Jump to content
formariz

c-125 8 speed traction problems

Recommended Posts

formariz

So I was all eager to try my C-125 with a newly acquired blower on today's snow, but did not work out. I am having traction issues. Perhaps because of all the weight up front? It will only barely make it up to the middle of my steep driveway and with difficulty. Wheels spin even with the spiked chains. In low setting same thing. Keeps switching traction from side to side and it just wont go. No belt slipping, no engine bogging down, it just does not get traction.

 

Blower was a bit disappointing also. Does not throw very far at all.

Any suggestions greatly appreciated.

 

Its here parked next to the Electro 12 but it really does not deserve to be next to it. It was just a big boat anchor today.

 

IMG_0043.JPG.5cba4458fa908db0b3b0ed121c2

IMG_0045.JPG.9cc1125d3b77a41da8f8c54da50IMG_0043.JPG.bb3388b5e9d4eb2fc300525cfd2IMG_0050.JPG.84cb4c89c356c01daae54aae57c

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 
953 nut

:twocents-02cents:  If you hang a hundred pounds on the back end and move the blower drive belt to the larger PTO pulley you may have better luck.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 
Eric C

953 is right.

You have a good start with the wheel weights. But more weight is needed on the rear. Have someone over 100 lbs stand on the rear hitch and try the hill again. My bet is it will track right up with no problem. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 
sorekiwi

I havent used my blower for a few years, but last time I did I was running 2 link chains on the rear with 30lb wheel weights on each wheel.  In addition I had 30 lbs of weight hanging off the back of the transmission.  At one stage I had 80lbs hanging out the back - great traction, but the front end wouldnt steer.  I see that you have front weights, that would probably help.  I also had turf tires up front, tri ribs would have helped immensely.

 

Rear weight (80 lbs):

IMG_3544.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 
Callen

I would give it a try without the front weights. They are not doing anything for you with the blower on the front too.

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 
formariz
58 minutes ago, 953 nut said:

:twocents-02cents:  If you hang a hundred pounds on the back end and move the blower drive belt to the larger PTO pulley you may have better luck.

 

OK, I did not know about the larger pulley. That is going to make auger turn faster correct? That thing is already a bit scary to me.

49 minutes ago, Eric C said:

953 is right.

You have a good start with the wheel weights. But more weight is needed on the rear. Have someone over 100 lbs stand on the rear hitch and try the hill again. My bet is it will track right up with no problem. 

 

I also pretty much emptied rear tires. That made it a bit better. I will then try some more weight in the back.

5 minutes ago, Callen said:

I would give it a try without the front weights. They are not doing anything for you with the blower on the front too.

 

That may be a good idea. I noticed also that the way they stick out they are constantly buried in snow sing they stick out past blower sides. They are always creating drag.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 
JERSEYHAWG /  Glenn

My very first snowblower was just like that. It was a beast. How's your belt? Also, if the snow is heavy / wet. It will disappoint you. 

Sorry, that's just how it is. 

 

Glenn

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 
doc724

While the bigger pulley will make your blower go faster, you will have belt misalignment and shorten the life of the belt.  The idea is to have the engine PTO pulley and the blower pulley be the same size.  The blowers will work like gangbusters but they are designed to run at full engine throttle.   I recently repaired my tall chute 42 inch blower and calculated the auger RPM's based upon the sprocket ratios and assuming the engine runs at 3600 rpm (governed), the auger is spinning at over 1250 rpms.  Also, in addition to the added rear weight, two link chains (v. the 4 link you have) should be an improvement.

 

Also, just like cutting tall grass, going up hill, don't take a full bite of the snow.

 

Finally, buy some Snow Jet and spray it on the auger.  There are home remedies for Snow Jet that others use as well

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 
formariz

Thank you everyone for the suggestions.Took another look at it today after reading suggestions, and drive pulley on blower is the same size as PTO pulley. I see also the if I were to change location of pulley on PTO it would definitely be way out of alignment, even possibly hit the hood on this tractor. So my first attempt is going to be  to try and place a substantial amount weight on the back of it and see how it goes. Most likely I will also order a set of two link chains.

Just wondering, how much weight is safe to have bearing on to the bottom of the transmission case? All the pressure will be on an area less than 3 square inches.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 
sorekiwi
4 hours ago, formariz said:

Just wondering, how much weight is safe to have bearing on to the bottom of the transmission case? All the pressure will be on an area less than 3 square inches.

 

I am thinking you woud probably be safe to 100 lbs or so, I have dragged a little trailer around my yard full of top soil, I am guessing the tongue weight of that was around 100 lbs.

 

The weight bracket I made was actually part of an old plow frame that I mounted on the rear attachamatic.:

 

IMG_3547.jpg

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 
squonk

Fill the rear tires with rimguard, windshield washer fluid or RVantifreeze

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 
formariz

So  I took step 1 and added weight to the rear. Luckily I had on the back of it one of those custom trailer hitches, so all I had to do was remove ball and install a threaded rod all the way to bottom part of hitch so all of the weight wouldn't be on the top tongue and had weights which I also had( it pays to be a bit of a hoarder). It stocks away from tractor enough to be able to add 12"+ diameter weights and clear rear fender. I now have 83LBS on the hitch. Gave it a short test and I already notice a big difference. A bit late today so tomorrow I will take it for a tougher test.

