Faithful C-85 died.

[Butch 194]

This thing always fires up first crank. It did so today. I put the clutch in, shifted into reverse and it died. Won't crank. System is dead. With the key on the voltmeter doesn't even flicker. Headlights won't come on. I saw two fuses behind the dash and they looked good. Safety switches wouldn't have any bearing on the headlights or amp meter would they? Can it be something other than the ignition switch? I've never heard of an ignition switch

going bad. It's not the battery. It has a lot of juice or did have. Thanks.

[KyBlue 652]

Sounds like it's time to spend a bit of time investigating with a test light or Multimeter ... Work from the battery forward ... see where the juice stops. Since It's dead dead ... i wouldn't think it's a current issue ...

 

 

Keep us posted!

[squonk 38,902]

On my 'C's" the battery power wire goes right to a solenoid post. Another wire is on that same post and feeds the switch lights ect. I've had 2 of them get corrosion inside the wire crimp causing a dead tractor. good luck.

[Butch 194]

Sounds like it's time to spend a bit of time investigating with a test light or Multimeter ... Work from the battery forward ... see where the juice stops. Since It's dead dead ... i wouldn't think it's a current issue ...

 

 

Keep us posted!

Oh boy. Electrical trouble shooting!! I put this right up there with sheet rocking!! Thanks!!

On my 'C's" the battery power wire goes right to a solenoid post. Another wire is on that same post and feeds the switch lights ect. I've had 2 of them get corrosion inside the wire crimp causing a dead tractor. good luck.

I'll check it out. After all of these years I wonder how many connections have corrosion on them.

[Racinbob 10,276]

I'm not sure what year you have but on the 78-81 C's the B terminal on the switch should be hot all the time. It it fed from the hot side of the solenoid thru a fuse, thru the ammeter then to the switch. The lights are fed from the A terminal which is hot when the switch is in the run position. Since you have nothing it sounds like you lost power at the B terminal. The first thing to do is look at the wiring diagram and verify how it's wired. Since you have a voltmeter instead of a ammeter yours will be different but probably not much. An ammeter is wired in series and a voltmeter is parallel. After you figure out what you have do as 4Star said. It sounds like you lost power to the switch. Just because the fuses look good they still may not be. And yes, ignition switches do go bad but it likely could be a fuse or a connection.

Edited September 27, 2014 by Racinbob

[Racinbob 10,276]

What year is your C-85 Butch? I believe they came out in 83 and I wanted to look at the wiring changes.

Edited September 27, 2014 by Racinbob

[squonk 38,902]

If it has a fuse holder that is plastic and contains a glass fuse throw it away even if it's good and get a new modern fuse holder. Those old ones with the springs in them are big troublemakers! 

[Butch 194]

What year is your C-85 Butch? I believe they came out in 83 and I wanted to look at the wiring changes.

I'm no electrician or electrical Tech by any means. If where I lost power isn't far away

I should be able to find it. Thanks!

 

I don't know the year. No paperwork or decals and previous owner didn't know the year.

[Butch 194]

If it has a fuse holder that is plastic and contains a glass fuse throw it away even if it's good and get a new modern fuse holder. Those old ones with the springs in them are big troublemakers! 

Plastic holder with spade fuses.

[Butch 194]

I checked the accessories and it showed no break from ignition to the light switch. I would think the lights would come on. Now when I

test something I'm not testing voltage. I look for a break in the line. I have a buzzer that goes off on my meter if a connection is made.

I've made several tests. Here is the latest test I did on the ignition switch.

 

When you turn it on it makes contact with 4 contacts. When you go to start it it also uses 4 contacts of which 3 are also used on the run side.

 

When I made the tests I made sure that the 4 were all in contact with each other using my meter. On both tests the "R" contact didn't work. The

"R" contact is accessories. Would this be the problem of my tractor not starting and nothing else working?

Thanks.

