Keith of kent 41 #1 Posted March 3, 2015 (edited) Hi I need to replace the lower steering shaft on my 72 C120 Raider 12. Am I right in thinking that I need to remove the motor in order to do this please? Also the carb is a bit worn out and I have a Kohler 10hp from a Raider 12 with a carb that appears to be much less worn. Is it a straight swop or are the jets different. I've looked at some Kohler charts and they appear to be the same. Edited March 3, 2015 by Keith of kent 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rmaynard 14,804 #2 Posted March 3, 2015 The 10 and 12 HP share the same carburetor. The lower steering shaft should be able to be removed without removing the engine. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
meadowfield 2,545 #3 Posted March 3, 2015 you can do it, might be easier to drop the axle to get to the bolts thats all Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Keith of kent 41 #4 Posted March 3, 2015 (edited) Thanks for that, good news on the carb. The machine that I am robbing the parts from is a C101 which I have decided is not economically repairable. The engine (which is a Kohler 10hp) has a broken rod. The engine is already off and I have removed the front axle. Ther rear engine mount crossbar is still bolted to the frame,I can't see how to get the steering shaft out. That is not a problem to take off to remove the shaft, I just wondered if I can fit the bits to my Raider 12 without removing the engine, it would save a lot of work.Tomorrow I'll take a pic and post it up here. I have already checked that the steering shafts on the C120 and the C101 are the same part numbers Edited March 3, 2015 by Keith of kent Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kelly 1,028 #5 Posted March 3, 2015 I have found it easier to pull the engine instead of messing around for a hour then pulling the engine. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pacer 3,159 #6 Posted March 3, 2015 You'll have to do one or the other - the engine or the axle. You may can pull the big pin in the center of the axle and drop it enough to just get the steer shaft out ---- but, Kelly sure has a lot more experience in these type things... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
squonk 38,560 #7 Posted March 3, 2015 I'd pull that pin regardless and check it. I've seen dozens worn out and ready to break! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
chesbaycruiser 82 #8 Posted March 4, 2015 (edited) I just did this on my B-80 and Kelly is 100% correct. I had the wheels and front axle completely off and everything holding the shaft free and still couldn't get it out...there just wasn't enough clearance at either end because of the gear on one end and tie rod mounting plate at the other. After more time and frustration than was necessary I ended up unbolting the motor anyway. And in my book, bolting the motor back on was a LOT easier than getting the front axle back on and hooked up. Edited March 4, 2015 by chesbaycruiser Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kelly 1,028 #9 Posted March 4, 2015 And if you have a way to hang or hold the engine up, you don't have to unhook all the wires and cables, just raise it so you can get the shaft out, drive belt will be the only issue lifting it and some PTO parts 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Don1977 604 #10 Posted March 4, 2015 Is the fan gear worn that bad or just loose with the steering shaft. Shim washers and a new carter key can usually tighten the steering gears. The carter key gets worn and bent allowing the gears to move apart, also check the bushing in the steering bracket. The new carter key need to be the same size as the hole in the shaft. I'm not say don't change it if the other parts are better, but all the above is still required for a good fit with the newer steering parts. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Keith of kent 41 #11 Posted March 5, 2015 Thanks for all your replies which are a great help. Off with the engine it is then. The fan gear is very very worn and the one off the C101 is all in good condition. My axle is very sloppy, the pin is worn and possibly the axle beam as well, but the ones off the C101 are in good shape. Unfortunately although the previous owner of my C120 told me that the tractor has loads of grease points, he neglected to tell me that he'd never greased any of them. That was my impression once I started doing a bit of maintenance anyway. Don, Sorry I don't know what a Carter key is. Do you mean what is listed on the Wheelhorse parts list as a Cotter pin, looks like it holds the fan gear onto the lower shaft? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pacer 3,159 #12 Posted March 5, 2015 I think the proper description is "cotter pin" Its a very common pin located through out our tractors, from quite small to the rather large one in the steering shaft. Its shaped somewhat like an old hair pin used to look like. Its fed through the hole and one side of the 'pin' is bent over to keep it in place. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kelly 1,028 #13 Posted March 6, 2015 Cotter pin Cotter key Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
meadowfield 2,545 #14 Posted March 6, 2015 I managed on my C-101 to take the shaft out without moving the engine... Is that due to it sitting on blocks then? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Keith of kent 41 #15 Posted March 6, 2015 OK i've got it now. The top pic that Kelly put up is what we Brits call a split pin. What we mean by a cotter pin is typically used to hold the pedal cranks of a bicycle onto the crank. It is cylindrical with a wedge shape flat, hammered into the hole and secured with a nut. Although I haven't played with pedal bikes for many years so I expect its all changed I wonder what you guys call that! Anyway I looked it up on Wikipedia and this goes some way to explaining our cross -Atlantic confusion; Cotter pin From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia Cotter pin may refer to: In U.S. usage: Split pin, a metal fastener with two tines that are bent during installation used to fasten metal together, like with a staple or rivet Hairpin cotter pin, more commonly known as an "R-clip" Bowtie cotter pin, a vibration-proof type of R-clip that is shaped like a bowtie Circle cotter, a ring-shaped cotter pin In British usage: Cotter (pin), in mechanical engineering a pin or wedge passing through a hole to fix parts tightly together This usage difference is often a cause of confusion when companies of both countries work together. or when people discuss things on the Wheelhorse Forum Share this post Link to post Share on other sites