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dstriker

416 dead

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dstriker

Used the tractor the other day mowed about half the yard parked the tractor maybe two hours later went out to finish went to start it and it was turning over then I stopped to talk to my wife then tried to start again and nothing acts like there's no battery but I know the battery is good tried an ignition switch and still nothing tried jumping the starter and it was turning over but couldn't get it to start I don't particularly know a lot about these so I'm turning to the experts on here please help as I need to get it going snow is flying thanks

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dstriker

Additionally I have had this tractor a few years and the seat safety has not been hooked up and when I test the lights I get nothing

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nylyon

Is the deck still engaged?  Neutral?  If it's an automatic, move the motion control back and forth to insure it's set in neutral.  Engage and disengage the PTO.

 

Other than that, more information, which model 416 do you have, year?

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dstriker

It is a 416-8 and 1990 I believe I have tried engaging and disengaging the pto and made sure it was in neutral and it has an onan on it

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Martin

Check the fuses.

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dstriker

I found three of them and they were all good under the battery there is a spot for a fourth but there wasnt one in there

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WH nut

First thing first. Check your grounds, then make sure you have 12v at the ign. switch. Once that's verified we will continue

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dstriker

How do I check the v at the ignition switch I'm not very smart with this stuff but the last time I took a mower to a shop I got the tranny back in a bag so not to trusting in shops I have a multimeter

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WH nut

if you have a multimeter set it to 12vdc black lead on ground and red on battery post one switch. You need to go to manuals and download the wire diagram for your tractor.

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gwest_ca

1990 416-8 wiring diagram

 

Garry

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dstriker

I also noticed I have no spark when jumping the starter is that normal

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dstriker

i checked the volts and got nothing given i checked it right i believe i did

there is power to the coil and power to the starter

 

when we tried checking the power to the coil with just a probe light and had the key turned over there was a humming noice not sure where it was coming from sounded like under the battery also when this happened one of the lights came on on the dash

 

i had two guys helping and they were stumped as to why there is power everywhere but no spark and why we cant get anything from the key.

i also talked to a dealer that told me it sounded like a safety switch of some sort but said that shouldnt cause no spark but wouldnt say much else trying to get me to bring it in.

 

i also noticed on the top of the motor towards the battery there is a wire that is burnt it plugs into a plate on the motor along with a few other wires not positive what its to

Edited by dstriker

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Theroundhousernr

The plate is the rectifier if I am understanding you correctly. And whatever dealer told you safety switches should have nothing to do with spark...... well :snooty:

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dstriker

so possibly a safety switch????

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Theroundhousernr

  Is there twelve volts at the coil with the key in the run position? Also if wires are burnt there is surely an underlying issue that needs to be addressed , which will most likely lead you to your issue of no spark when you find it.

 

  With your lack of knowledge on this particular problem , it will be a tough one for you on this particular model. I am not to great at the internet diagnoses. If I was there with you in front of it , I would be able to find the problem in no time and be off and running. Follow the advice given carefully one step at a time and you will get there. :handgestures-thumbupright:  I will chime in when I can.

Edited by Theroundhousernr

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dstriker

ok thank you

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dstriker

and yes i got 12v from the coil with the key on

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ericj

do as told above you could check the 9 pin connector and possible the start relay which should be right behind the battery  on a 90 416 mounted the the tray metal that the battery sits on, good luck

 

 

 

 

 

eric j

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Theroundhousernr

so possibly a safety switch????

 

  There is a fuse right after the B+ terminal on the rectifier. Not sure where its located on the 416H off hand. Use your wiring diagram posted above. This is a main source of power going to the key switch. If everything is dead. Its a good place to start. Check how the seat switch was deleted. I just worked on a John Deere that someone just twisted the wires together and didn't ever take the time to wrap tape around them. If these wire contact the metal anywhere, You will surely melt stuff.

 

  Depending on where you tested for voltage at the starter , it will fool you. The heavy gauge wire that runs from the battery to the starter solenoid  , if you test there, it will give you 12 volts every time. You want to test the signal wire from the key switch to the solenoid. But if no power is present at the key switch, there will surely be no power anywhere else.

 

  If it was me , I would be concerned of what caused the melted wires.

 

 Two things

1- would be a dead short to ground

2- high resistance in a component such as a fuse holder causing an excess amp draw to much for the wire to handle.

 

Look for obvious signs of a short. I would start at the deleted seat switch. You can unhook the battery and test for a short to ground by using the ohm setting on your meter by back probing the wires. Be careful , things like lights are wired to ground and can cause an ohm reading of some degree and fool you. This will most likely only be successful if you are more experienced.

 

Check resistance through the fuse holders with a good fuse in place.

 

  That's all I got for now. Take pictures of the burnt wires also and post

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dstriker

ok will do.

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dstriker

here is the pic of burnt wire

post-10094-0-23130000-1416266121_thumb.j

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N3PUY

From the looks of the wire it is a poor connection. Replace that wire terminal. BUT that shouldn't have anything to do with starting.

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dstriker

ok i will try everything you guys have mentioned

 

if i cant figure this out does anybody know of anyone in north east ohio that knows what they are doing with these tractors that could help me in person or would work on it for me.

 

 

 thanks to everybody that has and will help i really appreciate it I am a younger guy but i absolutely love my  tractor i had a cub zero turn before this and it didnt compare to the preformance of this tractor i wish i had half the knowledge of half you guys on here

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