[KyBlue 652]

Sounds like a job for Geno ... lol  I dont fix wiring issues .... I call the people i know who do wiring ... haha

[rmaynard 14,888]

You mentioned that you were not getting any lights. You also mentioned that the volt meter didn't flicker. Do you have a volt meter or an ammeter? According to the wiring diagram, you should have an ammeter. Check to make sure that the wires are securely connected to the ammeter. All power for your tractor with the exception of the actual starter motor, flows through the ammeter. Ammeter itself could be bad.

[Butch 194]

You mentioned that you were not getting any lights. You also mentioned that the volt meter didn't flicker. Do you have a volt meter or an ammeter? According to the wiring diagram, you should have an ammeter. Check to make sure that the wires are securely connected to the ammeter. All power for your tractor with the exception of the actual starter motor, flows through the ammeter. Ammeter itself could be bad.

I'll try and see what I get. Did you see my previous post about the ignition switch. Is that a possibility?

[Trouty56 565]

I hope this is right......

 

I - Ignition....carries 12 volts to the coil when the switch is in the start position

S - Start...carries 12 volts to the solenoid when the switch is in the run position

B - this terminal recieves 12 volts from the battery to start the engine and then supplies the battery with a charge after the engine starts........usually connected to the hot side of the solenoid

A - Accessory...carries 12 volts to the lights in the run position

R - Regulator.. .recieves the charge from the rectifier

 

I think the terminals on the back of the switch are like this

 

       __ I

__ S     __ A

__ B     __ R

[Butch 194]

__A          __R                     Manual says A is the Seat Switch and R is Accessories. The "R" contact is not contacting any other contact which tells me it's dead.

__I           __B

        __S

[Geno 1,928]

Start from the beginning.  Is there power to the B terminal?  There is a fuse and the amp gauge to check too. 

Edited September 29, 2014 by Geno

[Butch 194]

Start from the beginning.  Is there power to the B terminal?  There is a fuse and the amp gauge to check too. 

 

I'll check tomorrow. Your schematic is different than mine. The ignition markings are different and I don't have a push button starter.

[KyBlue 652]

I don't have a push button starter.

The drawing isn't showing a push button starter. They just didn't include a key in the switch. On the inset drawing of the ignition switch you can see a key sticking out.

[Trouty56 565]

__A          __R                     Manual says A is the Seat Switch and R is Accessories. The "R" contact is not contacting any other contact which tells me it's dead.

__I           __B

        __S

Sorry...wasn't sure of the layout....but I would focus on the B, S, and I....and then....A goes straight to the lights, R straight to the reg.....

 

Geno's schematic is good....

Edited September 29, 2014 by Trouty56

[Racinbob 10,276]

4Star is correct. That's a 3 position switch. Is there some way you can pinpoint what year tractor you have? The schematic shown is for the 78-81 C series. The C 85's were newer. Where did you get your schematic? Are you sure it's the correct one? Trying to troubleshoot from two different schematics can be bad news. You're saying the R terminal is never showing continuity with another terminal but that it's the accessories terminal. The 78-81 schematic has the terminals as per what Trouty56 posted. We just need to make sure we're all working off the same, and correct, schematic.  

[Racinbob 10,276]

Sorry...wasn't sure of the layout....but I would focus on the B, S, and I....and then....A goes straight to the lights, R straight to the reg.....

 

Geno's schematic is good....

Bob T, you were right, per the schematic. We just need to make sure that's correct for Butch's tractor. It sounds like it's not or he has the wrong schematic.

[Trouty56 565]

I was looking at an 83 schematic....downloaded from here....it does say A is seat switch and R for accesories....I guess the 2 could be interchanged but the switch cuts off the A during the start so the lights are not drawing starting power...

Edited September 29, 2014 by Trouty56

[Racinbob 10,276]

I think that's the correct one Bob and not the 78-81. But it also shows an ammeter and not a voltmeter like Butch said he had. I just feel that the correct schematic needs to be determined for certain so we're all on the same page.

Edited September 29, 2014 by Racinbob

[Trouty56 565]

I see why the A and R are reversed.....sorry butch....got sidetracked.....

Sent from where I am.......

[Butch 194]

The drawing isn't showing a push button starter. They just didn't include a key in the switch. On the inset drawing of the ignition switch you can see a key sticking out.

Duh! My bad!