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redsquarebob

wheel horse parting opinion

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boovuc

In a capitalistic marketplace, there is a need right now for entrepreneurs to find various makes of garden tractors and part them out. It's because there is a need for it. A market for parts of older USA built equipment.

If a particular make of tractor becomes scarce or rare, then the entrepreneur has to weigh the difference between parting one out or selling as a whole machine.

 

I would not be so down on these business-people that are merely catering to our needs. If we wouldn't collect tractors, they wouldn't have a market to sell parts. We need each other and there isn't a soul on here that won't need a part from a parted out tractor at some point in their hobby. (I bought two Onan P220 heads from Joe this week! Thank you, Joe)!

If you take a part off your own shelf from a parts tractor you had, your using a donor part.

It doesn't make any difference if the tractor being parted out had 200 hours on it or 2000. If it is rusted or beautiful. If we didn't need parts, they wouldn't be doing what they are doing. Ever wonder how many scrappers took thousands of dollars of garden tractors to bone yards for the price of just the metal? Those tractors simply were sorted and scrapped.

A friend of mine back in 2011 saw a tractor on a trailer of scrap metal and told me about it. I got it for free and actually got it to run though it used a little oil! (OK....it used a lot of oil)!

I took parts from it and then gave it to another fellow Redsquare member to do what he pleased. You can't save them all and if you try, you will go broke and that is NOT an exaggeration. 

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tractorhogg

Well this comes up every few years, and if you notice under my name, I've been here a long time, I'm member 85 out of what 11,000 members, so I'm going to say I part tractors out, and make money doing it, if I didn't make money I sure as heck would not put up with the BS I get selling parts, for every 10 parts request I get I might sell 5 parts, I stock over 100 tractors and literally thousands of parts, and have sold to MANY MANY members here.

   To the original poster, you have to part out nice machines to get good parts, take that old worn out junker, and part it out, what will you get old worn out parts, kinda hard to sell a junk part, do I part out clean ready to use tractors, NO, but I also don't give them away, why would I sell a running machine for less than $300-400 that I can part out for $600+

   Do I part out rare or hard to find models ? NO, I try not to part out any round hoods, but it happens, try to restore a tractor that needs parts with out a used parts supplier, many parts are NLA from Toro,  and if they are available they are not cheap, buying good used parts KEEPS this hobby alive, with used parts the hobby would be hard to do looking at you broken tractor that you can't get parts for.  

Kelly, I still don't think the OP was talking about sellers quite like you. I know what he knows, that not even half of these parts on these old tractors sees the market place, the frames, and much of the rest of the tractor is sold as pure scrap iron, they cant keep everything, only the quick selling sought after parts are kept, much of the steering and front end parts are sold as scrap as well. They keep a few parts on hand but when they start getting dozens of front axles linkages, bolts, etc, they aren't saved, their scraped. I see a real need for parts tractors and your business, but even some of the biggest eBay sellers admit they could care less if they scrapped every tractor out there as long as there was one person left to buy the parts. They don't care about the hobby or the tractors, they care about MONEY. I think the OP is ranting about the greed and lack of concern with the hobby more than the parting of tractors in general. I asked about shipping from one of the big ebay sellers, he said I was banned from buying because I implied he didn't know how to ship. All I wanted to know if he did terminal to terminal shipping with Fedex. I was looking for a Massey MF-14 steering column using my wife's computer since I WAS BANNED and I saw a steering column that said fits Massey 10, 12 and 14, well it cant fit a 14 or it cant fit the 10 or 12 so I emailed and asked for a part number and told him that while most parts are the same on the 10s and 12s the 14 doesn't share any part numbers, well maybe nuts and bolts, I was banned again. The same seller posted in open forum on MTF that the reason prices were high was because of the collector, and they were the problem not him, well maybe so. I'm not against anyone making a buck, but I'm not a fan and will not buy from certain sellers and I don't have too. I have a philosophy about collecting, NEVER EVER buy a tractor that is not worthy of restoring or hasn't been cared for, it cost a fortune to fix up a junker, sink your initial investment in a good tractor. There are scrap tractors and restore-able tractors, Some may buy parts tractors for parts, good deal, but unless its a super rare tractor, pass on the rust buckets and junkers, they need to see the scrap pile and it will dry up the used parts market place, at least a little, because few people will buy junk or broken parts, and that has happened to me several times when the pictures didn't show that the part was not even serviceable. It is what is, I don't care what any seller does, that is entirely his business. I have plenty of tractors I bought from either the original owners or their relatives, mostly I buy implements online or from scrapers. I'm a 58 year old Army Vet and a full time college student living on less than 15,000 a year, sometimes we don't eat three meals a day and some months the heat isn't on, but I wouldn't trade my life's for anyone else's. My biggest dream is to pass on my collection intact to someone that will keep them for future generations to appreciate. I really appreciate the collectors and the people who sell parts that appreciate these tractors, In my opinion Red Square is  home to those people. Thanks to everyone here that does his or her part in the hobby, it really does take all of us. On a final note, I mean no disrespect to anyone, not even the seller that banned me, that is his prerogative and allows me to forge business associations with others and sometimes make new friends.

