a bunch of problems in fuel system.

Amen..

 

IF you can't buy ethanol free gas put the additive in your storage container.  Many   have been fighting this for a very long time, GAS is an  issue and it may have caused some carb issues as mentioned above, maybe even fatal carb damage.

 

I use the additives and have been failure  free from gas issues with TWO machines  for this entire season.

 

 Inconsistent gas blend or gas starved is what causes the "suddenly it doesn't run well " to happen. My guess, go down the " inconsistent gas blend"  road first.  ETHANOL ! 

Edited September 26, 2016 by Tonyp