IMG_0051.JPG

IMG_0058.JPG

IMG_0059.JPG

IMG_0060.JPG

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 
C-85

I had traction problems and I'm only using a plow, so hope you can add more rear weight, it will help:)

 

C-85

051.jpg

070.jpg

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 
formariz
1 minute ago, C-85 said:

I had traction problems and I'm only using a plow, so hope you can add more rear weight, it will help:)

How much weight do you have back there? Did you fabricate that hitch? Awesome.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 
wallfish

Leave the front weights on. Just check the thousand other threads about not being able to steer in the snow and everybody recommends weight added to the front tires

Wrap # 40 roller chain around them if you are still having steering problems

Add some more weight to the rear and 2 link chains.

Go faster using the single stage blower, the more you load it, the better it will work. It will take a little getting used to for the right speed for each condition but the engine should strain just a little bit.

It's also possible the PTO bell and clutch plate are slipping. I used a belt sander to make the bell flat and roughen the contact surface a little and then used a small sanding block for the clutch plate. It was obvious when the bell was removed that about 1/4 of the contact area was actually touching each other.

 

:twocents-02cents:

 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 
doc724

Wallfish may be onto something re:  the PTO slipping.  In years past, I painted a narrow white line along the axis of the PTO bell so I could tell if it was spinning properly (think of the pix you have seen of jet engines where they paint the center hub of the turbine blades)

 

Also, be very cautious of adding weight onto the rear hitch.  The weight is supported by the rod which goes through the hitch and transaxle, but the bending moment of the weight hanging off the back is counteracted by the tiny area where the hitch contacts the underside of the transaxle.  The force per unit area on that small area (actually a line contact) is pretty high.  If the load (weight) is a static load (not moving) which is mostly the case you are probably ok.  However if the load is dynamic (moving, like when you hit a bump) the impact load is 2.5x the static load. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 
formariz
4 hours ago, wallfish said:

It's also possible the PTO bell and clutch plate are slipping. I used a belt sander to make the bell flat and roughen the contact surface a little and then used a small sanding block for the clutch plate. It was obvious when the bell was removed that about 1/4 of the contact area was actually touching each other.

 

It does not seem to me that anything is slipping but could you elaborate on this a little more ? This is actually the only time I am using this type of PTO so I am a bit new to it. The others I use are electric PTOs and never used with a blower.

 

So with added weight traction is 75% better but still needs more weight. I am also going to see what I can do to distribute pressure under transmission case better using this same set up.

I definitely need to keep weights in front to aid steering.

 

Would blower work better without side extensions? It seems to me that they create a little more drag and perhaps contribute to steering problems when one side is buried in snow. On the other hand no actual path would be created ahead of front wheels.

 

Looking closely at auger I see that the areas that actually push snow into the chute ( 4 narrow channels) have a distance of about 3/4" from housing.If they were closer it probably would direct more snow towards that area. I have a substantial amount of 1/2" thick rubber here.Perhaps fit some pieces into channels so its almost touching  blower housing?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 
doc724

The 3/4 inch spacing is normal (I just checked)

 

wrt Wallfish's comment; the PTO bell is the part that spins when you engage the PTO.  The clutch plate is fixed and is mounted to the engine.  The clutch is always turning when the engine runs.  The clutch face is about (from memory) 6 inches in diameter and the friction material is about 1-1.25 inches wide.  If one of the parts is warped or the bell is not moving perpendicular to the clutch facing when the PTO is engaged, you will not get full contact with the clutch material and you cannot transmit much torque.  If the PTO is not properly adjusted and is not pushing with enough force on the clutch plate (even if you have full face contact), you cannot transmit much torque.  If the clutch friction material is contaminated with grease or oil, slippage will occur.

 

If you do not know how to adjust the PTO, download a manual for your tractor from the manuals section and it will show you how to do it.  Clutch facings wear over time and since the C125 is over 35 years old, there may not be much clutch facing left.

 

One last thing to check, make sure your blower spins easily when the belt to the PTO is NOT installed.  You should be able to spin it with your hands.  If you cannot spin it (or it is REALLY difficult), you may have some worn out parts that may be binding.  If it spins too easily, check for a broken or missing key in the drive pulley on the blower or in the drive sprocket (left end of the jack shaft under the black plastic protector)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 
shallowwatersailor

Get a 2" receiver hitch from one of our members in the vendor section and you can hang suitcase weights on the rear.DSCN3305.thumb.JPG.cb121e4cad362d1c51886

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 
wallfish

Might as well grease the PTO bearing too while your in there

 

pto.JPG.9a2ea1efe1c8aec69b42500fe9f2626c

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×
×
  • Create New...