Edited by tractorhogg

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Ken B

I restored this one completely, I'm pretty certain anyone that saw it knows I did it right. I had at least a week into just repairing holes in the hood and the body work on the hood. Quality paint was used and countless hrs. went into wet sanding and buffing. I sold it about a yr. ago for 850 bucks, pretty reasonable IMO. Boy was I surprised to find it being parted out right in our very own classifieds and on Ebay. Who does that to a beautiful and rare 603? Yeah, I know who but we aren't going there... . I bought it from a scrapper, in a few days it was headed to meet its maker. I thought I saved it...  I doubt I even broke even when I sold it, That's not really what its all about to me.. Kelly is #1 in my book, as for the other guy the OP might be talking about.. I guess at the end of the day it is helping to pay his bills.

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tractorhogg

I restored this one completely, I'm pretty certain anyone that saw it knows I did it right. I had at least a week into just repairing holes in the hood and the body work on the hood. Quality paint was used and countless hrs. went into wet sanding and buffing. I sold it about a yr. ago for 850 bucks, pretty reasonable IMO. Boy was I surprised to find it being parted out right in our very own classifieds and on Ebay. Who does that to a beautiful and rare 603? Yeah, I know who but we aren't going there... . I bought it from a scrapper, in a few days it was headed to meet its maker. I thought I saved it...  I doubt I even broke even when I sold it, That's not really what its all about to me.. Kelly is #1 in my book, as for the other guy the OP might be talking about.. I guess at the end of the day it is helping to pay his bills.

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It didn't look that bad Ken, I've seen way, way worse, mostly when someone starts "re-engineering" them with hacksaws and torches. You did a wonderful job and it hurts like heck to think of it being parted out.

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steve k

In case anyone is wondering about the OP silence,   it is because he had to take his son (scotty) to the ER last evening. Ended up needing his appendix removed.   I believe all went well.

Steve

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boovuc

Glad to hear all is OK! Thanks for the update, Steve!

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tractorhogg

In case anyone is wondering about the OP silence,   it is because he had to take his son (scotty) to the ER last evening. Ended up needing his appendix removed.   I believe all went well.

Steve

Wow, prayers are sent for a speedy and full recovery.That is so scary.

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N3PUY

In my opinion some people are in this hobby to own a Wheel Horse or 2 ... find one neglected old horse and bring it back to life ... enjoy it.    And then sell a Horse or two to support his hobby.  That's what I do.     And then there are those in the hobby that buy, part-out even a running tractor, to make a living.  To me that is not a hobby .... it's a business.   And there are some in the hobby that own and enjoy their Wheel Horses but know what isn't savable and will part it out to help others in the hobby.   :twocents-02cents: 

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papaglide

Wow, I am truly impressed! This topic hasn't exploded into a fireball of hate and ill will. The thread actually seems like a very cordial discussion. Maybe we are all finally reaching an understanding that sometimes things are done so that others may benefit: no matter what the intention or method.

After proof reading my post it seems that I can't quite put my exact thoughts into words but hopefully everyone gets the gist of it.

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N3PUY

For the OP .... I hope this brightens your day   :)

 

 

414-8 as purchased for $100.   Not much to look at.  Rust and bad vibration.

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414-8  as sold.

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416-8 as purchased for $45.   Bad starter and broken frame.

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416-8  now my main mower.

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520HC as purchased for $100.  Not running.

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520HC sold for $800.  Didn't have to "part-out" to make a buck.

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Commando 800.  Blown engine.  Going in for scrap.  Paid $75.

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Commando 800 .... well ..... it's still in one piece!

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WorkHorse ... Paid $100.   Really rusty.  Not running.  Garbage????

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WorkHorse  Sold for $450.   Made another $ and saved a horse.

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So have faith.   They don't all get scraped or parted-out.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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tractorhogg

Wow, I am truly impressed! This topic hasn't exploded into a fireball of hate and ill will. The thread actually seems like a very cordial discussion. Maybe we are all finally reaching an understanding that sometimes things are done so that others may benefit: no matter what the intention or method.

After proof reading my post it seems that I can't quite put my exact thoughts into words but hopefully everyone gets the gist of it.

It is what I have always liked about this forum. BTW, how often does a guy from New York State get razzed about being a Canadian Hockey fan. lol at least you aren't that other team up there, lol. In all fairness a guy from Oklahoma knows as much about hockey as a screen door installer for submarines

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steve k

N3PUY   could yopu post some pics or PM them of the front end on your custom Commando 800?

 

Not sure what has been done but I like it. :)

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tractorhogg

N3PUY   could yopu post some pics or PM them of the front end on your custom Commando 800?

 

Not sure what has been done but I like it. :)

I used to see this conversion done on old hot rods that had a high front suspension, think they called it a dropped or dropped nose conversion

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Cutlas3391

 

If there not orginal or something seized on them or there even hacked up i will usually part them out. Otherwise if there orginal and un harmed i will leave them be. 

Edited by Cutlas3391
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Tim

it's really pretty simple, a lot of parts are NLA from Toro

so we have choices, throw them away or use/ buy parts from donor tractors.

one donor can "save" multiple others, hopefully the donor has too many issues to make workable.

The sticking point in my opinion is people who take a very functional tractor that they could sell for say $300-400, and part it out for a lot more $$$.

I don't agree with it, or do it, but it not my choice what others do with their property.

Most people who sell a lot on in the classifieds are doing it to help others on the board (and make something to cover their addiction).

There are a couple who do it strictly for the money- to those I will not buy what they are selling.

my opinion,...

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Wheel Horse Collector

I am defiantly against parting them out. I personally know a couple of guys that said the most money they have made was when they parted out a wheel horse and sold the parts. It makes me mad when they part out tractors that only need a couple parts to get it running again. Its getting harder for me to find whole running tractors around here. Once you part them out they are

GONE FOREVER.

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Tim

Kelly

I always considered you one of the people I talked about when I said;

"most people who sell a lot on in the classifieds are doing it to help others on the board"

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ericj

i have a 1990 416-H that i bought as a non running tractor. sheet metal in decent shape so i swapped another 16 hp onan over onto it fixed a lot of small things on it and clean a lot of dirt and grease of of it. been thinking about selling it but not sure if somebody will pay me what the motor is worth by itself. although just my luck the last time i had it running it started to smoke more then i feel comfortable with and haven't had time to check it out any more though. so that will determine what i do with it. but i see what people get for just a motor and not sure i can get that for the tractor. so i understand why people part out sometimes. i have another 416-H I call my old ugly tractor that has been used and abused real bad but runs good so eventually i will swap the good running motor over on to the nicer tractor and part out old ugly, but it has so much character  that i kind of hate to do it. i just read Kelley's reply and agree and was the point i was trying to make.j  

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tractorhogg

i have a 1990 416-H that i bought as a non running tractor. sheet metal in decent shape so i swapped another 16 hp onan over onto it fixed a lot of small things on it and clean a lot of dirt and grease of of it. been thinking about selling it but not sure if somebody will pay me what the motor is worth by itself. although just my luck the last time i had it running it started to smoke more then i feel comfortable with and haven't had time to check it out any more though. so that will determine what i do with it. but i see what people get for just a motor and not sure i can get that for the tractor. so i understand why people part out sometimes. i have another 416-H I call my old ugly tractor that has been used and abused real bad but runs good so eventually i will swap the good running motor over on to the nicer tractor and part out old ugly, but it has so much character  that i kind of hate to do it. i just read Kelley's reply and agree and was the point i was trying to make.j  

I think most of us are on the same page Eric and I think much of the concern is for the older pre1975-80 stuff, it seems they may have made more tractors after Toro bought them, but I could be wrong

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Kelly

Well here is a SMALL look at what is here, most are pre 77 I count about 24 tractors in this pic, there are near 100 here, Yup I part them out. 

  And I do it for $$, yes I like these tractors if I didn't I would not have 20 or so in my personal collection, but they are JUST garden tractors, yes some are rare/hard to find and many should be saved, the rest are common run of the mill tractors, they made thousands of them,  and yes a 855 was only made in 1965, but guess what the 856 was the very same tractor with a different ID tag. and for the 857 oh wait that one had new style decals, still  same tractor, I see the RARE only made one year on ebay all the time, what a crock.

 

  Parts machines and parts, getting ready for spring cleaning, some will stay others will get the remaining good parts removed and junked.

 

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Just a few of my personal collection, and yes some were going to be junked but saved them. but I have a nice supply of used parts

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953 nut

  :text-goodpost:   A few years back I bought a 953 basket case from a fellow in Lisle, NY (your home town). If it weren't for parts I was able to buy from Joe and Kelly it would not have been possible to complete it. This isn't a pristine 100 point restoration, that would have required a lot more parts.

 

This forum is great because we can have a civil disagreement, but continue to love our  :wh: and one another, warts and all!

 

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redsquarebob

Here is what im talking about. Im not talking about parting out machines that are too far gone. there are many good parts on the d 180 i could show you a ton more tractors like the 520h being parted out and most body parts are easley fixed by sanding and re painting i just cant see parting out good tractors for fenders and hoods i realize they buy them and can do what they want but at the rate they are junking these there will not be any left for future collectors

 

From the same seller.

 

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Wheel%20Horse%20520H_zpsdzqcif6p.jpg

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tractorhogg

Here is what im talking about. Im not talking about parting out machines that are too far gone. there are many good parts on the d 180 i could show you a ton more tractors like the 520h being parted out and most body parts are easley fixed by sanding and re painting i just cant see parting out good tractors for fenders and hoods i realize they buy them and can do what they want but at the rate they are junking these there will not be any left for future collectors

 

From the same seller.

 

Wheel%20Horse%20D-180_zpskeuaujjt.jpg

 

 

Wheel%20Horse%20520H_zpsdzqcif6p.jpg

I agree, but as one big scrapper did say, "if it wasn't for so many "collectors/restorers" buying those hoods and parts and paying crazy money (more than a whole parts tractor) for those parts, there wouldn't be big scrappers". It's us that fuels the business. I've seen collectors beat each other up on eBay auctions for parts. once two guys went over 300.00 for a set of Bolens wheel weights, now you cant touch them for less than 150, they used to be 75-100, same with Massey, CASE, and Wheel Horse weights, most are hitting closer to 300.00 anymore due to auctions. Here's the deal about auctions, if you wait for a part after a brutal auction, the next one wont generate much interest or generally bring as much, bidders are gone, don't know why.

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can whlvr

I like guys parting out tractors,it saves the older tractors that a lot of parts arnt available,and its a free country for entreprnuers,its business,im sure lots of us have jobs that others don't agree with,miners,repo guys,you get the idea.

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